skevinp Posted June 13, 2020 Share Posted June 13, 2020 1 minute ago, N.E. Brigand said: When the George Hopkins scandal broke, someone started this thread right here on DCP asking for links to corps' statements on that news and/or their sexual harrassment policies. In response, various respondents looked at every single DCI and DCA corps' website and social media feed and shared what they found, and after about a week, I responded by collating all that information into a list, noting the 30+ groups who had posted that sort of information and the 20+ groups who hadn't. Here's what I said about the latter: "And as far as I can tell, nothing has been said by the following corps, nor do they have harassment and/or whistleblower policies anywhere easy to find: Let me know if I missed something. And if you are affiliated with any of the above groups, on the first list [of corps with public statements or policies] or the second, maybe check in with them and make sure you feel what they're doing is good enough." - - - - - - - - - - (As it happens, I've worked with the McCarter before.) Asking for a statement in an issue that actually defines what people believe is not the same thing as demanding they express allegiance to a particular organization or movement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cappybara Posted June 13, 2020 Share Posted June 13, 2020 3 minutes ago, skevinp said: Voicing support of an ambiguous movement under duress is not speaking out on an issue. That is up to one’s opinion on how genuine these statements of support are. For numerous companies, it is not only statements that are being given. Promises for increases in black employment percentages to be equal to the black population percentages and donations to charities are among the things that companies are doing to show their support. Many business owners such as the CEO of CrossFit do not want to bend to this “duress” and choose to resign instead. That is their decision to make, whether they want to support the demands of the consumers or instead lose sponsors, deals, and business. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N.E. Brigand Posted June 13, 2020 Share Posted June 13, 2020 2 minutes ago, skevinp said: Asking for a statement in an issue that actually defines what people believe is not the same thing as demanding they express allegiance to a particular organization or movement. Here's the McCarter Theatre's own statement. Does it "express allegiance to a particular organization or movement" or does it "actually define what people believe"? - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - We stand on the side of justice and equality. We shout #BLACKLIVESMATTER with you. We fight for our values: equity, anti-racism, and anti-white supremacy. We acknowledge the work we have still to do and the privileges we hold. We support, we encourage, we love. #BLACK LIVES MATTER" - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - I'm not fond of the use of boldface, and I think "have still to do" is awkward and should be "still have to do". I also think it's silly to include hashtags in statements not posted to social media (and it's often silly there, too). Does anyone really disagree with the message? It all seems pretty obvious to me. And I don't read it as a pledge allegiance to anyone. Per Wikipedia: "The phrase 'Black Lives Matter' can refer to a Twitter hashtag, a slogan, a social movement, or a loose confederation of groups advocating for racial justice." - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Here's something interesting. The McCarter took heat for and subsequently apologized for sending out an email (last week?) with the subject line "Arts and Culture Matter", which a number of recipients interpreted as either belittling or trying to capitallize on the Black Lives Matter movement. The article about that includes a link to the list that Mike mentions. The company I work for is there -- and seems to have been found wanting. But I think that the list probably has been mostly unknown to the public. (I work in theater. I never heard of it before Mike mentioned it. But I'm not on social media, where maybe it is better known.) So at this point, the only people likely to be influenced by it are people who work in theater who might consider it when deciding whether or not to work for a particular organization. Mind you, there's almost no theater being produced right now because of the pandemic -- the article notes that the McCarter has gone through two phases of layoffs -- so by the time people can actually use this list, it's probably going to be way out of date anyway. So there's an argument to be made that it has too little influence rather than too much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N.E. Brigand Posted June 13, 2020 Share Posted June 13, 2020 41 minutes ago, skevinp said: Voicing support of an ambiguous movement under duress is not speaking out on an issue. "duress" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skevinp Posted June 13, 2020 Share Posted June 13, 2020 3 hours ago, MikeD said: I just read an article in today's paper, about Princeton's McCarter theater, that says a person involved in theater, producer Marie Cisco, is keeping a public Google document titled "Theaters Not Speaking Out" of all theaters around the country that make a 'statement' in support of the BLM movement. Personally, I find this very troubling in a Big Brother-ish sort of way. I wonder how many black people will lose their jobs as a result of their employers being “blacklisted” in this fashion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N.E. Brigand Posted June 13, 2020 Share Posted June 13, 2020 1 minute ago, skevinp said: I wonder how many black people will lose their jobs as a result of their employers being “blacklisted” in this fashion. In response to the specific list that Mike mentions? None, for the reasons I identified above. But are you arguing that no company should ever be boycotted on the basis of its policies, because there's a chance the company will lay off marginalized workers as a result? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skevinp Posted June 13, 2020 Share Posted June 13, 2020 (edited) 44 minutes ago, N.E. Brigand said: But are you arguing that no company should ever be boycotted on the basis of its policies, because there's a chance the company will lay off marginalized workers as a result? No, I’m suggesting that when you put a company out of business, the people who work there lose their jobs. And that a lot of those people are black. And that black lives matter. Edited June 13, 2020 by skevinp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N.E. Brigand Posted June 13, 2020 Share Posted June 13, 2020 16 minutes ago, skevinp said: No, I’m suggesting that when you put a company out of business, the people who work there lose their jobs. And that a lot of those people are black. And that black lives matter. But who is it that puts the company out of business? The protesters who want the company to improve? Or the managers who refuse to do so? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skevinp Posted June 13, 2020 Share Posted June 13, 2020 4 minutes ago, N.E. Brigand said: But who is it that puts the company out of business? The protesters who want the company to improve? Or the managers who refuse to do so? Who says the company didn’t improve? Who says they weren’t already a model of anti-racism? Who says the managers you refer to aren’t black? Who says the owners aren’t? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
E3D Posted June 13, 2020 Share Posted June 13, 2020 On 6/11/2020 at 5:30 PM, Poppycock said: Anyone else noticed that the people rioting, looting, and destroying businesses and cities are not wearing MAGA hats? I found that interesting 🤔 Yeah it is interesting. Also this "situation" in Seattle seems to be a dream world and just asking for trouble. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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