Vuitton Posted July 11, 2023 Share Posted July 11, 2023 (edited) 41 minutes ago, madisonsmiley said: This is a great book! @rmurrey74 What's funny about this? @rmurrey74 seems to support the administration. I don't know but he is confused by half of what I say, which is bizarre because I think I'm well-written. Disagreeing with me is always welcome, but the confused taps are strange. I haven't read that book, but I have read similar books. My God, I wouldn't be where I am in life if I wasn't constantly criticized (and applauded) throughout my career. Edited July 11, 2023 by Vuitton Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GREENBLUE Posted July 11, 2023 Share Posted July 11, 2023 (edited) 1 hour ago, Vuitton said: @scout9193 Yes, I remember. It was an email. I remember responding to it, in support of going co-ed, and hearing nothing back myself. Not even a thank you for participating. I do agree this was a move by a desperate leadership trying to increase their talent pool. I'm for inclusivity and diversity, so ultimately I supported the decision. But, I'm not naïve enough to not know the true reason behind the decision. It was about increasing the talent pool. I wish they would have just said that was the overriding reason. To me, it was a reactive decision on the part of the administration to try and up the level of talent rather than about inclusivity. I respect the decision to be more inclusive, but I don't respect the hiding of the true meaning behind the decision. Had they just said, "Look, we are struggling with talent. We need better talent. We have to open our program up to non-males" I would have respected that. I just hate the smoke and mirrors. But, at the end of the day, I hope Madison will be better off as an inclusive corps. I think this is the best I’ve ever seen this communicated and 100% whole heartedly agree with you. In fact I believe that if the Madison Scouts had consistently produced a product in the Top 12 we would still have an all male Madison Scouts and the decision would have never been made. Edited July 11, 2023 by GREENBLUE 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted July 11, 2023 Share Posted July 11, 2023 5 hours ago, HockeyDad said: I think it may be important to note that none of the recent posts were negative towards the marching members. You can hope for the best and appreciate the kids’ efforts, and also be critical of the leadership. Both can happen at the same time. We may gut agree or disagree with these recent posts, but they seem to be from the heart. And that I do appreciate. No one blames the kids 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted July 11, 2023 Share Posted July 11, 2023 3 hours ago, MGCpimpOtimp said: Am I missing something here? They had a great show in 2021 that everyone loved (with talent coming off a 17th place finish and a year of covid), from that team. 2022 was a miss, it happens. 2023 seems to be on the verge of getting back into finals, all captions seem stronger than previous years. Boston spent all the money in the world to bring in the best of the best designers, all the equipment and everything. It took them from 12th to 6th in one year, but then took another 5 years to get a medal, and they're still looking for their first championship. These things take time. From the outside looking in, Madison seems to be on the right path and making forward progress on that path. Shhh I said that too and got ignored 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted July 11, 2023 Share Posted July 11, 2023 3 hours ago, Vuitton said: Do we really know that the reaction was toxic and vitriolic (whatever that means, haha - too lazy to look up)? You have to remember that the loudest voices are always the fewest voices. You have not heard from every single Madison Scouts alumnus on this topic. Most I talked to were in support, and those that weren't certainly weren't toxic. I am sure there were some who were, but that's the way it is with everything in life. It's impossible to make everyone happy. I, for one, am all for inclusivity and I was happy that being male was no longer the biggest requirement to being a member. However, I do not believe inclusivity was behind the decision. I believe talent was behind the decision, and there's absolutely nothing wrong with that. Imo those supportive were often shouted down. If the word woke were en vogue then I imagine it would have been used a lot 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vuitton Posted July 12, 2023 Share Posted July 12, 2023 2 hours ago, Jeff Ream said: Shhh I said that too and got ignored Yeah 2021 was a fantastic show, but I don't think it's too hard to design a throwback show that isn't going to be judged. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick Jack Posted July 12, 2023 Share Posted July 12, 2023 Exactly. “You know who”couldn’t take the fact that James Mason was doing what he couldn’t do and fired James Mason. James had a five year plan and it was working. I, with three other Scouts lived with James at Jim and Jean Seefeldts. James put together a stellar group of instructors, something that the Scouts claim they have now, which is laughable. Even Boerma couldn’t fix this sinking ship. I for one believe the nail in the coffin was being inclusive to females. I’m not a sexist, but I believe The Madison Scouts in name should have been left as is and a new corps name introduced. Supposedly the influx of females was going to “save the day”. If I wanted to be in a corps with females in 1974 I would have joined the Blue Devils or SCV. I wanted to be a MADISON SCOUT because there was class and strength and power there. Bill Howard was the driving force as director and was highly respected in the drum corps world. Here’s something I have “heard” that should bring fear to every corps. I have “heard” that a certain someone wants to take the job of another Scout alum, Dan Acheson, whom I marched with, and become the head of DCI. Let that sink in. Heaven help us all. Once again, the young members are not to blame for the misguided, empty promises of those in charge. The Madison Scouts are now a feeder corps. And will be until massive changes are made. I’m not holding my breath. Is anyone? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MGCpimpOtimp Posted July 12, 2023 Share Posted July 12, 2023 Look, maybe you guys are right. But maybe you are two alumni who created brand new accounts with no posts here to trash the current administration that got the corps out of tons of debt, put it on solid financial footing, expanded programing, got it through a global pandemic, and have the on-field product headed in the right direction are exactly the type of alumni that are the problem. You're mad because you didn't get an email response? I know for a fact the org solicited TONS of opinions in different ways (surveys, emails, etc). Just because they didn't follow up with anyone didn't mean they didn't read it or take it into account. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gantang Posted July 12, 2023 Share Posted July 12, 2023 17 hours ago, Jeff Ream said: No one blames the kids Absolutely correct. I'm showing my age, but the 1976 Madison show that hit the field in May was complete crap and out of the "kids*" control. Coming off of the '75 Championship season, most people expected them to repeat. And those "kids" probably would have were it not for Fred Sanford being given free rein by Bill Howard. The "kids" lost a month of cleaning because of learning an entirely new show. It wasn't the member's fault. The kids can only perfect what they are given. However, the better the talent, the better the product. And some shows lack the complexity to place high because the shows can only be designed at the level of the talent. You wouldn't program a high brass heavy show with featured soprano (yep, I said soprano) soloists unless you knew you would have guys to play the solos. *The members in 1976 looked like 30-year-olds compared to the member today! 😁 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vuitton Posted July 12, 2023 Share Posted July 12, 2023 (edited) 1 hour ago, MGCpimpOtimp said: Look, maybe you guys are right. But maybe you are two alumni who created brand new accounts with no posts here to trash the current administration that got the corps out of tons of debt, put it on solid financial footing, expanded programing, got it through a global pandemic, and have the on-field product headed in the right direction are exactly the type of alumni that are the problem. You're mad because you didn't get an email response? I know for a fact the org solicited TONS of opinions in different ways (surveys, emails, etc). Just because they didn't follow up with anyone didn't mean they didn't read it or take it into account. You are free to think whatever you think and have your own opinions, of course. I've been a lurker here for a while, and it got to the point where I felt supporters of this administration were spreading lies and a false narrative so I had to share my story and my experience. You're free to believe it or not believe it, and you're free to make assumptions about my intentions. We're not mad because we didn't get an email. I think it's good business sense to thank people for taking time out of their day to participate, but I'm not mad. I'm not mad at all, to be honest. I was but that has long passed. I'm disappointed and sad in how this administration has treated its alumni base and how Chris has consolidated power and become a dictator at Madison. A one man show will never be successful. That applies in all facets of life. I stand by everything I said. Everything I said was my experience and my truth. Edited July 12, 2023 by Vuitton 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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