Define General Effect

[Grandpa Joe]

32 minutes ago, oldbandguy said:

I looked in THE book for the definition of General Effect and it said "see Bluecoats".

All jokes aside, they know how to do GE, but so do a few other corps. BD being one of them, and a couple others hot on their heels right now in the caption.

[ecamburn]

11 hours ago, Sensioto said:

General Effect is the only category of adjudication that is not based upon technical or tangible performance mechanisms. I agree with all of the above responses, and will add that it is, quite literally, the effect of the show in a general sense. It includes the entire production, not just the highs and lows, but transitions too, and how the corps command the field.

From this DCI write-up: "The GE judges are doing the romantic job, they’re feeling what the show is offering and responding to what the show is. There are three parts to GE, the intellectual, the aesthetic, and the emotional." More here: https://www.dci.org/news/adjudication-101-who-judges-what

 

Great thread.  GE has always been a mystery to me yet it is such a big determinant of scores. Of the responses so far, this one makes the most sense to me. Given this definition I think GE judges should be required to "sample" audience reactions (literally look at the faces of audience members at multiple points throughout the show).  😉

[scheherazadesghost]

GE is the strangest thing to assign a number to in the whole judging paradigm IMHO because it's so delightfully intangible. It's all strange, but especially GE.

That said, I'm always down for an impossible task for the fun of it. I just don't take it that seriously.

[MikeD]

Judging GE easily defined....the judge is evaluating the Effect of the show, but in a very General way.

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You're welcome!

[karuna]

46 minutes ago, scheherazadesghost said:

GE is the strangest thing to assign a number to in the whole judging paradigm IMHO because it's so delightfully intangible. It's all strange, but especially GE.

That said, I'm always down for an impossible task for the fun of it. I just don't take it that seriously.

GE is an attempt to formalize something everyone understood but no one was getting credit for:  "how well the show works".  All the complex words and concepts are just an attempt to define "working".  We all know when things work and when they don't.   

Edited July 7, 2023 by karuna

[lawdn]

47 minutes ago, scheherazadesghost said:

GE is the strangest thing to assign a number to in the whole judging paradigm IMHO because it's so delightfully intangible. It's all strange, but especially GE.

That said, I'm always down for an impossible task for the fun of it. I just don't take it that seriously.

It is part of the fascination for me of competitive endeavors that combine athleticism and artistry. Figure skating competitions have intrigued me since I was a kid. It is easier to understand how there can at least theoretically be objective standards for the performance captions, but it is much more difficult for GE, even as it is intuitive that GE is crucial to a show's impact. Impossible indeed!

[scheherazadesghost]

6 minutes ago, karuna said:

GE is an attempt to formalize something everyone understood but no one was getting credit for:  "how well the show works".  All the complex words and concepts are just an attempt to define "working".  We all know when things work and when they don't.   

And what a noble attempt at is.

Still, it's an impossible task to me. Others have hinted at subjectivity here and I agree. Such attempts are what push drum corps toward the sport category, which I think is silly. It's an artform to me, and ranking in the arts will always be major sillypants to me. 🤷🏽‍♀️

Just now, lawdn said:

It is part of the fascination for me of competitive endeavors that combine athleticism and artistry. Figure skating competitions have intrigued me since I was a kid. It is easier to understand how there can at least theoretically be objective standards for the performance captions, but it is much more difficult for GE, even as it is intuitive that GE is crucial to a show's impact. Impossible indeed!

Double indeed. In my decades of work in the arts after drum corps though, rubrics, even ones I helped construct were meant to serve the system first, not necessarily the one being assessed first. Guess I'll always just wish the artform could exist without it. That's where creative freedom lies for me, and what I was taught to value at SCV. That profound intangible.

[lawdn]

8 minutes ago, karuna said:

GE is an attempt to formalize something everyone understood but no one was getting credit for:  "how well the show works".  All the complex words and concepts are just an attempt to define "working".  We all know when things work and when they don't.   

And "working" can look very different for different shows - sometimes standing Os, sometimes jaw-dropped amazement, sometimes misty-eyed reflection, sometimes rapt engagement and appreciation.

[lawdn]

11 minutes ago, scheherazadesghost said:

And what a noble attempt at is.

Still, it's an impossible task to me. Others have hinted at subjectivity here and I agree. Such attempts are what push drum corps toward the sport category, which I think is silly. It's an artform to me, and ranking in the arts will always be major sillypants to me. 🤷🏽‍♀️

Double indeed. In my decades of work in the arts after drum corps though, rubrics, even ones I helped construct were meant to serve the system first, not necessarily the one being assessed first. Guess I'll always just wish the artform could exist without it. That's where creative freedom lies for me, and what I was taught to value at SCV. That profound intangible.

I am here for the art, as many others are. I love the athleticism in furtherance of the art. The need for competition to drive excellence is an axiom of DCI. In a short season, maybe that's true, but we don't ask or expect explicit competition in most artistic endeavors. I appreciate the competition as a by-product of the drive to excellence but countless corps and shows that didn't medal are still beloved by fans - the art is what matters most. 

[scheherazadesghost]

10 minutes ago, lawdn said:

I am here for the art, as many others are. I love the athleticism in furtherance of the art. The need for competition to drive excellence is an axiom of DCI. In a short season, maybe that's true, but we don't ask or expect explicit competition in most artistic endeavors. I appreciate the competition as a by-product of the drive to excellence but countless corps and shows that didn't medal are still beloved by fans - the art is what matters most. 

I get it. And it's okay to disagree with paradigms, right? I simply don't think competition drives creative excellence, and never have. Everyone here that disagrees with me would be wasting their breath attempting to convince me otherwise. In fact, I think it held back the shows during the years I marched. Staff were too constantly driven by the numbers to recall that we were young, fragile humans with reasonable limitations.

I've listened to a current corps director reflect on the covid year season quite lovingly, for the fact that there was no competition. Wish I could've been there. Genuine freedom from the shackles of competition. Surely a sight to behold in the drum corps world.