scheherazadesghost Posted July 7, 2023 Share Posted July 7, 2023 25 minutes ago, jwillis35 said: One judge takes a music based approach and how the visual is impacting that. The other takes a visual approach and how the music impacts that. Are the other areas of assessment approached so differently between judges? This seems to only add to the subjectivity and therefore variance and fallibility. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IllianaLancerContra Posted July 7, 2023 Share Posted July 7, 2023 Regarding definition of General Effect- I defer to the US Supreme Court’s (Jacobellis v Ohio, 1964) definition of obscenity- ‘I know it when I see it’. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ye olde sop Posted July 7, 2023 Share Posted July 7, 2023 But who is rewarded more? A corps that tries something harder but isn't as clean or a corps that does something easier but is cleaner. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueStainGlass Posted July 7, 2023 Author Share Posted July 7, 2023 17 minutes ago, ye olde sop said: But who is rewarded more? A corps that tries something harder but isn't as clean or a corps that does something easier but is cleaner. As I was once told - clean wins. Whatever class you're in and doing what is expected of the class clean wins but clean is execution and a visual and music judge. Effect has to factor it but takes full picture from the design team. 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scheherazadesghost Posted July 7, 2023 Share Posted July 7, 2023 19 minutes ago, BlueStainGlass said: As I was once told - clean wins. Whatever class you're in and doing what is expected of the class clean wins but clean is execution and a visual and music judge. Effect has to factor it but takes full picture from the design team. Truth. whimpers in Pathways Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rpbobcat Posted July 7, 2023 Share Posted July 7, 2023 (edited) 20 minutes ago, BlueStainGlass said: As I was once told - clean wins. Whatever class you're in and doing what is expected of the class clean wins but clean is execution and a visual and music judge. Effect has to factor it but takes full picture from the design team. The word "clean" gets tossed around a lot on this site. As someone who never marched, could someone please define, in " words of one syllable" exactly what "clean" is ? Edited July 7, 2023 by rpbobcat Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jwillis35 Posted July 7, 2023 Share Posted July 7, 2023 7 minutes ago, ye olde sop said: But who is rewarded more? A corps that tries something harder but isn't as clean or a corps that does something easier but is cleaner. My general opinion on this is that today cleanliness will be rewarded more. If the show is super easy that will be noted by the judge. When you're talking about the top 12 corps though none of the shows are easy. But it depends on the time of the summer tour. During the early season I think judges will try to see where things are going and what the intended effect is. Around mid-season the GE judges will expect to see improvements and can get a better read on what the intended effect is supposed to generate. As the show cleans those intended effects should be more obvious. During Finals week if the corps is still not very clean then it can be seen as a negative. Perhaps the marchers/players were given something too demanding. In the end a cleaner show makes reading the visual and music so much more obvious. How hard does a show need to be? And does difficulty bring about effect? Sometimes it does. But not all the time. Sloppiness in the drill/visual program or music come Finals week will not project the show's intended effects very well. In this case the judges will give more credit to a corps that performs a show that is hard enough but also clearly developed and super clean in performance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueStainGlass Posted July 7, 2023 Author Share Posted July 7, 2023 16 minutes ago, rpbobcat said: The word "clean" gets tossed around a lot on this site. As someone who never marched, could someone please define, in " words of one syllable" exactly what "clean" is ? Everybody all the time. That's box 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IllianaLancerContra Posted July 7, 2023 Share Posted July 7, 2023 14 minutes ago, rpbobcat said: The word "clean" gets tossed around a lot on this site. As someone who never marched, could someone please define, in " words of one syllable" exactly what "clean" is ? Constant intervals. Straight lines when they are supposed to be. Brass & percussion in tune. Consistent attacks and releases. All the snares/tenors/basses playing together. Flags & rifles spinning/tossing/catching together. And so forth. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rpbobcat Posted July 7, 2023 Share Posted July 7, 2023 15 minutes ago, BlueStainGlass said: Everybody all the time. That's box 5 Box 5 ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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