Still Crum-bling on the hill in Allentown - August 5, 2023

[Grandpa Joe]

2 minutes ago, Vuitton said:

We won’t know if the four are within 0.5 of each other until Thursday. Were BD and Bloo performing last night they could have scored over 96, or under 95. We just don’t know. Different nights, different shows.

Different nights, same shows, same judges. 

If DCI didn't want us to compare them they would have had them all on the same night. 

This argument is as old as time and about as tired as well. 

[Vidal28Rdg]

8 minutes ago, Vuitton said:

We won’t know if the four are within 0.5 of each other until Thursday. Were BD and Bloo performing last night they could have scored over 96, or under 95. We just don’t know. Different nights, different shows.

Considering there was the need to place the 5-7 tier, since none of them performed yesterday, I believe the two shows definitely were two different things. BD and Bloo performed and the next closest corps to them is, Cavaliers? I think? Hard to say you can compare them both as one.

it is great to see what close battles are going on between all these corps though, a deserving medalist at this point won’t be medaling, the margin between 5-7 is almost nothing, crazy to see!

Edited August 6, 2023 by Vidal28Rdg

[jasgre2000]

54 minutes ago, LabMaster said:

And what is the whole point of this?  It all balances out. Is someone thinking there was some kind of advantage being had by Sat corps?  What would it matter?  Do people think Sat corps scoring was skewed in their favor of because they supposedly had an extra rehearsal?  If so, then make a specific correlation or forget about it.

IDK. You're the one that said they all got the same rehearsal time. My point was only that scores from a later date are usually higher than scores on a prior date. That seems almost always to be the case. I don't know why Allentown would be any different.

[Tony L.]

3 hours ago, ykw said:

Yup.  Done simply to please the GE2 judge that needs to be told how the visuals tell the story.

I have to say that I thought parts of the voice over were effective.  And if anything, I would just cut some of it.  I never have to hear what the heaviest thing I will ever have to lift is my spirits (unless it is a gigantic cocktail 😆).  Otherwise, it is just editing IMHO. 

[DCIFan2022]

4 minutes ago, jasgre2000 said:

IDK. You're the one that said they all got the same rehearsal time. My point was only that scores from a later date are usually higher than scores on a prior date. That seems almost always to be the case. I don't know why Allentown would be any different.

Biggest difference is the SAME panel of judges my friend.. 

Edited August 6, 2023 by DCIFan2022

[jasgre2000]

3 minutes ago, DCIFan2022 said:

Biggest difference is the SAME panel of judges my friend.. 

Look at the scores from Houston (7/21) and San Antonio (7/22). Every corps that performed at Houston had their score go up in San Antonio. Is that just because there were different judges? Is there something magic about Allentown that keeps the Saturday corps from progressing at all on Friday?

Call it whatever you want, but you are never going to get a fair comparison when you are judging corps on two different nights. It doesn't matter that much, but this idea that it should be treated as one show where everyone is judged alike is just fiction. Why? Because DCI says so? Facts are facts.

[Vuitton]

26 minutes ago, craiga said:

Different nights, same show.  Has been for 26 years. 

Some folks here just keep on whistling past the graveyard. 

*

Edited August 6, 2023 by Vuitton

[Vuitton]

4 hours ago, jasgre2000 said:

Call it whatever you want, but you are never going to get a fair comparison when you are judging corps on two different nights. It doesn't matter that much, but this idea that it should be treated as one show where everyone is judged alike is just fiction. Why? Because DCI says so? Facts are facts.

Yes, exactly. Because DCI says so simple logic goes out the door. 

We don’t have answers to anything until Thursday. Once Thursday comes along we’ll know if this is indeed a 4 way race. It would sure be so exciting if that were to happen. I’ve always dreamed of different corps in different positions night over night. Imagine someone winning semis and finishing 4th in finals. It would be amazing.

Edited August 6, 2023 by Vuitton

[LyleF7]

22 minutes ago, Precious Roy said:

Just re-ran the spreadsheet using the other interpretation (use the average of last weekend's events, and then average those with S.A. and Allentown). The only placement difference would be that Crown and Bloo would swap (Bloo in 3rd, Crown 4th). Everybody else is unchanged.

Roy, don't forget that there is still one more step that needs to be taken to determine the performance order. Each group of 3, 1-3, 4-6, 7-9. 10-12, etc, will then have a drawing withing their group of 3, to determine their performance order. So the Blue Devils, who will have the highest average score, could end up going on third from last and the corps that places 4th could end up competing sixth from last.

 

So looking at the best and worst case scenarios, the corps that finishes with the third highest score could go on last and the corps that finishes with the fourth highest score could end up going on sixth from last. That's a big difference for an average score that may be just a few hundredths of a point apart.

 

I've always wondered, when do they do these drawings and who, if anyone, is witnessing their results? Do all of the corps managers get on a conference call, or now maybe a Zoom call, and watch while ping pong balls or numbers are pulled out of a hat. What's the process and can we confirm that the process isn't rigged??? That's the question that I'd like to have answered.

[Vuitton]

19 minutes ago, jasgre2000 said:

IDK. You're the one that said they all got the same rehearsal time. My point was only that scores from a later date are usually higher than scores on a prior date. That seems almost always to be the case. I don't know why Allentown would be any different.

It’s not any different. In 2019 Vanguard performed Friday and Crown Saturday. Crown scored higher, Vanguard beat Crown all three nights in Indy. In 2022 Boston and Bluecoats performed Friday night and Crown Saturday. Crown scored higher than both, both beat Crown all three nights at Indy. I’m sure there are other examples to find if one takes the time to look, but these two are from memory.