Death of the Cymbal Line

[ACustom19]

The Bucs use Zildjian Classical Orchestral and Symphonic Viennese cymbals. 18", 18", 18", 18", 19", and 20" sizes.

Your comment about the tones being the same on same size cymbals is not valid. Every cymbal pair has a different tone...

[84Cadet]

As a former cymbal player I am really upset by the way cymbal lines are vanishing. <**>

This summer I picked up the Cadets' pre-season CD and there were some Sousa parade tunes on there played by the horn line and the battery. As I listened to the CD, it sounded like something was missing but it took me a while to figure it out.

There were no cymbals. I'm sorry, but a march without cymbals just sounds stupid.

BRING THEM BACK!

[Bob Brady]

Wow - this is news to me - and quite disturbing - a cymbal line that marches is as "drum corps" and as American as apple pie - and now DCI corps are going AWAY from cymbal lines?

That's downright treasonous!!

Absurd!

Unbelievable!

I say put em on the field - at least 5 marching cymbals with plates of different sizes and tones, and if you want some on stands in the pits for long cymbal rolls or to complement the marching cymbals, fine, but ya GOTTA march with PLATES, man!

Cymbals on the field, and those intrepid souls who sweat, bleed, build major biceps and add SO VERY MUCH to a show MUST NOT FADE AWAY!!

This could be a "bumper sticker" issue here!

"PLATES - March or Die!"

"Crash or Burn!"

"Real corps march cymbals!"

"Cymbal players do it on the field!"

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

OK Rob-

How do YOU really feel?! :P

[drumcat]

5 plates, 5 brass...

5 plates, 5 brass...

5 plates, 5 brass...

I'm a former plateweilder, but as a designer or director, this is a no-brainer. Add the brass. Plates are great to watch, especially DCI-caliber, but from a competitive standpoint, I want 8% more brass on the field.

I'm still shocked no one has gone for 80 brass yet.

80 brass

16 (7/4/5) battery

8 pit

30 guard

1 dm

[CrunchyTenor]

I undestand bucs use traditional tonal lids, but we are talking DCI, and in DCI the lines are no longer tonal.  The lines are all using one size cymbal, my guess would be a 20".

so a run down the line is really nothing more than visual because the tones are all the same, except for maybe different technique from player to player but that would be a bad thing.

So jeff this is a DCI thread, not a DCA thread.  My comments all were based on what DCI is currently using, something I'm sure you are not aware of since you no longer attend shows.  Which brings me to another point, since you no longer attend shows, and no longer care about DCI corps, why do you constantly read and post on the junior threads?  All you ever seem to do is come on here and add some negative remark about DCI and the path it is taking.  I'm not for all the changes (especially miced voice, and the finals retreat issue), but I still love drum corps and will keep supporting it.

We all get how much you hate junior corps and everything it stands for now.  You've told us all, many times, now just go watch your DCA and be happy with their traditional bugles, oh wait DCA is allowing 3 valves and Bb horns now aren't they?  looks like you're gonna have to limit yourself to alumni corps now.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Sorry, Phil, but you lost this argument with the personal stuff.

Regarding the "tonal" argument, each individual cymbal pair has a distinct, though subtle, difference in sound. Pus, the sounds created by different techniques in ensemble playing go beyond just a tonal aspect.

And like an earlier poster said, I like to see SCV at least twice a season. Once to see the whole corps, and at least once more just to watch the cymbal line.

My older daughter wanted to be a plate player (she played clarinet from 5th to 8th grades) after watching SCV Cadets' cymbal line in their encore concert in the lot after DATR in Denver in 1999. Unfortunately, when she started her freshman year in HS that following fall, her HS band didn't march their plates. That's when she became a pit player, and made everyone who knew she played clarinet take a vow of silence on the matter after she joined the pit.

To all the plate sections out there, BRAVO!, and thank you.

Garry

Edited August 18, 2005 by CrunchyTenor

[gbass598]

Cymbal lines aren't sying they are just hiding out.

Cymbal lines are alive and well in WGI and that is continually growing every year.

[Jeff Ream]

I undestand bucs use traditional tonal lids, but we are talking DCI, and in DCI the lines are no longer tonal.  The lines are all using one size cymbal, my guess would be a 20".

so a run down the line is really nothing more than visual because the tones are all the same, except for maybe different technique from player to player but that would be a bad thing.

So jeff this is a DCI thread, not a DCA thread.  My comments all were based on what DCI is currently using, something I'm sure you are not aware of since you no longer attend shows.  Which brings me to another point, since you no longer attend shows, and no longer care about DCI corps, why do you constantly read and post on the junior threads?  All you ever seem to do is come on here and add some negative remark about DCI and the path it is taking.  I'm not for all the changes (especially miced voice, and the finals retreat issue), but I still love drum corps and will keep supporting it.

We all get how much you hate junior corps and everything it stands for now.  You've told us all, many times, now just go watch your DCA and be happy with their traditional bugles, oh wait DCA is allowing 3 valves and Bb horns now aren't they?  looks like you're gonna have to limit yourself to alumni corps now.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

actually you're mistaken. I DO care about DCI corps, and many of the decisions they make because they seem to turn off more people every day. I miss DCI, and I would love to see one tiny rule changed and i'd be back in a heartbeat. That change is enough to keep me from going because I know if I go and see it, i'll be miserable, shoot my mouth off and #### off people around me.

as for Bb and 3 valves, it doesnt bother me at all. I am for it. I am anti amplification, tho I can tolerate it in the pit, but the voice #### has got to go.

if my posting bothers you, ignore it. if i violate guidelines, report me. I donate to DCP and until I am told otherwise by an admin, I'll post where I like.

and I saw SCV last summer, and i don't recall the sizes, but I don't remember a unison sound from the lids on the splitparts.

[bluecoats88]

actually you're mistaken. I DO care about DCI corps, and many of the decisions they make because they seem to turn off more people every day. I miss DCI, and I would love to see one tiny rule changed and i'd be back in a heartbeat. That change is enough to keep me from going because I know if I go and see it, i'll be miserable, shoot my mouth off and #### off people around me.

as for Bb and 3 valves, it doesnt bother me at all. I am for it. I am anti amplification, tho I can tolerate it in the pit, but the voice #### has got to go.

if my posting bothers you, ignore it. if i violate guidelines, report me. I donate to DCP and until I am told otherwise by an admin, I'll post where I like.

and I saw SCV last summer, and i don't recall the sizes, but I don't remember a unison sound from the lids on the splitparts.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Jeff I understand you still care about junior corps and wish they would change their rules to suit you (personnally I have accepted amped pits, but could do without voiceovers).

One thing I am curious about though. Last year when DCI added amps you said that's it I'm not going to another DCI show. So how did you see SCV last summer? Did you not stand by your convictions? did we all sit and listen to you bemoan amplification and read about your never going to a show again for nothing? because if you saw SCV within the last two seasons your statements on here have all been nothing more than false bravado.

I don't agree with your boycott, but if it is something you feel you must do, and obviously it is since you told us about it often enough, then I will accept it, however at least stick to your convictions and do what you said you were going to do. Don't tell us you are never watching amped corps and then go and watch them. Either stop watching them like you said, or admit that you still go to shows so we will not bother believing anything you say again.

Edited August 19, 2005 by bluecoats88

[jonnyboy]

I'm still shocked no one has gone for 80 brass yet.

80 brass

16 (7/4/5) battery

8 pit

30 guard

1 dm

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

My guess would be (outside of the top 5 or so) finding 80 quality brass may be difficult. On the other hand, you can almost always find a few kids to play cymbals. There are professional cymbal players out there, and always great opportunity for a kid to march.

I always wonder what happens to members when the staff announces "well, we're not having a cymbal line next year." or "Next year we aren't marching guys in the color guard." What is it like when a corps gets rid of a whole section or part of a section?

When I win the lottery: My corps will have 4-5 person cymbal line, always.

[^Michael^]

Jeff I understand you still care about junior corps and wish they would change their rules to suit you (personnally I have accepted amped pits, but could do without voiceovers). 

One thing I am curious about though.  Last year when DCI added amps you said that's it I'm not going to another DCI show.  So how did you see SCV last summer?  Did you not stand by your convictions?  did we all sit and listen to you bemoan amplification and read about your never going to a show again for nothing?  because if you saw SCV within the last two seasons your statements on here have all been nothing more than false bravado.

I don't agree with your boycott, but if it is something you feel you must do, and obviously it is since you told us about it often enough, then I will accept it, however at least stick to your convictions and do what you said you were going to do.  Don't tell us you are never watching amped corps and then go and watch them.  Either stop watching them like you said, or admit that you still go to shows so we will not bother believing anything you say again.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I actually think that, given his position on the issues, Jeff is usually significantly more fair, restrained, and sensitive with his posts than many of his disgruntled colleagues. Yes, it's true that Jeff (and a few others) are persistent in their determination to make sure we all know how they feel, but Jeff (unlike some others) rarely resorts to insults, blatant untruths, and mean-spirited rhetoric to make his points. Finally, I happen to think that Jeff's boycott of DCI shows is a mature way to stand behind his convictions and his reasoning for choosing the boycott method is solid ("That change is enough to keep me from going because I know if I go and see it, i'll be miserable, shoot my mouth off and #### off people around me.") and shows that he is sensitive to the fact that there are many people whose views differ from his.

While we may differ on specific drum corps issues, I truly believe that Jeff loves drum corps and I support and respect his right to have and express a dissenting opinion in a mature, non-destructive manner - as he often does!