Cadets Narration

[euponitone]

I know, and I think it is a bad example because of what it implies. I think I explained why I wrote what I did pretty well too. CowboyKen knows music is an extension... ^0^

I do however think that Joe has cleverly written something and is a genius for writing it. Really, if the Cadets are going to do it, I'd like it it to be done sparingly and WELL.

No harm no foul here. Joe, keep on trucking.

the thing i keep coming back to, is that at least the corps is only doing ONE new/weird thing. In my mind, this gives them better odds at succeeding, compared to last year when they did a million crazy things poorly. Hopefully they can focus on one of the so called 'innovations' this year, and do it well

[Jedicadet05]

As I left memorial brass i was a little bummed....but....I also remember how pulled into the music I was by the voice. Try this for me....but only when you see/hear the show...the full show. Until you hear the whole thing you're not gonna get it the concept.

Forget the words, don't listen to them. STOP LISTENING TO THE WORDS. That is....if you don't want to. Now that you're not paying attention to the words I would please as you to listen to the VOICE. Listen to the SOUNDS the VOICE makes!!! Voice and drum corps can and DO go together great!

Blue Devils Starwars Warmup....I forget which one but I'm sure everyone's heard it. You know, the one with the large cut off then someone (conductor I think) lets out a massive "HAAA!!!!" then the horn line enters! OMFG what a pull in!

I know its just an example and could probably be torn to shreds on here, it works. There are elements like that "BD moment" in the Cadets' show. The narration pulls you in....really, it does.

[Triple Forte]

The thing that bothers me the most about this clip is NOT the narration. I don't understand how some

of you can say how GREAT the brass sound. Are we listening to the same clip? I know it's a MAY recording,

but I've heard other MAY recordings from The Cadets that sounded much better than this clip. I've heard

MARCH recordings of The Cadets that sounded better than this clip. I'm just hoping this clip was one that

doesn't show how the corps REALLY sounds and probably shouldn't have been put out to the public.

Just listened to the clip. This must have been either an early May recording or a really bad run of the tune. I saw the Cadets on Sunday night at their indoor show (5/27) and the brassline "cooked" the whole show. I also heard the Cadets play outside at a parade and they sounded dark, powerful and balanced. As for the show.....well most of you probably know that I dont like narration of any kind. Its distracting and unecessary.....

[Galen]

Holy BOA, Batman...

<**>

On a side note, I saw a quote from Atlas Shrugged in Hop's blog on their site. Maybe he should take another read through that book and pay close attention to the chapters on "Project X"- a "superweapon" that operates on amplified sound and blows up in its creators' faces.

[jwillis35]

For those of you who are making good arguments, both pro and con, I appreciate the examples and the opinions. Narration, singing, and all that stuff will continue to be a hot topic in this activity, and while the insults are not necessary, I do appreciate the dialogue and the passion we all have for this art form.

I would say this: I listened to the clip and I don't find it offensive, nor do I think people will find it all that distracting once the visual element is added and the kinks are worked out, providing they are careful. The problem for me will be more a question of how much of this can the show withstand before it becomes overkill. Too much narration can destroy what the natural senses tend to look for in this type of activity. Even at a typical band competition or a band night, people instinctively listen for the music and the visual design that enhances that music. Dialogue works much better on the stage when the principle function is to tell a story via lyrics, speech, music, lighting, staging, acting...Broadway or Opera. And in such a case the orchestra is in the pit taking second fiddle, although still very, very important.

But the natural inclinations for those who watch field presentations from bands and corps is to look for the marchers and the horns they play, and to look for the designs and the colors that help to represent in some form the ideas of the music. When you add lyrics and speech you disturb those natural senses that people have, and one must do their best to alter their instincts and to divert their attention to the added elements, and I believe this is where these aspects tend to create tension, excitement (if done well), bewilderment, and confusion.

For those reasons, and others, we have seen that too much narration and singing on a field can be confusing to the audience, even though the rationale is that it is done to help the viewer better understand the show. But in reality it often destroys the imagination that allows one to more closely examine the beauty of the music and to clarify how the visual is enhancing that, and frankly that is no easy or small task, but it is at the crux of what makes music so special. When you explain the music too much, those instincts that come naturally to the audience are forced in a certain direction, perhaps not always bad, but they now find themselves with more to digest, and at some point other show aspects become less clear or cluttered.

So I am not against what they are doing, and I think it is presumptuous for any of us to assume that what they have is a finished product. We must allow corps to create and further refine before we make ultimate judgements, and I did find some of what they were trying to do kind of funny, especially if the visuals take advantage of the narration. I just hope they use good judgement and do not flood this show with an element like narration that can easily trump music. Because for all the natural instincts I spoke of when watching a field presentation, it is even more natural for the viewer to turn their heads and look for the speaker. Speech can trump music anyday, and usually not in a good way. As soon as someone starts to talk, we look, we listen, we start to comprehend what it is they are saying, and our senses for music and visual are put on hold, or the imaginative thought that we were in only moments prior to this speech is now diverted. And at times that can be annoying.

They must be careful.

JW

[euponitone]

For those of you who are making good arguments, both pro and con, I appreciate the examples and the opinions. Narration, singing, and all that stuff will continue to be a hot topic in this activity, and while the insults are not necessary, I do appreciate the dialogue and the passion we all have for this art form.

I would say this: I listened to the clip and I don't find it offensive, nor do I think people will find it all that distracting once the visual element is added and the kinks are worked out, providing they are careful. The problem for me will be more a question of how much of this can the show withstand before it becomes overkill. Too much narration can destroy what the natural senses tend to look for in this type of activity. Even at a typical band competition or a band night, people instinctively listen for the music and the visual design that enhances that music. Dialogue works much better on the stage when the principle function is to tell a story via lyrics, speech, music, lighting, staging, acting...Broadway or Opera. And in such a case the orchestra is in the pit taking second fiddle, although still very, very important.

But the natural inclinations for those who watch field presentations from bands and corps is to look for the marchers and the horns they play, and to look for the designs and the colors that help to represent in some form the ideas of the music. When you add lyrics and speech you disturb those natural senses that people have, and one must do their best to alter their instincts and to divert their attention to the added elements, and I believe this is where these aspects tend to create tension, excitement (if done well), bewilderment, and confusion.

For those reasons, and others, we have seen that too much narration and singing on a field can be confusing to the audience, even though the rationale is that it is done to help the viewer better understand the show. But in reality it often destroys the imagination that allows one to more closely examine the beauty of the music and to clarify how the visual is enhancing that, and frankly that is no easy or small task, but it is at the crux of what makes music so special. When you explain the music too much, those instincts that come naturally to the audience are forced in a certain direction, perhaps not always bad, but they now find themselves with more to digest, and at some point other show aspects become less clear or cluttered.

So I am not against what they are doing, and I think it is presumptuous for any of us to assume that what they have is a finished product. We must allow corps to create and further refine before we make ultimate judgements, and I did find some of what they were trying to do kind of funny, especially if the visuals take advantage of the narration. I just hope they use good judgement and do not flood this show with an element like narration that can easily trump music. Because for all the natural instincts I spoke of when watching a field presentation, it is even more natural for the viewer to turn their heads and look for the speaker. Speech can trump music anyday, and usually not in a good way. As soon as someone starts to talk, we look, we listen, we start to comprehend what it is they are saying, and our senses for music and visual are put on hold, or the imaginative thought that we were in only moments prior to this speech is now diverted. And at times that can be annoying.

They must be careful.

JW

w/Stp:

ok mods...just go ahead and close the thread, im done here

Edited May 30, 2007 by euponitone

[oldtimedrummer]

But the natural inclinations for those who watch field presentations from bands and corps is to look for the marchers and the horns they play, and to look for the designs and the colors that help to represent in some form the ideas of the music. When you add lyrics and speech you disturb those natural senses that people have, and one must do their best to alter their instincts and to divert their attention to the added elements, and I believe this is where these aspects tend to create tension, excitement (if done well), bewilderment, and confusion.

For those reasons, and others, we have seen that too much narration and singing on a field can be confusing to the audience, even though the rationale is that it is done to help the viewer better understand the show. But in reality it often destroys the imagination that allows one to more closely examine the beauty of the music and to clarify how the visual is enhancing that, and frankly that is no easy or small task, but it is at the crux of what makes music so special. When you explain the music too much, those instincts that come naturally to the audience are forced in a certain direction, perhaps not always bad, but they now find themselves with more to digest, and at some point other show aspects become less clear or cluttered.

JW

Excellent points, very well stated.

[testonator]

...come to think of it, some of them do have some nice shapes.. :D

:lolhit:

[jjeffeory]

For those of you who are making good arguments, both pro and con, I appreciate the examples and the opinions. Narration, singing, and all that stuff will continue to be a hot topic in this activity, and while the insults are not necessary, I do appreciate the dialogue and the passion we all have for this art form.

I would say this: I listened to the clip and I don't find it offensive, nor do I think people will find it all that distracting once the visual element is added and the kinks are worked out, providing they are careful. The problem for me will be more a question of how much of this can the show withstand before it becomes overkill. Too much narration can destroy what the natural senses tend to look for in this type of activity. Even at a typical band competition or a band night, people instinctively listen for the music and the visual design that enhances that music. Dialogue works much better on the stage when the principle function is to tell a story via lyrics, speech, music, lighting, staging, acting...Broadway or Opera. And in such a case the orchestra is in the pit taking second fiddle, although still very, very important.

But the natural inclinations for those who watch field presentations from bands and corps is to look for the marchers and the horns they play, and to look for the designs and the colors that help to represent in some form the ideas of the music. When you add lyrics and speech you disturb those natural senses that people have, and one must do their best to alter their instincts and to divert their attention to the added elements, and I believe this is where these aspects tend to create tension, excitement (if done well), bewilderment, and confusion.

For those reasons, and others, we have seen that too much narration and singing on a field can be confusing to the audience, even though the rationale is that it is done to help the viewer better understand the show. But in reality it often destroys the imagination that allows one to more closely examine the beauty of the music and to clarify how the visual is enhancing that, and frankly that is no easy or small task, but it is at the crux of what makes music so special. When you explain the music too much, those instincts that come naturally to the audience are forced in a certain direction, perhaps not always bad, but they now find themselves with more to digest, and at some point other show aspects become less clear or cluttered.

So I am not against what they are doing, and I think it is presumptuous for any of us to assume that what they have is a finished product. We must allow corps to create and further refine before we make ultimate judgements, and I did find some of what they were trying to do kind of funny, especially if the visuals take advantage of the narration. I just hope they use good judgement and do not flood this show with an element like narration that can easily trump music. Because for all the natural instincts I spoke of when watching a field presentation, it is even more natural for the viewer to turn their heads and look for the speaker. Speech can trump music anyday, and usually not in a good way. As soon as someone starts to talk, we look, we listen, we start to comprehend what it is they are saying, and our senses for music and visual are put on hold, or the imaginative thought that we were in only moments prior to this speech is now diverted. And at times that can be annoying.

They must be careful.

JW

More or less what I was getting at... My version was "pithy". What you said was written very well and flowing. Thanks for that!

[louderisbetter]

Hmm... no sir, I don't like it.