SFZFAN Posted June 8, 2010 Share Posted June 8, 2010 What I'm wondering is.........How many Yamaha lines are actually using "stock" (ie birch) shells? I taught the Colts the past 3 years, and our drums have been made of maple the past 2 years...the sound difference, IMO, is night and day, with the maple sounding so much warmer, fatter...the birch, to my ears, sounds thin. The only difference between the 2007/08 drums and the 09/10 drums is the shell material. When we got the new drums last year, I was astounded at how much better the maple sounds. I wonder why it isn't an option for Yamaha to produce a maple line of drums for the band market. Cost? The maple drums that the corps are using all come from the Yamaha Drum Foundry. Basically, a drum custom shop. I know the Cadets drums are also all maple, as are the Cavaliers, and Madison, IIRC. Anyone know if any corps are using the standard birch Yamaha drums? As of last year All World Class DCI Yamaha lines used maple. That could have changed for this year but I doubt it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
perc2100 Posted June 8, 2010 Share Posted June 8, 2010 What I'm wondering is.........How many Yamaha lines are actually using "stock" (ie birch) shells? I taught the Colts the past 3 years, and our drums have been made of maple the past 2 years...the sound difference, IMO, is night and day, with the maple sounding so much warmer, fatter...the birch, to my ears, sounds thin. The only difference between the 2007/08 drums and the 09/10 drums is the shell material. When we got the new drums last year, I was astounded at how much better the maple sounds. I wonder why it isn't an option for Yamaha to produce a maple line of drums for the band market. Cost? The maple drums that the corps are using all come from the Yamaha Drum Foundry. Basically, a drum custom shop. I know the Cadets drums are also all maple, as are the Cavaliers, and Madison, IIRC. Anyone know if any corps are using the standard birch Yamaha drums? I agree about the maple, it does obviously project more than birch and is a lot warmer on the field than birch. I'm not surprised that the World Class corps prefer maple. I also find it interesting when some of the corps have the companies custom-cut tenors to depths they want (as opposed to the stock depths). I wonder what would happen if the average high school tried to order Yamaha drums with maple shells. The HS I teach ordered a custom finish that was not in the catalogue (but at the time was a Master's Custom finish) and we didn't have any problems. I imagine if a school/organization has the money any company will do whatever you want as far as wood type, depth, finish, etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluecoats88 Posted June 8, 2010 Share Posted June 8, 2010 bass drum phantomthese new dynasty carriers do WONDERS for bass drummers!. NO MORE BARS IN THE THIGHS!!!!!! they look alot like the Ludwig vest carriers we used back in the 80s Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
perc2100 Posted June 8, 2010 Share Posted June 8, 2010 they look alot like the Ludwig vest carriers we used back in the 80s Yea, and to be honest the Randy May carriers ( http://www.drumlineblog.com/images/product...y/monoposto.gif ) are WAY easier on the body (especially compared to the old vest carriers) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SFZFAN Posted June 8, 2010 Share Posted June 8, 2010 Yea, and to be honest the Randy May carriers ( http://www.drumlineblog.com/images/product...y/monoposto.gif ) are WAY easier on the body (especially compared to the old vest carriers) In college (1982) we had our carriers custom made by the metal shop at the university. They were made of magnesium, and they worked pretty well. You didn't dare smoke a cigarette while wearing your drum though! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blake13 Posted June 10, 2010 Share Posted June 10, 2010 Soooo... You realize that the Carbonply drums are HEAVIER than the regular Championship drums, right? the snare's aren't. IMO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DanjrusMcRynky Posted June 10, 2010 Share Posted June 10, 2010 the snare's aren't. IMO I dont remember the numbers for the snares. I know that the full Carbonply tenors are quite a lot (maybe 10 pounds?) heavier than the regular Championships, however VERY few corps have used the real Carbonplys (Only SCV and PR 05, BK 08). All the Carbonplys you see in DCI today are Maple instead of Mahogany, and only have the inner ply of Carbon (as opposed to inner AND outer plys). The tenors are cut slightly differently and I believe have a little bit more wood on them, making even the Maple ones a little heavier. I think the basses used are actually just regular championship drums, and the snares would be exactly the same except for the one ply of Carbon. IIRC, PR had such problems with the Mahogany in 05 that they sent the tenors to a wood shop to have I think an inch cut off the bottom of each drum, just to alleviate some of the weight. SCV just weathered them all year, however they had a lot of problems/injuries from the weight. Don't know how BK did with them. Pearl seemed to get a fairly negative response to the normal Carbonplys due to the weight problems mentioned above, plus a lot of people REALLY didn't like the sound they put out. The custom maple ones seem to have mixed reviews...some people still like the plain Championship drums more, which I would imagine explains BD and others going with those this year instead. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
big old drummer man Posted June 10, 2010 Share Posted June 10, 2010 While this is argumentative, from a scientific point of view it's just patently false. Yamaha - 6 ply birth with nodal points where the casings are attached to the shell; 12x14 diameter Pearl - 6 ply maple with 100% free-floating casings & 45 degree bearing edge; 14x10 diameter Dynasty - 8 ply maple with with top rim utilizing free floating and bottom using a nodal system connected to shell; 14x12 diameter Basically: the thicker the shell, the more higher it will sound. The thinner the shell, the lower it will sound. Plus, the density of the wood also determines how thin a ply can be cut. With the different types of wood, different shell thicknesses, different amounts of wood ply, different ways putting the shell together, and different diameter, those point to perhaps subtle (if you're not well versed in the differences to be able to hear them), but definite sound differences. Add also different heads that corps use. "Sounding great" is definitely subjective, but there are plenty of differences in drum construction that affect the sound quality of each of the 'big three' companies. I won't even go into tenors, as those are RADICALLY different sounding based on the above factors plus the way each company cuts their shells (for example, Pearl generally uses significantly deeper shells than Yamaha); and regarding basses, different size combinations plus the things mentioned above (at least as far as amount of wood plies, type of wood, heads, tuning, and playing technique) make for pretty different sounds from company to company. Again, the differences might not be glaring to some (they are to me), writing off all of the above factors and insinuating that all drums sound the same (or even "great," as you specifically said) is pretty naive on anyone's part. Dude. You know what I was saying. No need mount up on your drum-knowledge high horse to pretend like you're smarter than everyone. I am quite aware of all the differences between drum brands. I know how each difference affects the sound. My point remains: any brand drum can be tuned to any desired sound, as long as the person tuning knows how to do it. The best example of this is Phantom. They had that "classic Pearl sound" for years. When the corps went to Dynasty, everyone FREAKED saying "I just can't picture Phantom without that 'classic Pearl sound.'" Lo and behold, they came out in 08 with a Pearl sound on Dynasty drums. On the contrary, RCC came out this year at WGI with Pearl drums that sounded like every Blue Devil drumline of the 00s who played on Dynasty. Sure, certain drum designs are conducive to some sound characteristics (ie Pearl quads' rounded bearing edges making a deep, warm sound). But at the end of the day, the tuning and head choice can drastically alter this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
big old drummer man Posted June 10, 2010 Share Posted June 10, 2010 the snare's aren't. IMO The Carbonply snares are made out of a heavier wood (mahogany) than the Championship drums (maple), and have additional plies of carbon fiber. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
perc2100 Posted June 10, 2010 Share Posted June 10, 2010 Dude. You know what I was saying. No need mount up on your drum-knowledge high horse to pretend like you're smarter than everyone. I am quite aware of all the differences between drum brands. I know how each difference affects the sound. Yikes! No need to take anything personal of get overly defensive! I just wanted to point out a few differences in construction that totally affect the sound (I geek out sometimes over acoustic physics). My point remains: any brand drum can be tuned to any desired sound, as long as the person tuning knows how to do it. The best example of this is Phantom. They had that "classic Pearl sound" for years. When the corps went to Dynasty, everyone FREAKED saying "I just can't picture Phantom without that 'classic Pearl sound.'" Lo and behold, they came out in 08 with a Pearl sound on Dynasty drums. On the contrary, RCC came out this year at WGI with Pearl drums that sounded like every Blue Devil drumline of the 00s who played on Dynasty. I TOTALLY have the opposite opinion of Phantom's sound on the Dynasties. I saw them in CA in 08 when they first switched and I was almost in shock at how much worse they sounded than Pearl (mainly sound projection). Watching them warm-up and getting 'up close and personal,' it looked like the snare line was working twice as hard approach wise to get similar volume/sound quality than they had to with the Pearl. I do agree that they tuned those snares about as well as they could have, and it was one of the best sounding snare lines I've heard heard from a Dynasty line. I also totally disagree with the RCC comparison. The first WGI Regional in So Cal last year I got to sneak away from my group for a little while to check out their new drums. They're snare line was so much brighter and more exposed than any Dynasty line I've ever heard. I definitely think that the Pearl snares that projected clearer 'forced' RCC to have to be cleaner since they couldn't get away with as much 'grey' playing as they could with Dynasty snares. Not coincidently (IMO), their PA at WGI Finals was their lowest caption; while they were definitely playing a super demanding book, playing on more articulate snares definitely didn't help them. To add to that, the WGI group that I've been teaching the past five years started out playing Dynasty, and then switched to Yamaha. We did a pretty thorough A/B test of the drums just for fun, and there was no question from anyone on staff that Yamaha was a substantially better sounding line than the Dynasties ever were. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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