Official DCP G7 Proposal Discussion Thread

[dckid80]

We're presuming that GH is smart enough to understand all your "black belt" stuff; this may have just been so much spaghetti to throw against the wall. But on the chance that he's studied all the Sigma stuff we ought to be able to predict his next move, yes?

But then again, ZAG...

Go with but then again.

Six Sigma is a discipline that is fact(data) based. It is not difficult to grasp conceptually at a high level but requires training, practice and repeated application to master. GH is much more of an "idea" guy at this point.

Admittedly it was 10 years ago when I interviewed with him but at that point he was not what I would have described as a professionally trained manager.

Edited May 29, 2010 by dckid80

[IntheMood]

Your "subtle" method is what I think of as "nudge" (in politics, anyway, and NO I'm not a politician!). Hasn't GH been introducing subtle changes for years?

Again, does it make sense that "Shock and Awe" is the only way he's sees to get over the woodwinds hurdle?

Seems nothing in his plan works if he can't "look like them", so THE critical aspect, despite his other presentation points, is achieving open instrumentation to "look like them".

This issue is the most sensitive to me (yes, MY line in the sand) so I'm paying close attention to the chess moves that try to capture that king...

We're presuming that GH is smart enough to understand all your "black belt" stuff; this may have just been so much spaghetti to throw against the wall. But on the chance that he's studied all the Sigma stuff we ought to be able to predict his next move, yes?

But then again, ZAG...

It looks to me that hop knows little about LSS. Why do I say that? LSS is all about the team and working together as a team to solve issues. And using your wits not your wallet.

DCI must now look for easy wins so that there will be more buy-in to their vision. The first thing that I would tell DCI's BoD is to abandon fixed ideas. I would advise them to make an announcement soon and I mean like yesterday that all rule proposals will be reviewed.

The G7 will respond soon. DCI must be proactive in their approach to the G7.

Dean

[Stu]

Admittedly it was 10 years ago when I interviewed with him but at that point he was not what I would have described as a professionally trained manager.

From the recent YEA article that appeared on the DCP website and the Cadets Bio about GH: Hopkins received his Bachelors of Science Degree in Secondary Education, specializing in Social Studies. He began working full time with the Cadets in 1979 after only one year of teaching social studies in Pennsylvania.

So, any management experience that he has gained has come from the school of hard knocks; which is fine as long as he grew in both the knowledge and wisdom of business management.

[Stu]

There is no bus. DCI has a sizable fan base beyond just immediate family of marching members. Marching band does not.

I was not refering to the fan base as being the bus, but the actual show concepts. Back in the day, bands followed the lead of DCI; today it is in a mode of reversing roles. The directors of the G7 seem to be viewing band programs as cutting edge, not the other way around, and this move is a way to get back into the cutting edge drivers seat of "that" bus.

[Jeff Ream]

All 15 premier events are within driving distance for many schools.

and how many schools are left out? too much focus on premier events. get the grass roots level going. Schools in Pittsburgh arent going to drive to Allentown. Schools in the Boston Area aren;t driving to...what premier event is near Boston?

focus on ALL shows, not just the big ones

[Jeff Ream]

Edit: If you think that I am out to lunch with the following, please read p. 49 to the end of the G7 proposal where Gibbs describes what they want to do with the weekend productions. He even uses the word “Cirque” to describe the proposed events.

I agree that the Northmont 1996 Vietnam Wall show was extremely emotional and the production value was superb; and it also brought tears to my eyes. That said, here I go opening myself up for criticism. But what in the world does that have anything to do with the battery, the pit, the music, and the marching? I understand that visual is an integral part of the program; as well as it should be. However, WGI, DCI, and BOA have all become heavily skewed toward GE and Visual with less and less emphasis toward Music and Marching. I am not saying go back to the tick system with block slip drill and the battery marking time; but what I am saying is that when a show is "mainly" remembered for a visual illusion more so that the show's musical and marching value, something is amiss in my opinion. The notes of yesteryear in the great HS snare lines contained cheese inverts and swiss kicks; the notes today with these lines are mainly right hand lead simplistic patterns so that the snare lines can dance, prance, dip, and spin around with one foot hiked up while appearing from behind a prop rolling a big rubber beach ball that is painted blue to represent the earth which is spinning around a larger yellow ball representing the sun while the tenors put on sun glasees to keep the sun from hurting their eyes! Anyway, like most people back in the eighties, I was impressed by the SCV floating girl; but I was more moved by the music, drill, and color guard moves that was being performed behind the visual illusion. So, if I want to see mainly story telling I will go see a Broadway production; if I want to mainly see illusions I will go see a magician; but with WGI drum lines, DCI, and BOA, I want to mainly see drill, hear music, and watch the color guard throw rifles and flags with some of the extra visual illusion stuff added in for texture. Just my take.

there is an easy fix on ths sheet side...WGi uses it in some areas.

for the percussion performance sheet, out of 40 points, 15 is on book, 25 on performance. and for guards, isn't A Class and below a 7/13 weighting?

ty

[Jeff Ream]

There is no bus. DCI has a sizable fan base beyond just immediate family of marching members. Marching band does not.

agreed. designers use marching bands as their guinea pigs

[3rd_Star_Brigade]

agreed. designers use marching bands as their guinea pigs

Totally agree, yet this is the fanbase that is being turned off by the un-professionalism of internal conflict, year-by-year rule changes (it took 10-15 years to get to 3-valved Gs from 2!), and a smaller variety of sound and style.

to cap it off, what really shoots me in the ### is his (Hop's) knocking of modern pop/rock as being unplayable. Perhaps a changing of the arranger/designer guard to someone who didnt march in the 70s is in order here. I mean the same 10 arrangers have worked with the same corps for 30/40 years. Stagnation and cronyism are both unprofessional and deadly to the youth market you're trying to cater to.

I personally hope that a smaller corps has the nuts to come out with Uprising by Muse in the face of the G7, and a masterful arrangement at that.

Fat Cats had a Heart Attack.

[FHdork]

From my reading of Hop's notorious blog entry, he's ADVOCATING for more pop music...he laments that many corps play (mostly) old dead white guys. In reading between the lines, he seems to be saying that the cost for the rights to play a Lady Gaga, or a Michael Jackson show (that could really kick some a**, imo...), is prohibitive...and so corps - feeling the economic pinch from travel costs - choose 'free' music...ie: dead white guys.

Perhaps a compromise position is to seek out more contemporary works composed by musicians who are willing to cut DCI corps a break in how much the rights will cost. Biggest obstacle here is, of course, corporate ownership of the song book. This is always the issue with Beatles songs. McCartney and Starr don't need the dough so much...but their lawyers went to college for years, studying the alchemy of getting blood from stones. But I do recall hearing of some rock musicians who refuse to work with Ticketmaster, and who put their stuff on the internet for free...perhaps musicians of that stripe might be willing to license a drum corps to arrange their music for a paltry $10k or so -

It's no wonder Hop and so many other World Class corps directors lose so much sleep. When travel costs alone now equal what an entire season of drum corps cost just 25 years ago...the model IS broken (and I'm most surely NOT a fan of the G7 proposal...).

[garfield]

I'd like to know the costs to write an original show, ala "A Florida Suite". Is it possible that a "group discount" could be arranged by writers who'd like to have the recurring revenue of writing for drum corps each year so that the cost of original music for the activity as a whole could compete with the group licensing we have now?

Could a fraternity of drum corps writers be feasible?

Perhaps these writers could rotate as "at large" commentators (or even music judges) to add depth? A group of them sitting in the pressbox could be worked into the sheets, maybe? And maybe trade their exposure for discounted fees?

Just thinkin'

Edited May 30, 2010 by garfield