skewerz Posted January 31, 2011 Share Posted January 31, 2011 I'm not pulling your leg. Nor am I going to play with your words. I'm going to answer your question seriously even though I suspect you know the answer. Drum corps didn't adopt electronics sooner for several reasons. It feared the backlash of legacy fans. It wanted to learn over time from marching band what's doable and what's not. It waited for the portable technology to improve. But most of all, it waited for convincing evidence of the impact of computers on the musical thinking of our time. Had DCI taken this step in 1995 or even 2000, there would have been no clear indication of the sweeping change that would come with inexpensive access to to computer hardware and software. It was only in the MP3 era that we came to realize that electronic manipulation of the music was no longer the province of specialists. Any high school kid with a computer could do it. The tipping point had arrived. HH which is the exact reason why it shouldn't be done. If anyone can do it, what's the thrill? OMG, I can push this button better than anyone else!!! WOOWOO! It used to be about what noises kids could make come out of their horns and drums with their own given talent...synths nullify that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glory Posted January 31, 2011 Share Posted January 31, 2011 which is the exact reason why it shouldn't be done. If anyone can do it, what's the thrill? OMG, I can push this button better than anyone else!!! WOOWOO! It used to be about what noises kids could make come out of their horns and drums with their own given talent...synths nullify that. It used to be ... It used to be about the music you made with the instruments you carried. It used to be about brass instruments with too few valves. It used to be ... HH Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimF-LowBari Posted January 31, 2011 Share Posted January 31, 2011 It used to be ... It used to be about the music you made with the instruments you carried. It used to be about brass instruments with too few valves. It used to be ... HH And it used to be that people who were not musicians, potential members or family members/friends of marchers used to come to shows in large numbers. But since the great butt-saver of DCI is to be more like marching band and follow more current trands things have gotten so much better..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
audiodb Posted January 31, 2011 Share Posted January 31, 2011 I just want to bring this idea back down to earth, how many fans have been recorded as leaving because of electronics? How did you come to that conclusion? Don't know if you were around back when amplification was approved....a petition was circulated to allow fans opposed to the concept the opportunity to sign up and be counted. Never before (or again) has a drum corps rule change prompted such a reaction. Over 3,600 signatures were logged. Some who signed left comments indicating that they were, in fact, no longer going to attend shows as a result of this change. I don't have a count of how many signees actually left the DCI fan base. On the other hand, I don't have a count of how many left without signing on their way out. I do have access to DCI.org, though, where press releases touted rising overall DCI attendance in 2003. That was the last time DCI has made that claim. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
audiodb Posted February 1, 2011 Share Posted February 1, 2011 Drum corps didn't adopt electronics sooner for several reasons. It feared the backlash of legacy fans. And then, one day they didn't? It wanted to learn over time from marching band what's doable and what's not. Several holes in that theory: 1. They waited over 25 years for this "learning". 2. The debut of electronic amplification among DCI corps was more horribly problem-ridden than the state of the art among their marching band peers. 3. Marching band would not hold all the answers anyway, because there are logistic and environmental differences between the marching band and drum corps situations. Seasonal weather differences cause drum corps to face a far greater likelihood of electrical storms. At the same time, drum corps are more likely to perform in the rain than marching bands (woodwinds and rain are not compatible). And the touring drum corps must practice (and now, find a power feed) in a variety of locations away from home, while the marching band almost always rehearses at their home facility. It waited for the portable technology to improve. They should have waited longer, in that case. So what breakthrough in portable technology came as the 2003 or 2008 votes took place? But most of all, it waited for convincing evidence of the impact of computers on the musical thinking of our time. Had DCI taken this step in 1995 or even 2000, there would have been no clear indication of the sweeping change that would come with inexpensive access to to computer hardware and software. It was only in the MP3 era that we came to realize that electronic manipulation of the music was no longer the province of specialists. Any high school kid with a computer could do it. The tipping point had arrived. So because kids mess around with MP3s, it is now time for adults to mess with mixing boards that control the balance and volume of pit percussion? Sorry, but I don't see a link there. As for the recently-introduced electronic instruments....obviously, the electric guitar was accessible to most any HS kid 30 years ago, and cheap synth keyboards have been around for at least a decade. The timeline still doesn't line up. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted February 1, 2011 Share Posted February 1, 2011 So? Lots of directors didn't vote yes initially. Some of those voted yes subsequently. The change wasn't coerced. The change reflects a new attitude about the value of electronics. That's what Fielder said on DCP. I know y'all would rather it weren't that way. You'd rather misinterpret "one hand behind the back" as evidence of coercion. But Fielder was explicit on DCP that it wasn't that. He said Cavies switched because they recognized the new possibilities. HH sure it wasn't coerced. thats why they added them mid season there's no misinterpretation to it, same as when DanA put his foot in his mouth about DCA corps a bunch of years ago. You choose to buy the CYA spin that followed. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted February 1, 2011 Share Posted February 1, 2011 I guess this is the price we pay for being behind the curve for too long... except it was more popular then. oops 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted February 1, 2011 Share Posted February 1, 2011 You're putting me on, right? You're pulling my leg? About Fielder and the violins? Fiedler's clarification was an explicit rebuke to the false contention that he said amps were required to win today. He said he never said such a thing, hence my warning not to use the Fiedler canard as an excuse why no one wants to do an acoustic show today. The real reason they don't do acoustic any more is it doesn't make sense in the modern context. Electronics are part of the music world. The choice to use them isn't a negative choice; it's a positive one – drum corps WANT to make use of something they believe is useful. That's why all the corps use them. That's why marching bands use them. That's why singers on Broadway use them. That's why they'll be a part of my daughter's middle school play. That's a fact y'all just won't admit. You want to believe drum corps is turning to electronics for desperate reasons. It wants to alienate legacy fans. It wants to be confused with marching band. It ran out of creative ideas. You want to think the desperation will end and time will roll backwards to a golden age without amps or violins. That's denial. Of course drum corps didn't elect to include violins and a whole lot of other instruments that would have brought no currency to the activity. Electronics are different just as Bb was different. Both have currency and utility. Bb brought drum corps into the music mainstream. Electronics too. It's not that G or acoustic didn't work. It's only that both were archaic distinctions that left drum corps outside the stream, the trend and likely the future. You can't blame drum corps' current predicament on electronics either. The 90% of the corps and audience who disappeared vanished long before amps or even Bb. Electronics had nothing to do with their demise. Nor can you rightly attribute recent audience stats to electronics when economic recession has hurt ticket collection for barcodes of all stripes. HH might wanna go read the link he put up. i know, you'll find a way to spin that too 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HockeyDad Posted February 1, 2011 Share Posted February 1, 2011 It used to be ... It used to be about the music you made with the instruments you carried. It used to be about brass instruments with too few valves. It used to be ... HH It used to be Really popular.. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted February 1, 2011 Share Posted February 1, 2011 I'm not pulling your leg. Nor am I going to play with your words. I'm going to answer your question seriously even though I suspect you know the answer. Drum corps didn't adopt electronics sooner for several reasons. It feared the backlash of legacy fans. It wanted to learn over time from marching band what's doable and what's not. It waited for the portable technology to improve. But most of all, it waited for convincing evidence of the impact of computers on the musical thinking of our time. Had DCI taken this step in 1995 or even 2000, there would have been no clear indication of the sweeping change that would come with inexpensive access to to computer hardware and software. It was only in the MP3 era that we came to realize that electronic manipulation of the music was no longer the province of specialists. Any high school kid with a computer could do it. The tipping point had arrived. HH and even then the great savior BOA drew less fans than DCI does. tho if things keep going, that may change too. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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