garfield Posted July 22, 2012 Share Posted July 22, 2012 To return briefly to the OP. Part of the issue here is correlating "success" to placement. Many of the corps in the lower tier of the World Class standings are at least as well managed as the top corps. They have smart, creative, and fiscally prudent directors and boards, excellent staff, supportive alumni, and yes, talented members. That they do not consistently place well does not mean the organizations are in danger, or that they cannot handle a tour (or some version of it), or that they struggle to provide their members with a quality educational experience. One could argue that they actually do more real "education" than the top corps, which are essentially semi-pro at this point, but that's not quite on point here. This is not to say that all is well in DCI land, but let's not make the mistake of conflating competitive prowess with organizational solidity. Let's not make that mistake in particular because that is the mistake that many of the top corps' leaders seem to be making these days.... This is true, and has been true from the beginning. Those of you who rant against the G7 (and I am emphatically on your side) often seem to overlook that it's in many ways a logical end of the financial model that DCI has used for 40 years. That is one which pays corps primarily through competition appearance fees -- fees that are structured based on the previous year's competitive standing. No one ever seemed to complain too much about this until the G7 asked for a much bigger cut. But given the earlier payout structure, it really was only a matter of time until they asked to renegotiate percentages. I think the stability and future of DCI actually rests in going in the exact opposite direction the G7 want to take it, with financing and competition entirely separated from one another. Kids should compete. Corps as organizations should not. Financial rewards should not be based on what a corps puts on the field. They should be based entirely on fiscal and organizational evaluations of the member corps that determine their financial health, organizational solidity, and basic quality of education. For the corps at the top who have multiple revenue streams, I doubt this would detract much from what you see on the field, but on the other end it might level the playing field a bit and perhaps (and more importantly) prevent more Teal Sounds, etc. Drum corps' problems are myriad and complex, but removing direct financial implications from a 10-12 minute performance would go a long way towards creating a healthier and more stable activity. At the very least it would help neutralize the poison in the well and reaffirm the activity's status as an educational nonprofit, which some leaders in the activity seem to have forgotten lately. Whether wiser heads have the political will and ability to prevail is, of course, another matter entirely. A very lucid post. Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KeithHall Posted July 22, 2012 Share Posted July 22, 2012 My idea is catching on aye? Regionalizing is the key! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYLancer81-85 Posted July 23, 2012 Share Posted July 23, 2012 My idea is catching on aye? Regionalizing is the key! I agree with you Kieth. I see Boston took a trip to the West early this season. What was that all about? I guess they can afford it so why not. The minute DCI started to intervene in the scheduling which means corps from certain regions that were now member corps had to travel outside their regions, everything in my eyes took shape. More expenses were the main reasons why we don't see much corps anymore. Why not leave the smaller circuits alone and wait for a major region to have a showdown. I really enjoyed the way it used to be. We never saw the big boys until DCI East, DCI North, DCI Midwest, etc. Now you have corps from the east travelling all the way across country. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYLancer81-85 Posted July 23, 2012 Share Posted July 23, 2012 I think the smaller corps are a large part of what keeps drum corps, drum corps. Don't get me wrong I love the big corps, i.e. Blue Devils, Carolina Crown. But the little guys like Genesis, Forte, Revolution are just as much a corps as the Blue Devils. Well said. I personally enjoy the little guys more so than the big boys. The smaller corps are more enjoyable to me because they remind me of the glory days of drum corps. Nowadays we have corps doing movies, having endorsements with major instrument companies, and selling their sounds to Virtual Instrument Technology Companies. Nothing is wrong with that but it just goes to show why the big corps are trying to get rid of the smaller ones. Lets keep the focus on the youth I say. It doesn't take rocket scientist to figure out what is at work here. Drum Corps kept me off the streets and out of trouble. That is one less person in jail. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GUARDLING Posted July 23, 2012 Share Posted July 23, 2012 Well said. I personally enjoy the little guys more so than the big boys. The smaller corps are more enjoyable to me because they remind me of the glory days of drum corps. Nowadays we have corps doing movies, having endorsements with major instrument companies, and selling their sounds to Virtual Instrument Technology Companies. Nothing is wrong with that but it just goes to show why the big corps are trying to get rid of the smaller ones. Lets keep the focus on the youth I say. It doesn't take rocket scientist to figure out what is at work here. Drum Corps kept me off the streets and out of trouble. That is one less person in jail. unfortunately..you are in the minority...no matter what is said here or other social medias....OC cant even get an active thread going in the OC site here....Someone tried to start one and didnt get much attention..ive seen touring for many years right till now..the stands arent full at all for OC...even lower WC corps suffer the parking lot show ( which I dont get but many love )no matter whats said people run for the big guys..if we want OC or lower WC to thrive..we cant just talk....as the old saying goes , gotta put your money where your mouth is and in this case, gotta do that as well as a butt in the seat. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYLancer81-85 Posted July 24, 2012 Share Posted July 24, 2012 unfortunately..you are in the minority...no matter what is said here or other social medias....OC cant even get an active thread going in the OC site here....Someone tried to start one and didnt get much attention..ive seen touring for many years right till now..the stands arent full at all for OC...even lower WC corps suffer the parking lot show ( which I dont get but many love )no matter whats said people run for the big guys..if we want OC or lower WC to thrive..we cant just talk....as the old saying goes , gotta put your money where your mouth is and in this case, gotta do that as well as a butt in the seat. Relax guy. If you notice I used the word "personally". I know I am in the minority. But I just like to spend my money enjoying the OCs. I more appreciate the groups that build from scratch. I have the same feelings about the New York Yankees and all the other teams that have the money are more popular. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GUARDLING Posted July 24, 2012 Share Posted July 24, 2012 Relax guy. If you notice I used the word "personally". I know I am in the minority. But I just like to spend my money enjoying the OCs. I more appreciate the groups that build from scratch. I have the same feelings about the New York Yankees and all the other teams that have the money are more popular. hey all im saying is its great you like OC and spend time and money supporting it...all Im saying is by many not supporting OC only shows DCI and those who would like OC just went away that there is little support especially financially and very little have intrest putting their butts in the stands..its sad to see how empty even in WC till the big guys come in. thats why i said it can be said over and over here and its great but doesnt mean a thing until money is spent and butts are in the seats and thats almost never happend. you actually was getting a compliment but guess you didnt recognize it...oh well... peace Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackstar Posted July 24, 2012 Share Posted July 24, 2012 I discovered this activity in 1979. Marched one year in 1984. Besides some old Drum Corps Worlds and very old Drum Corps News I didn't know much about then D2 & 3 as well as All Girl corps. The following in 1985 I went to the DC East Championships. While I enjoyed the larger corps it was the smaller division that I feel in love with. I really wish the smaller corps got more love from the fans and DCI. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lynsew Posted July 24, 2012 Share Posted July 24, 2012 I like a lot o ideas from the OP, particularly the idea of a group of lower tier corps who do a short, late tour. I can think of additional benefits as well. You could hold off starting camp until late June which could give more kids a chance to participate who are constrained by high school schedules or kids that got cut late from their top choice full-tour corps. That statement doesn't always hold true, if you get cut from your top choice corps, do you march with a lower corps? If this is true, then why can't Cascades and Pioneer fill the roster? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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