Abuse Vs Teaching

[Big Bad Bari]

Miami 1983

[garfield]

I posted on this thread earlier how during my corps experievce I did not thimk it was abuse. Here is a story that happened with my daughter. Five years ago she is marching with a world class corps to remain nameless. She would text my wife and complain about how hard rehersals were and the treatment she was getting from instructors. I would tell my wife that is part of the corps culture and our daughter would eventually get used to it. The texting went on for weeks about how much she hated it. I would reassure her it will get better. We went to our first show to see her perform in early July. When we saw her after the show she begged to come home with us. She never had a I want to quit attitude before so I was somewhat concerned but told her to get on the bus. Couple weeks later while she is 1500 miles away, my wife and I are enjoying our date night and get a text that she messed up in the show and she was dreading what was going to happen to her afterwards. Later that same evening she calls me hysterical and I can barely understand her. Come to find out the staff had been making her wear an item around her neck that I will not identify but singled her out as a weak person. The staff would making her rep while everyone else got breaks, food/water breaks and other "punishments". Had no idea that this was happening to her so I left a message with the director to call me with an explanation. I got the phone call and asked him about the things my daughter had told me. He claims he new nothing about the incidents. To this day I find that hard to beleive. But after my discussion with the director they backed off. So then I go to DCI finals with some old corps buddys to watch my daughter perform. Told them what had happened and they thought this was rather excessive punishment. I told them it's too bad that she had to go through this and told them my daughter said she is never going to march again. Come October my daughtr asks if she could go to auditions. I was shocked! So she went back 3 more years. Marched with broken ribs, broken nose, broken fingers and was captain her final two years. So was this abuse? As a father who loves his kid it was. As an outsider it would be abuse. Was the final outcome positive? You be the judge. She is not emotionally or physically damaged from the experience. She is much more confident in herself and lifes challenges. Not all kids may have had the same outcome. It worked out for my kid but what about other stories similar that broke a kids spirit and suffer still. There is a fine line and when you cross that line you never know what may come of it. It has the potential for long term effects. These are human beings with feelings and emotions. People put in charge to instruct, teach, mentor and motivate must do so with great wisdom.

OMG, this made my eyes water!

What a tough gal your daughter must be! Not because they beat her up emotionally, but because she found the strength to endure the azzholes who put her through it.

She can be my wingman anytime. ($1 to Iceman)

[MikeD]

I posted on this thread earlier how during my corps experievce I did not thimk it was abuse. Here is a story that happened with my daughter. Five years ago she is marching with a world class corps to remain nameless. She would text my wife and complain about how hard rehersals were and the treatment she was getting from instructors. I would tell my wife that is part of the corps culture and our daughter would eventually get used to it. The texting went on for weeks about how much she hated it. I would reassure her it will get better. We went to our first show to see her perform in early July. When we saw her after the show she begged to come home with us. She never had a I want to quit attitude before so I was somewhat concerned but told her to get on the bus. Couple weeks later while she is 1500 miles away, my wife and I are enjoying our date night and get a text that she messed up in the show and she was dreading what was going to happen to her afterwards. Later that same evening she calls me hysterical and I can barely understand her. Come to find out the staff had been making her wear an item around her neck that I will not identify but singled her out as a weak person. The staff would making her rep while everyone else got breaks, food/water breaks and other "punishments". Had no idea that this was happening to her so I left a message with the director to call me with an explanation. I got the phone call and asked him about the things my daughter had told me. He claims he new nothing about the incidents. To this day I find that hard to beleive. But after my discussion with the director they backed off. So then I go to DCI finals with some old corps buddys to watch my daughter perform. Told them what had happened and they thought this was rather excessive punishment. I told them it's too bad that she had to go through this and told them my daughter said she is never going to march again. Come October my daughtr asks if she could go to auditions. I was shocked! So she went back 3 more years. Marched with broken ribs, broken nose, broken fingers and was captain her final two years. So was this abuse? As a father who loves his kid it was. As an outsider it would be abuse. Was the final outcome positive? You be the judge. She is not emotionally or physically damaged from the experience. She is much more confident in herself and lifes challenges. Not all kids may have had the same outcome. It worked out for my kid but what about other stories similar that broke a kids spirit and suffer still. There is a fine line and when you cross that line you never know what may come of it. It has the potential for long term effects. These are human beings with feelings and emotions. People put in charge to instruct, teach, mentor and motivate must do so with great wisdom.

This is just MHO...

to me, your daughter overcame what I would absolutely consider to be abusive behavior by staff members. If I were in a position of authority in such a group, and I got wind of something like that...and verified that it was indeed true...the staff members involved would be former staff members.

Kudos to your daughter, however, for being a better person than the person (or people) who operated in such an unprofessional manner.

[c mor]

This is just MHO...

to me, your daughter overcame what I would absolutely consider to be abusive behavior by staff members. If I were in a position of authority in such a group, and I got wind of something like that...and verified that it was indeed true...the staff members involved would be former staff members.

Kudos to your daughter, however, for being a better person than the person (or people) who operated in such an unprofessional manner.

I agree with you and garfield.

I was apprehensive to read the post. I kept expecting a negative outcome.

I can't imagine being a parent receiving that call from the corps director.

[cowtown]

Outside of certain, clearly defined boundaries a lot of it is defined by perspectives.

Marching in the early 80’s, the conditions alone (i.e.; food, transportation) would be considered abuse by today’s standards so I don’t have too much to say as my perspective is clearly outdated

[drumno5]

Outside of certain, clearly defined boundaries a lot of it is defined by perspectives.

Marching in the early 80’s, the conditions alone (i.e.; food, transportation) would be considered abuse by today’s standards so I don’t have too much to say as my perspective is clearly outdated

But I don't think the o.p. is talking about the food or the buses or other organizational/logistical aspects of the corps experience,'town. They're talking more about how the staff/instructors treat the kids during rehearsal.

Peace,

Fred O.

[luv4corps]

Personally, I never saw anything like that. Marching corps is HARD, hardest, most demanding, physically draining, mentally draining, emotionally draining thing I have EVER done. Not even boot camp half way compared to marching corps, in fact I remember thinking boot was almost a joke. You constantly chase perfection, so yes, you get yelled at, called out, singled out, do push ups, run, do track work, etc...but, it is to break you down, to get to the core, raw self of who you are, and then you are built back up into an intense monster performer who wants more. I don't know how the simple act of marching wouldn't be looked at to an outsider as abuse. We did track work in Virginia, and when we finished, the pit arrived and when a girl in the pit saw the look on our faces, the intensity, she literally starting crying. You're gonna get yelled at, and if you are sticking out, you're gonna get yelled at more, if you're bringing up the rear, yep, getting scalded, constantly make the same mistake, more trouble. But it's not abuse, it's what is required to achieve the amazing results we see on the field...again, my personal experience. It's not abuse, it's being forged into steel.

And I'll add this...yes it was hard. But it was the single most rewarding thing I have ever done. I KNEW if I could get through that there is not a thing in this world I can't do, and I carry that with me today, at 43, I still have those lessons. And anything that is a life changer shouldn't be easy to attain. I am forever grateful and what I did and what I learned.

Last thing I'll say on this...it's also why your kid isn't paying attention to what a third party judge thinks of the show or where they are ranked. It's not about that. It's about being the best you can be, and learning what it takes to be perfect, understanding that the only thing that matters is those who are right there with you day in and day out, busting their arse in the ultimate pursuit of perfection...I see so many parents/fans complaining about why they aren't scoring higher. Marching corps is a personal journey, it is NOT about some dude in a green shirt running around the field talking into a recorder. Yes, that matters, but don't march a drum corps if you want outside gratification. You will absolutely hate it if that is your motivation.

As someone who has never marched, this is a really nice window into what drum corps is about. Very succinct. My son has alluded to all of these things as the reasons he has gone back to get his butt kicked for four years straight now, but here it all is in a nutshell.

Edited July 26, 2013 by luv4corps