skevinp Posted August 2, 2013 Share Posted August 2, 2013 (edited) yes - that's what it means. The Buffalo show is heavily weighted. . Wow, if that is the case I really don't like that. It renders each ofthe other TOC shows almost meaningless scorewise and gives a ridiculously exalted significance to one show for no good reason. Not only that, but it increases the chances of just having the same winner as finals, making it even less meaningfully distinctive. I had thought one good thing about the TOC is it would reward the corps that did the best over the entire season. So much for that. . Edited August 3, 2013 by skevinp Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quad Aces Posted August 2, 2013 Share Posted August 2, 2013 No, it means the Buffalo show alone counts just as much as the aggregate of the previous 6 shows. So can the math work out to where the Cavaliers can still win the award? If so, then what's the point? No disrespect to the Cavaliers - I'm a big fan of the corps. I'm just looking at the rankings as-is when asking the question above. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
perc2100 Posted August 2, 2013 Share Posted August 2, 2013 Maybe because I'm a big soccer fan, but in think this is cool: a trophy is a trophy, and a title is a title. Period. The ToC Cup is likely not as prestigious as DCI WC Champion, but it's still cool. In the course of a European league soccer season, there are several "side" tournaments: national 'Cup,' (ex English FA Cup), the Champions League (similar to ToC, the top few teams from every top flight league in Europe), The Europa League (similar to Champs League with secondary 'tier' of league teams), etc. on the National level we have the World Cup, UEFA European Championship, Confederations Cup, CONCACAF Gold Cup, etc. In my experience as a fan, the fan that says "that cup doesn't mean as much..." is likely the fan of a losing club ;-) The winner of the ToC Cup will be happy, and I'd be excited if other 'side tournaments' develop (come one BAC, Scouts, BK, etc) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
perc2100 Posted August 2, 2013 Share Posted August 2, 2013 . Wow, if that is the case I really don't like that. It renders each ofthe other TOC shows almost meaningless scorewise and gives a ridiculously exalted significance to one show for no good reason. Not only that, but it increases the chances of just having the same winner as finals, making it even less meaningfully distinctive. I had thought one good thing about the TOC is it would reward the corps that did the best over the entire season. So much for that. . Yeah, maybe an 'average' winner would make things more interesting. If they're gonna make the final show be the main determining factor, maybe averaging should just be dropped? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShortAndFast Posted August 2, 2013 Share Posted August 2, 2013 It's an equivalent of the Spirit of Disney award. A meaningless "award" hanging like a loose thread on a suit coat. The members know which award really matters in the activity. So I can't imagine anyone actually caring enough to be upset about it. Actually, I think there's quite a bit of merit in a "Spirit of Disney" or "Fan Network" award for audience-friendly shows. DCI should recognize and reward shows that the fans love, separate from shows that have the excellence required to win. Only one group is going to win, but Surf 2012 proves that all can aspire to fielding an audience favorite. I don't really see the point of the TOC Cup however. It's won on the same sheets that decide the DCI champion, it's just handed out a few days earlier. There's nothing unique being rewarded. If you get the cup but not the ring, it just means someone else caught you at the end of the year. BTW, don't you think it's a little insulting to suggest that the Spirit of Disney awards were meaningless to the corps that received them. All else equal, wouldn't you rather be recognized for your entertainment value than not? 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
perc2100 Posted August 2, 2013 Share Posted August 2, 2013 Actually, I think there's quite a bit of merit in a "Spirit of Disney" or "Fan Network" award for audience-friendly shows. DCI should recognize and reward shows that the fans love, separate from shows that have the excellence required to win. Only one group is going to win, but Surf 2012 proves that all can aspire to fielding an audience favorite. I don't really see the point of the TOC Cup however. It's won on the same sheets that decide the DCI champion, it's just handed out a few days earlier. There's nothing unique being rewarded. If you get the cup but not the ring, it just means someone else caught you at the end of the year. BTW, don't you think it's a little insulting to suggest that the Spirit of Disney awards were meaningless to the corps that received them. All else equal, wouldn't you rather be recognized for your entertainment value than not? On the flip side, the Disney thing was pretty nebulous without clear defined rubric. At least ToC Cup is awarded based on high achievement Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KAW Posted August 2, 2013 Share Posted August 2, 2013 Actually, I think there's quite a bit of merit in a "Spirit of Disney" or "Fan Network" award for audience-friendly shows. DCI should recognize and reward shows that the fans love, separate from shows that have the excellence required to win. Only one group is going to win, but Surf 2012 proves that all can aspire to fielding an audience favorite. I don't really see the point of the TOC Cup however. It's won on the same sheets that decide the DCI champion, it's just handed out a few days earlier. There's nothing unique being rewarded. If you get the cup but not the ring, it just means someone else caught you at the end of the year. BTW, don't you think it's a little insulting to suggest that the Spirit of Disney awards were meaningless to the corps that received them. All else equal, wouldn't you rather be recognized for your entertainment value than not? Is bet a cold beer that very few MMs even know there is a Disney award. Furthermore, I'm willing to bet they don't know there is a TOC champion either, it's just another show that requires a little extra prep because of the extra stuff. They focus on beating their perceived competition, without regard to the venue or the format. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skywhopper Posted August 3, 2013 Share Posted August 3, 2013 That said, perhaps it's time to think of it a different way: When it's tried with the gusto that their proposal suggested it will produce one of two results, either it will succeed or it won't. If it succeeds, perhaps it will highlight or introduce concepts that DCI can implement to make the tour better and all corps can learn from. So, the question is: what is the goal of the TOC? We have to understand what is being attempted before we can judge whether it succeeded or failed. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sobe Posted August 3, 2013 Share Posted August 3, 2013 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sobe Posted August 3, 2013 Share Posted August 3, 2013 It'll be like the Western and Eastern Cups in the NHL. Nobody will want to touch it, as to not jinx their chances at the Stanley Cup. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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