yellow jacket Posted August 5, 2013 Share Posted August 5, 2013 I think if its used tastefully and blended well it can be a nice effect. The problem is that it often isn't. Another issue is that they set levels for these synths from the box, so it may sound badly blended if your sitting on the 30 yard line 3 rows up but actually sounds pretty blended from the box. Seems like a lot of corps have been fielding smaller tuba lines recently because of this addition. I remember a few years ago when crown was touting 20 tuba players. Now the most we see is around 12-13. Seems like they are having one player (synth) cover the parts of a few people so they can add membership in other sections of the corps. Scouts had 20 tubas a couple of years back. I tend to see 15-16 tubas as a regular staple when I watch videos of current corps. I think the answer to this "synth helping the bass" problem is to balance out the horn line better. I agree with other posters about the synth over-powering some of the portions of the shows. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeD Posted August 5, 2013 Share Posted August 5, 2013 In general I like the added low range of the synth. It enhances the overall sound of the ensemble. It has to be balanced with the rest of the ensemble, of course, as with any voice, be it trumpet, tuba or snares..etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luv4corps Posted August 5, 2013 Share Posted August 5, 2013 (edited) It's not just the contras that get doubled. In the Cadets show this year in particular, the midranges are being supported by the synth as well, but this has happened a lot over the past four years. The synth has such a presence in shows these days that I feel like it should have a separate caption. But then that would just encourage more and bolder use of the synth, so forget I said anything. I haven't even been a fan of drum corps long enough to be "old school" and yet I'm already sick of synth - and I'm a keys player myself! I agree that as things stand now it IS a caption that should never be a caption. IMO nothing on the planet can beat those pure brass long tones or blasts, those pure brass park and barks, those pure brass ballads. If I had it my way the synth would be outta there. Even since last year, there is WAY more. It's multiplying. Kind of like tribbles. Showing up over here... oh... now it's over there. Edited August 5, 2013 by luv4corps 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluesman Posted August 5, 2013 Share Posted August 5, 2013 You would think that in the ten years since it has been introduced they could figure out how to get a consistent, balanced and non- distracting sound from bass doubling. Was there really a need for it in the first place. You would think that considering all of the problems with bass doubling someone with the corps would get frustrated enough to just say no. It is unneeded and from the look of this poll it is also very unpopular. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N.E. Brigand Posted August 5, 2013 Share Posted August 5, 2013 You would think that in the ten years since it has been introduced they could figure out how to get a consistent, balanced and non- distracting sound from bass doubling. It's only been five seasons since synth was added. Pit amps were approved for 2004; electronics for 2009. Still lots of time! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluesman Posted August 5, 2013 Share Posted August 5, 2013 It's only been five seasons since synth was added. Pit amps were approved for 2004; electronics for 2009. Still lots of time! My apologies..... allow me to re-state. You would think that in the five years since it has been introduced they could figure out how to get a consistent, balanced and non- distracting sound from bass doubling. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turnadot Posted August 5, 2013 Share Posted August 5, 2013 I think enhancing the low end is almost a must now since finals are in LOS. The tuba sound does not carry all the way up to the 600 level seats as well as the trumpet timbre does. Also, I think when performing indoors, you could never have enough tubas to fill up LOS when playing backfield. To fill up LOS and create a different effect and timbre for the corps backfield requires a good pad bass patch. I also think when done well, having a pad bass playing an octave below the tubas gives a wonderful full sound to the group and adds some great overtones. Balancing a keyboard in a new environment every night is very difficult. Even if a corps has a practice day in the stadium that they will perform in that same night, the stadium accoustics will be totally different that night when it is full of people. It is a unique skill to be able to select to right patch and volume for the keyboard player. When done well it can really enhance the overall sound of the group, however when not done well can destroy the whole show of even the best groups. I feel the keyboard player is the single most important person in the corps as they can impact the overall show more than any other single person. This is still a relatively new addition to drum corps and I feel the importance of finding the right person to tech the synth player is highly undervalued. Like it or not, the tech for the synth player is more important than any other tech on the field. I prefer for the synth to be felt and not heard, unless being used for a special effect, but sadly many do not go with this philosophy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonnyboy Posted August 5, 2013 Share Posted August 5, 2013 Phantom is the biggest offender in DCI when it comes to abusing low-end synth this year. When they chose to go amp-free in Jackson, NJ a month ago it was easy to see why. Their tuba line was exposed big time. Never heard a note they played that night. Cadets have been too when I've seen them, though it was less of an issue Friday night. Phantom did go amp free in Jackson, NJ due to wet conditions. Funny, but their next show (with amps) the relative score spread didn't change much with the closest competitors. Jackson NJ 6/28/13 1 The Cadets 77.600 2 Phantom Regiment 73.900 (3.7 below Cadets and .7 above Bluecoats) show with no electronics 3 Bluecoats 73.200 4 Boston Crusaders 69.200 5 Jersey Surf 52.400 Quincy, MA 6/29/131 1 The Cadets 78.000 2 Phantom Regiment 74.400 (3.3 below Cadets and .9 above Bluecoats) show with electronics 3 Bluecoats 73.500 4 Boston Crusaders 70.400 5 Jersey Surf 56.200 I would think if the judges were taking amps/electronics into consideration the spread would have changed more? Is amping only worth a few tenths? Other factors are at play, but it's food for thought. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skywhopper Posted August 5, 2013 Share Posted August 5, 2013 Sometimes I think it's needed to "help" out the brass section but its not needed all of the time. For example, there is this one baritone lick in the bluecoats show this year and its over-powered by a synth because they needed "help" projecting it. I wouldn't mind as much if the synth wasn't over-powering the baritones at that part See, my opinion is that if the brass needs help, then either they are staged poorly, the part is written poorly, or they are playing it poorly. And the judges and audience should be able to hear that. I don't want the most pristine possible sound, I want the real sound being achieved by real people. Except in rare cases of piano features, synth sound is not being achieved in any sense of the word. Anyone with rudimentary piano skills can double or supplement the brass parts, or play a bassline or hold a chord or two. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skywhopper Posted August 5, 2013 Share Posted August 5, 2013 You would think that in the ten years since it has been introduced they could figure out how to get a consistent, balanced and non- distracting sound from bass doubling. Was there really a need for it in the first place. You would think that considering all of the problems with bass doubling someone with the corps would get frustrated enough to just say no. It is unneeded and from the look of this poll it is also very unpopular. The problem is that the amps are positioned in fixed locations in front of the pit. The brass is much further back on the field. Balance can be achieved, but only for certain parts of the audience. And the professional staffer who's controlling that balance is aiming for the press box. Unfortunately, this means that large portions of the actual audience are getting too much bass and other synth. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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