NR_Ohiobando Posted July 12, 2014 Share Posted July 12, 2014 (edited) A lot of "new schoolers" have said for years that the activity's target audience is directed at "middle school, high school, and college music students" and if that is true.....and THIS ^^^.....is true, then I guess it really doesn't matter what the "legacy fans think". As they say, "it's not the legacy fan's activity" anymore. So if today's drum corps kid finds today's modern shows with electronics, all brass and dare I even say woodwinds, so be it. I can say this, the crowds attending the shows and movie theaters certainly speaks for itself. Legacy fans love to "boycott"....but does anyone even notice...is perhaps the real question. Things that make you go "hmmmmmmmm". I've always likened it to a Michael Bay system. Michael Bay films keep making so much money despite being some of the worst films you'll ever see. They might be awful films, but they simply carry singular repetitive and cheaply manipulative moments that very often are unearned and forced in simply to have a known conditioned effect on the viewer. Bay knows his audience is mostly teens and tweens who are satisfied with that amount of entertainment. He doesn't make films to win oscars, or to make an emotional impact on anyone. He knows explosions, shoehorned love stories, immature humor, hypersexualization, and telling instead of showing is more manipulative for the average and below average viewers. Hence, he keeps making them and they keep making money. Likewise, DCI tends to reward "moments" and "more" instead of something that is more cohesive. If you back away from the biggest possible moment and utilize something less, you won't get points. * About to finish the end of a phrase? 8 Count major chord with a flag toss. Simply letting it settle or end with less duration isn't as cheaply manipulative/effective. * Doing a show about 1930 or is called "E=mc2"? Better stick a drill set that literally spells out 1930 or E=mc2 because that'll definitely get the point across. Anything less wouldn't be as obvious or effective. * Did we pass a rule allowing new instrumentation? You better use it, because we're going to reward you for utilizing new things regardless of the quality or synergy it presents to the show. Or how cheaply it adds to the bassline... * Do you have more money than 90% of DCI? Are you utilizing it to pay for gigantic props, stages, and mirrors that other corps cannot afford to tour with? We'll totally reward you for doing something new over the lower corps, essentially creating a subtle pay-to-score-better system. And it's not like Madison is innocent of these things either. They've been using body movement as much as anyone since 2010. They also are more guilty of thunderous goo over the past 4 years than most corps. It's also not the only reason they're stuck in 8-12th place; design wise Madison shows are always fairly inefficient. They aren't too cheap compared to other corps, but they are definitely inefficient. it's just sad to see that "More" really is a part of the scoresheet now. And explosions. Edited July 12, 2014 by NR_Ohiobando Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billj Posted July 12, 2014 Share Posted July 12, 2014 Long time Madison fan & sad to see the decline in the 2000's. All I've seen this year is an early season video (not great coverage) on youtube. My feelings after one viewing: Disappointed in the music arranging - the promise of Kenton & Ellis, especially Niner Two and Open Wide let me down a lot by what sounds like chop & bop to me. Madison is loved for playing SONGS. Let them PLAY SONGS, not just a phrase or two from some great songs! Disappointed in the drill & visual approach - I don't know how else to describe the visual design other than (sorry to repeat) chop & bop - not a good flow at all due to lots of stops & starts and marching as the fast tempos and all of the choreography. Disappointed in the uniforms - not a great look and highlights every issue in marching and visual in the unnecessarily difficult visual design. And now, the addition of a giant prop, while it may fit the theme, is disappointing. Madison used to sell their shows simply through their marching, playing & spinning. They didn't need any stinking props. Again, I'm just a long-time drum corps fan and just one viewing of a video, so maybe I missed some things. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
somerville Posted July 12, 2014 Share Posted July 12, 2014 think so? I actually thought it was the cleanest Scouts guards in years..especially at early viewings..some great moments of musicality. Have to look again Well they are getting beat by Troopers which probably isn't a good sign and their staging is pretty poor in my humble opinion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GUARDLING Posted July 12, 2014 Share Posted July 12, 2014 Long time Madison fan & sad to see the decline in the 2000's. All I've seen this year is an early season video (not great coverage) on youtube. My feelings after one viewing: Disappointed in the music arranging - the promise of Kenton & Ellis, especially Niner Two and Open Wide let me down a lot by what sounds like chop & bop to me. Madison is loved for playing SONGS. Let them PLAY SONGS, not just a phrase or two from some great songs! Disappointed in the drill & visual approach - I don't know how else to describe the visual design other than (sorry to repeat) chop & bop - not a good flow at all due to lots of stops & starts and marching as the fast tempos and all of the choreography. Disappointed in the uniforms - not a great look and highlights every issue in marching and visual in the unnecessarily difficult visual design. And now, the addition of a giant prop, while it may fit the theme, is disappointing. Madison used to sell their shows simply through their marching, playing & spinning. They didn't need any stinking props. Again, I'm just a long-time drum corps fan and just one viewing of a video, so maybe I missed some things. I usually try not to get into conversations like this for many reasons BUT I think maybe Madison needs to be cut some slack. Sure we all loved the Madison of the past BUT we need to give them credit for trying to find their way, the balance of old and new to please many many people, the fine line between old and new. IMO, MAdison can not be the MAdison of the past solely. It is 2014 . If any corps decided to do that they would be on the outside looking in for sure. This corps in my opinion is trying to please all at least ( maybe thats the problem ) Most all corps have no problem moving on but \Madison at least is trying AGAIN maybe thats the problem. Sure there are many things I dont care for either. Madison needs to be a corps of 2014 and not the 70s or 80s. they need to compete to stay relevant and they need to do it their way. Maybe they are trying to hard. There are things I like much better about this year and things not so much but I gotta give them credit for trying to please so many....and you know how that old saying goes. Good Luck Scouts Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GUARDLING Posted July 12, 2014 Share Posted July 12, 2014 Well they are getting beat by Troopers which probably isn't a good sign and their staging is pretty poor in my humble opinion. i think alot of their staging in the beginning is very good and yes then there are staging issues..lots of potential. but we all know potential needs to be used or its nothing more than potential. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HornTeacher Posted July 12, 2014 Share Posted July 12, 2014 Old saying with reality twist : "You can please some of the people some of the time, all of the people some of the time, some of the people all of the time, but all of the people....never." 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GUARDLING Posted July 12, 2014 Share Posted July 12, 2014 Old saying with reality twist : "You can please some of the people some of the time, all of the people some of the time, some of the people all of the time, but all of the people....never." exactly! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billj Posted July 12, 2014 Share Posted July 12, 2014 I usually try not to get into conversations like this for many reasons BUT I think maybe Madison needs to be cut some slack. Sure we all loved the Madison of the past BUT we need to give them credit for trying to find their way, the balance of old and new to please many many people, the fine line between old and new. IMO, MAdison can not be the MAdison of the past solely. It is 2014 . If any corps decided to do that they would be on the outside looking in for sure. This corps in my opinion is trying to please all at least ( maybe thats the problem ) Most all corps have no problem moving on but \Madison at least is trying AGAIN maybe thats the problem. Sure there are many things I dont care for either. Madison needs to be a corps of 2014 and not the 70s or 80s. they need to compete to stay relevant and they need to do it their way. Maybe they are trying to hard. There are things I like much better about this year and things not so much but I gotta give them credit for trying to please so many....and you know how that old saying goes. Good Luck Scouts Let me clarify: I'm not one of those people that wants Madison to play Malaguena or Malaga every year and have a rotating company front. I'd like to think that they can design shows and arrange music that are competitive AND still crowd appealing in a unique, Madison way. My overall disappointment is that they seem to have lost their identify and they don't really have a strong, unique style any longer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueByYou2000 Posted July 12, 2014 Share Posted July 12, 2014 I would say in person this show is much better (entertainment wise) than on video. That said, the white really exposes the marching/choreography weaknesses in the corps. I guess as a life long fan, my concern is more why they have not improved placement wise. Looks like another 9 th -10 th place show this year. Not that that's a horrible thing, but it would be nice to see some major changes that would mimic what Corps above them are doing artistically and design wise. You have to look no farther than this years Cavaliers to realize what a new direction can do for success. Either way, I love the Scouts and know they are busting their tails everyday. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GUARDLING Posted July 12, 2014 Share Posted July 12, 2014 Let me clarify: I'm not one of those people that wants Madison to play Malaguena or Malaga every year and have a rotating company front. I'd like to think that they can design shows and arrange music that are competitive AND still crowd appealing in a unique, Madison way. My overall disappointment is that they seem to have lost their identify and they don't really have a strong, unique style any longer. I didnt think you were just coming down on them. I agree and I do think they might be trying to do just what you say..find themselves. When they do though it may or may not be what some want and that should be ok.........................malaguena....lol..as much as some hate it...its a great drum corps song...lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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