Members have changed so why not the activity

[seen-it-all]

Just want to point out that in DCI, the guard isn't performing live music while they're competing.

That is correct. But in order to compete in drum corps, there needs to be live musical performance coming from somewhere on that field of competition. After all, the pit doesn't march. They stand still and play but we don't refer to the activity as concert band. Again we come to that hybrid thing I was referring to. A lot going on in terms of defining exactly where drum corps "fits."

For what it's worth, though, in regards to your point about the color guard, I consider indoor guard a lot closer to being a sport (as it is defined by the overwhelming majority of people on this planet) than drum corps or marching band is.

[Stu]

Nope. There is no sport in the world (that I know of anyway) that requires its athletes to perform live music while competing. There is an existing paradigm of athletes interpreting pre-recorded music, but that requires no actual demonstration of the ability to perform music. And yes, the demonstration of that ability does make a difference.

As for definitions, you brought up the term "art form." That could describe a great many things, including many widely accepted sports (or elements of sport), and including drum corps I guess. I referred to drum corps as a hybrid sort of thing because I really don't know how to classify it exactly. I certainly don't consider it a sport (because it's NOT), but I don't know that I consider it art either, as there is more going on that just musical performance. It is its own thing, and that's perfectly fine. It occupies several spheres in the Venn Diagram of competitive activities. There's room for athleticism. Room for musicality. Room for artistic expression. Room for competition. Better, in my opinion, than just sport, or just art.

Various Dictionary Definitions of the word ‘Sport’:

A game, competition, or activity needing physical effort and skill that is played or done according to rules.

An athletic activity requiring skill or physical prowess and often of a competitive nature.

Any physical activity or experience that gives enjoyment or recreation; pastime; diversion esp. when competitive, requiring more or less vigorous bodily exertion and carried on, sometimes as a profession, according to some traditional form or set of rules.

An activity involving physical exertion and skill in which an individual or team competes against another or others for entertainment.

All of these definitions certainly are applicable to the Drum Corps activity irrespective if the musical athletes play instruments and march choreography or not; therefore DCI is, by definition, a ‘Sport’ (unless, of course, you want to be obtuse and continue to argue with the definitions provided by Merriam-Webster, Oxford, Cambridge, etc)

[Stu]

According to that what wouldn't be considered a sport?

Let us consider the activity of Running. According to the various dictionary definitions of the word 'Sport':

Running to flag down a cab in order to make it to your office workplace on time would not be considered a Running 'Sport'; however...

Running for the sake of enjoyment, health, or competition would be considered a Running 'Sport'.

[Stu]

... I consider ...

Well shucks; sorry to inform ya that the dictionary definitions of the word 'Sport', as well as the common usage and common understanding of the word 'Sport', overrides the bolded self-defining reasoning you provided above.

[jjeffeory]

Wait! How did you get that tilde abor your 'e'? I've always wondered.

If you're on Windows and probably on Mac:

Press and hold 'Alt' type 0233 = é

Release 'Alt' key. Pain in the rear, but looks pretty...

You can look up the keystroke codes in Character Map in Windows. Character map can be opened via the command line or Run Command dialog using the 'charmap' command.

Edited March 1, 2014 by jjeffeory

[Stu]

Wait! How did you get that tilde abor your 'e'? I've always wondered.

abor your'e? Well, I guess we are discussing creating your own definitions within your own language syntax!!!

[jjeffeory]

That is correct. But in order to compete in drum corps, there needs to be live musical performance coming from somewhere on that field of competition. After all, the pit doesn't march. They stand still and play but we don't refer to the activity as concert band. Again we come to that hybrid thing I was referring to. A lot going on in terms of defining exactly where drum corps "fits."

For what it's worth, though, in regards to your point about the color guard, I consider indoor guard a lot closer to being a sport (as it is defined by the overwhelming majority of people on this planet) than drum corps or marching band is.

I'm on the fence. Basically an outdoor guard treats the brass and percussion as accompanyment just as an Indoor guard would treat a recording. I don't see much of a difference from their perspective, and probably a great reason why many guard people don't care about the brass and percussion traditions of "Drum Corps". I'm sure I'll digress more given time, so I won't write any more.

[seen-it-all]

All of these definitions certainly are applicable to the Drum Corps activity irrespective if the musical athletes play instruments and march choreography or not; therefore DCI is, by definition, a ‘Sport’ (unless, of course, you want to be obtuse and continue to argue with the definitions provided by Merriam-Webster, Oxford, Cambridge, etc)

Then by all means, it's only a matter of time before the whole world comes to accept what is clearly obvious and they'll all be calling drum corps a sport.

In all seriousness, it's clear that you're not going to change how I feel about this and I'm not going to change how you feel. More to the point, no matter what any dictionary says, neither you nor I nor anyone here will able to convince the greater population (other than those who have any idea what the drum corps activity is) that it's a sport. I'm OK with that. You seem to be really bothered by it. But hey, if it makes you sleep better at night calling it a sport, go for it. I'll even join you. Drum corps is a sport. Hooray! (even though it's really not...)

By the way, how does Merriam-Webster, Oxford, Cambridge, et al, define "drum corps?" Do they call it as a sport? Somehow I don't think you'll even find "drum corps" defined in any of those books or online. Wait a minute. That must mean............DRUM CORPS DOESN'T EXIST!!!

[Stu]

Then by all means, it's only a matter of time before the whole world comes to accept what is clearly obvious and they'll all be calling drum corps a sport.

In all seriousness, it's clear that you're not going to change how I feel about this and I'm not going to change how you feel. More to the point, no matter what any dictionary says, neither you nor I nor anyone here will able to convince the greater population (other than those who have any idea what the drum corps activity is) that it's a sport. I'm OK with that. You seem to be really bothered by it. But hey, if it makes you sleep better at night calling it a sport, go for it. I'll even join you. Drum corps is a sport. Hooray! (even though it's really not...)

By the way, how does Merriam-Webster, Oxford, Cambridge, et al, define "drum corps?" Do they call it as a sport? Somehow I don't think you'll even find "drum corps" defined in any of those books or online. Wait a minute. That must mean............DRUM CORPS DOESN'T EXIST!!!

Yes or No:

Is DCI a competition, or activity, which needs the participants to exert physical effort and skill according to rules?

Is DCI an activity requiring skill or physical prowess and competitive in nature?

Is DCI an activity or experience that gives enjoyment or recreation; pastime; diversion when done in a competitive manner, requiring more or less vigorous bodily exertion and carried on according to some traditional form or set of rules.

Is DCI an activity involving physical exertion and skill in which an individual or team competes against another or others for entertainment?

[BRASSO]

many guard people don't care about the brass and percussion traditions of "Drum Corps".

Thats understandable to me. There is no compelling reason for them to. The Brass and Percussion people ( even fans) need to consider if they have not already ( for just one example )of how more important a single Guard performer is today in competition compared with a single brass performer in competition. They are not treated equally at all under the current judging sheets. The Guard performer has more potential value in garnering build up points for his or her Corps than the single brass player does. Additionallly, I don't think that there is much disagreement that today we tend to find our soloists that are prominently displayed front and center to audiences and to judges are increasingly coming from a Guard performer, not from the Brass ( or Percussion ). It is almost without exceptiion that it is the Guard that most effectively carries the theme to audiences and judges today.. not Brass, nor Percussion. And are the Show Designers for most of these Corps shows coming from the Percussion side people in all these Corps? I know, I know, its a question we all know the answer too.. haha ! Most eveyone knows from what background most of the Show Designers are coming from now these days. While its true that a few come from the Brass realm, the majoriity of the Show Designs come from people that were marinated in the Guard world. So when you state that" many guard don't care about the brass and percussion traditions of Drum Corps", this certainly seems like a reason that can be readily determined as to the Why, while also agreeing with this fundamentally correct assessment and observation as well.

Edited March 1, 2014 by BRASSO