perc2100 Posted September 16, 2014 Share Posted September 16, 2014 This relatively low percussion score in a winning DCI performance is not exactly new. BD won in 1980 coming in 7th in drumming execution. And Cadets 84 (IIRC, Tom Aungst was in that snare line with Cadets, and his son was in Crown's snare line in 2013 - both w/Thom Hannum as Caption Head) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
perc2100 Posted September 16, 2014 Share Posted September 16, 2014 I'm sorry but I can name at least 5 Open Class lines that should have cleaned the floor with them! 7th place my foot! more like 17th Yo! I'm sorry, but no you couldn't. Looking at recaps it doesn't look like ANY Open Class percussion section beat Carolina Crown ever last year. I know you're a homer, and homers are likely to speak crazy rhetoric, but in this case I have to call you out on your gross error. It doesn't look like ANY Open Class percussion section placed in the Top 15, let alone close to Crown. In fact, the highest placing Open Class corps (BDB) was nearly 3 POINTS behind Crown placing 18th. Again, I get the homerism, and cheering on the home team but lets be real, here: Crown was not really in the same league as BD, SCV, Bluecoats, Cadets and Cavaliers in percussion but they were still pretty solid in the grand scheme of the activity. And Blue Devils B (and every other Open Class corps) were no where near Crown either. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Freedman Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 For a non-percussionist fan perspective, I thought Crown's percussion was great. In terms of exciting arrangement, the feature in the middle (just before the snare drop) was wonderful in the combination of battery and front ensemble. It's in my head a lot. It was just musically great stuff. And the muffler thing was fun, even if it may not have shown off skills as effectively. It was a great show. That doesn't mean the demand or execution was there, of course, but the "Pete GE" was great. Ultimately the level of any line at the end of the year is based more than anything else on the level of those kids coming in. Presumably the relative scores were similar in the first shows of the season to the scores at the end, right? If so, then Crown is just not drawing quite the talent of other corps from a DCI judge metric standpoint. But I bet they would pass easily as good enough for most top rock bands today, right? So if you're into competition, then obviously Crown's percussion needs work. But if you're into performing arts education, Crowns's percussion is basically fantastic. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
actucker Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 For a non-percussionist fan perspective, I thought Crown's percussion was great. In terms of exciting arrangement, the feature in the middle (just before the snare drop) was wonderful in the combination of battery and front ensemble. It's in my head a lot. It was just musically great stuff. And the muffler thing was fun, even if it may not have shown off skills as effectively. It was a great show. That doesn't mean the demand or execution was there, of course, but the "Pete GE" was great. Ultimately the level of any line at the end of the year is based more than anything else on the level of those kids coming in. Presumably the relative scores were similar in the first shows of the season to the scores at the end, right? If so, then Crown is just not drawing quite the talent of other corps from a DCI judge metric standpoint. But I bet they would pass easily as good enough for most top rock bands today, right? So if you're into competition, then obviously Crown's percussion needs work. But if you're into performing arts education, Crowns's percussion is basically fantastic. Actually, if you want to base your evaluation on the numbers, it would suggest that educationally, their program was less than stellar this year (pun intended). Early in the season, Crown was competitive in percussion with the programs that were at the top. They came out of the gate in and out of contention with Cavaliers and others that by season's end were beating them consistently. That would suggest that the improvement happening at other corps was not happening at Crown. That would suggest that the staff was not getting results. I am not claiming this to be truth. Simply pointing out that by the numbers, that's what you could extrapolate. I wasn't on tour with them, so I have no idea. I would guess that its far more complicated than that. That being said, from a GE perspective, I have to disagree with you. I thought both features went on far longer than they could sustain in terms of musical interest. The muffler idea was cool, but not interesting enough to be as long as it was (which I would guess was necessary in order to make the transition to high brass backfield). The second feature was similar in nature. Interesting for a few seconds, but repetitive and tiresome by the time the brass came back in. Front exposure was very very slim in the show. Not sure if that was by design due to a lack of talent in the membership, or simply a musical choice, but I personally prefer a more involved front ensemble. From an effect standpoint, the best part of the percussion book was when the brass WAS playing. It supported the brass book extremely well. It just didn't do anything for me otherwise. Obviously that's all opinion. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nachfolger Christi Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 actucker, I think Peter has hit on a good distinction that many here do not really look at carefully. If I watch Crown's show from an expectation of entertainment, even from a percussion perspective. Competitively, I agree with you. I look much more to the competitive side. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flammaster Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 I'm sorry, but no you couldn't. Looking at recaps it doesn't look like ANY Open Class percussion section beat Carolina Crown ever last year. I know you're a homer, and homers are likely to speak crazy rhetoric, but in this case I have to call you out on your gross error. It doesn't look like ANY Open Class percussion section placed in the Top 15, let alone close to Crown. In fact, the highest placing Open Class corps (BDB) was nearly 3 POINTS behind Crown placing 18th. Again, I get the homerism, and cheering on the home team but lets be real, here: Crown was not really in the same league as BD, SCV, Bluecoats, Cadets and Cavaliers in percussion but they were still pretty solid in the grand scheme of the activity. And Blue Devils B (and every other Open Class corps) were no where near Crown either. It has nothing to do with that at all. Look at the week book they are playing. it's pure liquid no content at all. Now go watch some of what the other lines are playing. They spend 5 minutes doing diddles on mufflers while the tenors and basses go ding, ding ding, ding. Oh please! go watch Genesis. That is a good line! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boxingfred Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 This is Exciting news for Crown! I think Tom is a perfect fit as well as an amazing percussion person. Crown Percussion is in great hands! S#!T JUST GOT REAL! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
actucker Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 actucker, I think Peter has hit on a good distinction that many here do not really look at carefully. If I watch Crown's show from an expectation of entertainment, even from a percussion perspective. Competitively, I agree with you. I look much more to the competitive side. I agree that there is a distinction there, but I am looking at it from that perspective as well. In terms of entertainment, those moments in the show fell flat in my opinion. They were not entertaining, and plenty of my non percussionist friends agreed. The novelty of the mufflers wore off about 15 seconds in. The battery feature that followed was just a battery ram, and as such, didn't have enough going for it to maintain the full minute that it went on. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 good lord. we know you're a homer, but now bordering on delusional too I'm sorry but I can name at least 5 Open Class lines that should have cleaned the floor with them! 7th place my foot! more like 17th Yo! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 I don't disagree with what you're saying, but the irony is in 2013 when they won gold with a 6th place percussion section, they still won Music Analysis and swept GE Music. right. because of a few factors: those sheets are not fully focused on percussion. because in a dome, you're not going to hear nearly as much percussive issues. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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