Fan Network Armegeddon - So Long SCV 1989

[Jeff Ream]

I admire both your perseverance and your loyalty to the "organization," Jeff (and by "organization," I mean the entire world of Drum and Bugle Corps as a whole).

However. that is you. What happens when a segment of the population...and, for argument's sake, a rather substantial and growing segment... comes along who doesn't share your (or our) levels of the same? In my innocence (or naivete), I fear that this may happen. And if (or when) it does indeed happen, all the protestations of "it hasn;t happened before...they've all stayed in the end") aren't going to pay the bills. Not being a Chicken Little here...but it seems to me (not being a business person myself) that preparing for any an all eventualities would be the first, proactive, order of business for any organization which depends upon financial contributions from an outside source.

we've been seeing for a while now that the passion and dedication from more recent generations isn't as crazy diehard as we are. DCI saw it coming years ago, hence their continued marketing toward kids. Keep getting kids to come, and cherish what you get that sticks around, keep them while going after more.

As true diehards, we are at times our own worst enemy. We want what we want, and we #### moan and throw temper tantrums when we don't get it.While I used to be one of those die hard #### and moan legacy fans, I've realized, not only are we our own worst enemy, but we eat our young and spit them out. Look here on DCP...someone new comes in and doesnt kow tow to sacred cows or the past, they get jumped on ruthlessly at times.So here we are, using one of the greatest resources the activity has, and the average age of active users probably doubles the age of those marching today. There's a reason why corps admin tell kids to stay off here...it's been played out time and time again for 13 years. I tend to think most kids see through it and even laugh at it, but hell...look at some of the #### dished out to parents who wandered in here.

The "legacy" generation of fans is both the best and worst things to happen to drum corps. The best because our generation will be the last of the true die hard 20+ years of fandom, and the worst because of how we act/demand/#### and moan.

[cf144]

Jeff Ream, on 20 May 2015 - 01:46 AM, said:

The "legacy" generation of fans is both the best and worst things to happen to drum corps. The best because our generation will be the last of the true die hard 20+ years of fandom, and the worst because of how we act/demand/#### and moan.

I'm curious what makes you think/say that the generation(s) after ours are not likely to stay fans for life like we are (this isn't a dig at your statement - I'm genuinely curious as to what makes you say this)

[perc2100]

we've been seeing for a while now that the passion and dedication from more recent generations isn't as crazy diehard as we are. DCI saw it coming years ago, hence their continued marketing toward kids. Keep getting kids to come, and cherish what you get that sticks around, keep them while going after more.

As true diehards, we are at times our own worst enemy. We want what we want, and we #### moan and throw temper tantrums when we don't get it.While I used to be one of those die hard #### and moan legacy fans, I've realized, not only are we our own worst enemy, but we eat our young and spit them out. Look here on DCP...someone new comes in and doesnt kow tow to sacred cows or the past, they get jumped on ruthlessly at times.So here we are, using one of the greatest resources the activity has, and the average age of active users probably doubles the age of those marching today. There's a reason why corps admin tell kids to stay off here...it's been played out time and time again for 13 years. I tend to think most kids see through it and even laugh at it, but hell...look at some of the #### dished out to parents who wandered in here.

The "legacy" generation of fans is both the best and worst things to happen to drum corps. The best because our generation will be the last of the true die hard 20+ years of fandom, and the worst because of how we act/demand/#### and moan.

Good points, and actor/writer Simon Pegg recently said something similar about the current pop culture geek trend that has infested genre movie fandom. He talks about how that sort of culture is dumbing down general society/culture in the sense that there is far more general discussion about STAR WARS: FORCE UNLEASHED trailer than the Nepal earthquake. It's definitely similar here, though not as nutty (if you can believe that)

[perc2100]

Jeff Ream, on 20 May 2015 - 01:46 AM, said:

I'm curious what makes you think/say that the generation(s) after ours are not likely to stay fans for life like we are (this isn't a dig at your statement - I'm genuinely curious as to what makes you say this)

I think he's inferring they won't be as rabid as past generations. I know a TON of fairly recent age-outs (not last year, but folks who are in mid-late 20s). They follow their corps and the activity, and maybe go to a show ever year. But they don't generally buy anything: no DVDs, no CDs, no t-shirts, no FN subscriptions, etc. They spend more time hanging out socially with their fellow alumni in bars, sporting events, parties, etc. They look at their time in DCI as a fun worth-while event, but a youthful one; now that they've gotten older, gone through school, are in careers, etc. they've moved on from the activity for the most part. They follow scores and shows, but they don't spend their money: it's much easier to find video on YouTube than drop $100 on DVDs or FN.

It isn't necessarily that they're not lifer fans, they're just not as crazy as us older generations who didn't come up through drum corps via the internet. Even when I marched in the late 1990s I had to wait until Drum Corps World published their May issue of what corps is playing what music. We had to read DCW on tour to see descriptions of shows and scores. The internet was fairly new when I marched to the masses, and if staffers had their laptops on tour and could find ethernet hookups somewhere we could check DCI.org for scores. But generally we ate up ever (small) bit of media we could because there wasn't much other choice. Now, with social media, YouTube, file sharing, etc. it is FAR easier for members form the last decade or so to follow the activity from a distance w/out dropping much money in the activity.

[drumcorpsfever]

What does the DCP community think of this idea:

"To DCI: For all that have a current Fan Network subsciption, we realize that the copyright issues you've faced are outside of your control. That said, those who did purchase the Fan Network, did so expecting to have a full repertoire of historical shows. Since so many of those shows have been removed, it would be a good customer service gesture to have a coupon code good for x% off a renewal subscription, or x% off the purchase of the Essensials Collection."

I have submitted the above suggestion to DCI.

[Kamarag]

It isn't necessarily that they're not lifer fans, they're just not as crazy as us older generations who didn't come up through drum corps via the internet. Even when I marched in the late 1990s I had to wait until Drum Corps World published their May issue of what corps is playing what music. We had to read DCW on tour to see descriptions of shows and scores. The internet was fairly new when I marched to the masses, and if staffers had their laptops on tour and could find ethernet hookups somewhere we could check DCI.org for scores. But generally we ate up ever (small) bit of media we could because there wasn't much other choice. Now, with social media, YouTube, file sharing, etc. it is FAR easier for members form the last decade or so to follow the activity from a distance w/out dropping much money in the activity.

I think you're right on the money. I'll even take it a step further, just based on my own observations (it will be fun to see if any of you all agree).

Kids today are rabid for the activity in different ways than folks who've marched in the past. In the old days (80's through early 90's for sake of this argument) there was no social media. We loved our own corps, certainly, but we loved the activity in general. With the advent of social media, particularly Facebook, it's reinvented what alumni of the various corps can do, particularly in communicating with each other. The result is that I think those of us who've marched are becoming a lot like the ultra-rabid sports fans...we live an breath our own team/corps even more that was done in the past.

I know that for me, Facebook in particular has united the alumni of the Blue Devils in way we'd never have imagined back in the day. We can talk BD, DCI in general, comment on live shows, and do things to support our corps actively and financially (there's a lot of that, actually). Heck, even the alumni of Suncoast Sound, a corps dead for 25 years, has an active Facebook group that's brought many of us back together for the first time in several decades.

I imagine it's the same for alumni of other corps as well.

[corpsband]

I think he's inferring they won't be as rabid as past generations. I know a TON of fairly recent age-outs (not last year, but folks who are in mid-late 20s). They follow their corps and the activity, and maybe go to a show ever year. But they don't generally buy anything: no DVDs, no CDs, no t-shirts, no FN subscriptions, etc. They spend more time hanging out socially with their fellow alumni in bars, sporting events, parties, etc. They look at their time in DCI as a fun worth-while event, but a youthful one; now that they've gotten older, gone through school, are in careers, etc. they've moved on from the activity for the most part. They follow scores and shows, but they don't spend their money: it's much easier to find video on YouTube than drop $100 on DVDs or FN.

It isn't necessarily that they're not lifer fans, they're just not as crazy as us older generations who didn't come up through drum corps via the internet. Even when I marched in the late 1990s I had to wait until Drum Corps World published their May issue of what corps is playing what music. We had to read DCW on tour to see descriptions of shows and scores. The internet was fairly new when I marched to the masses, and if staffers had their laptops on tour and could find ethernet hookups somewhere we could check DCI.org for scores. But generally we ate up ever (small) bit of media we could because there wasn't much other choice. Now, with social media, YouTube, file sharing, etc. it is FAR easier for members form the last decade or so to follow the activity from a distance w/out dropping much money in the activity.

I wonder if this trend is directly tied to our "connected" world. Fans in decades past were mostly denied the opportunity to "stay in the loop". Maybe you had a weekly "Drum Corps News" and possibly you could call a corps hall for scores. But going to a show was (for most fans) the only opportunity to "get in the loop". Now you just put your finger to your smartphone and everything is at your fingertips. The stands would mostly stay full af the end of a show -- just to get those scores! Now even die hard fans leave because the you get the scores more quickly from the web. Perhaps it's no wonder that many FMM don't feel obliged to attend a lot of shows.

[perc2100]

What does the DCP community think of this idea:

"To DCI: For all that have a current Fan Network subsciption, we realize that the copyright issues you've faced are outside of your control. That said, those who did purchase the Fan Network, did so expecting to have a full repertoire of historical shows. Since so many of those shows have been removed, it would be a good customer service gesture to have a coupon code good for x% off a renewal subscription, or x% off the purchase of the Essensials Collection."

I have submitted the above suggestion to DCI.

I submitted something similar, pointing out that roughly 10% of previous archived shows have been unavailable for roughly 40% of the subscription period. Like I said in earlier, a coupon code would likely "force" me to spend money with DCI that I typically would not have & would be a win/win for all IMO. It would also go a long way, for me at least, of DCI showing good faith in retaining and pleasing its current subscriber customers.

[JimF-LowBari]

I wonder if this trend is directly tied to our "connected" world. Fans in decades past were mostly denied the opportunity to "stay in the loop". Maybe you had a weekly "Drum Corps News" and possibly you could call a corps hall for scores. But going to a show was (for most fans) the only opportunity to "get in the loop". Now you just put your finger to your smartphone and everything is at your fingertips. The stands would mostly stay full af the end of a show -- just to get those scores! Now even die hard fans leave because the you get the scores more quickly from the web. Perhaps it's no wonder that many FMM don't feel obliged to attend a lot of shows.

About staying connected, I remember there was b-wording when scores were not posted on DCP right at the end of some shows. Like... few minutes later...

Think we've just gotten used to getting what we want now and the effort (driving back and forth) just seems like delay which we can't seem to take as well anymore.

[perc2100]

I wonder if this trend is directly tied to our "connected" world. Fans in decades past were mostly denied the opportunity to "stay in the loop". Maybe you had a weekly "Drum Corps News" and possibly you could call a corps hall for scores. But going to a show was (for most fans) the only opportunity to "get in the loop". Now you just put your finger to your smartphone and everything is at your fingertips. The stands would mostly stay full af the end of a show -- just to get those scores! Now even die hard fans leave because the you get the scores more quickly from the web. Perhaps it's no wonder that many FMM don't feel obliged to attend a lot of shows.

I think it is absolutely tied to our "connected" world, and the fact that we are "connected" via computers & wifi as opposed to be "connected" via going to shows, tailgating, alumni functions, etc. I'm sure there are folks who to both, especially older folks/generations. Heck, because of Fan Network I am FAR more into keeping up with modern drum corps than I was directly after aging-out, albeit from my living room than from traveling to see shows (note, however, that has maybe almost as much to do with location as when Finals was in my Region I traveled for that to see live). Generally I think generations that are used to being able to text & get immediate responses, YouTube videos of practice & lot footage or even bootleg performance footage, being in constant contact with alumni & friends via various social media, etc. and evolved what the true modern fanbase is and how they choose to 'consume' the activity. It is now FAR easier to stay in contact with alumni & friends virtually, to watch live streams a few times a week (or even just shows here & there on YouTube or other shared free sources), see almost immediate score updates on DCI.org or other social media sources, etc. instead of going to shows, traveling to events, buying physical media, etc.