greg_orangecounty Posted March 26, 2022 Share Posted March 26, 2022 20 hours ago, GUARDLING said: I can agree....partially..I think it's not the amount that's paid to some staff , it's the amount of staff that corps have nowadays. In years past we had far fewer staff, staff that had to do more with less help than today and staff that had to manage and still put out a very high quality product. AND NO i'm not talking 100 years ago...lol What percentage of a corps budget goes to paid staff? Whatever the number is could it be cut in half? Would anyone in the stands notice a difference? This is supposed to be a youth-centered activity for the youth, not paid staff. Mike Moxley wrote and taught the drill for one of the Kingsmen's last Winter guards. He basically did it for just beer and gas money. And "the experience" those ladies had was, I'm sure, just as good as any top corps today. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimF-LowBari Posted March 26, 2022 Share Posted March 26, 2022 (edited) Thinking of the number of staff… Just got done watching Division II basketball (my team lost so done watching 🤬). Same idea of if you want to be considered the elite or Division I you need tons of assistants, special equipment, extra rooms, etc etc. Do you really need all the extras to play… nope but “everyone else does it”…. So corps shooting themselves in the … by keeping up to each other no matter what Edited March 26, 2022 by JimF-LowBari Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GUARDLING Posted March 26, 2022 Share Posted March 26, 2022 3 hours ago, Tim K said: I have wondered how many staff members are more well paid advisors and how much time some spend with the corps. I know in the past I have seen FB posts of instructors at summer vacation hotspots while the corps is touring many miles away. I’m not begrudging this since we all need time off and if an instructor has a family, being away most of the summer could be a problem. I also think listing tons of staff is something some corps do to look impressive. I have talked with parent volunteers who wonder what some staff members actually do. It all comes down to specialization . At one time staff need to do it all for the most part. What we didn't know or what we may have been weak at we had to learn. We also needed to be present. We were lucky if we had an assistant to help clean. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
craiga Posted March 26, 2022 Share Posted March 26, 2022 2 minutes ago, GUARDLING said: It all comes down to specialization . At one time staff need to do it all for the most part. What we didn't know or what we may have been weak at we had to learn. We also needed to be present. We were lucky if we had an assistant to help clean. 45 minutes ago, JimF-LowBari said: Thinking of the number of staff… Just got done watching Division II basketball (my team lost so done watching 🤬). Same idea of if you want to be considered the elite or Division I you need tons of assistants, special equipment, extra rooms, etc etc. Do you really need all the extras to play… nope but “everyone else does it”…. So corps shooting themselves in the … by keeping up to each other no matter what I think a contributing factor to the raw staff numbers is the fact that most staff cannot be on the road for 10 or eleven weeks in a row, so while a corps may have 8 drill techs on their staff roster, they are probably scheduled so there are actually only 4 or 5 in front of the corps at any given time. Also, when I was Marching 40 years ago, we did not have a doctor, nurse, physical trainers, and professional chefs on tour. While there are plenty of volunteers always helping out, certain positions logically require paid professionals. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GUARDLING Posted March 26, 2022 Share Posted March 26, 2022 59 minutes ago, greg_orangecounty said: What percentage of a corps budget goes to paid staff? Whatever the number is could it be cut in half? Would anyone in the stands notice a difference? This is supposed to be a youth-centered activity for the youth, not paid staff. Mike Moxley wrote and taught the drill for one of the Kingsmen's last Winter guards. He basically did it for just beer and gas money. And "the experience" those ladies had was, I'm sure, just as good as any top corps today. Staff members BITD got money in alot of ways based off the popularity of their corps. Exactly how the band programs became more drum corps like and added to the merging and blurring of those lines to today. With that said , it is alot different today. Noone will devote what's needed to puit a corps on the field for gas money. Just like " free or minimal charge for a rehearsal facility , sending kids running across highways for Mc Donalds for a meal, school busses, broken down transportation, etc etc. Not just in design or talented staff ( a reason some icons are still involved ) there are professionals needed from medical drivers ( not someones dad driving with no restrictions ) etc etc,. I have no issues forking out money for someone worth it , talented, devoted, there at all or most times BUT the amount of staff because it's not like that is quite alot Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GUARDLING Posted March 26, 2022 Share Posted March 26, 2022 2 minutes ago, craiga said: I think a contributing factor to the raw staff numbers is the fact that most staff cannot be on the road for 10 or eleven weeks in a row, so while a corps may have 8 drill techs on their staff roster, they are probably scheduled so there are actually only 4 or 5 in front of the corps at any given time. Also, when I was Marching 40 years ago, we did not have a doctor, nurse, physical trainers, and professional chefs on tour. While there are plenty of volunteers always helping out, certain positions logically require paid professionals. lol i was typing just about the same thing while you did..lol...All true 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
craiga Posted March 26, 2022 Share Posted March 26, 2022 (edited) Also, circling back to the tuition amounts and Labmaster's post about his daughter's dance camp....I agree. The hs I teach Marching at has a big jazz program, so as a result, we send dozens of kids to the Maine Jazz camp each summer. That's $1000 for one week, dorm housing, college food, no travel, a ONE performance at the end. Also, I should note that the driver's ed course now costs nearly a grand....I paid $64 in 1976! Edited March 26, 2022 by craiga 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GUARDLING Posted March 26, 2022 Share Posted March 26, 2022 4 minutes ago, craiga said: Also, circling back to the tuition amounts and Labmaster's post about his daughter's dance camp....I agree. The hs I teach Marching at has a big jazz program, so as a result, we send dozens of kids to the Maine Jazz camp each summer. That's $1000 for one week, dorm housing, college food, no travel, a ONE performance at the end. Also, I should note that the driver's ed course now costs nearly a grand....I paid $64 in 1976! I remember a relative of mine spending thousands ( many years ago ) on their daughters dance classes ( no food or lodging ) to be a 5 year old dancing bumble bee ...lol...as years went on and they went into dance competitions the cost was un believable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg_orangecounty Posted March 26, 2022 Share Posted March 26, 2022 8 minutes ago, GUARDLING said: Staff members BITD got money in alot of ways based off the popularity of their corps. Exactly how the band programs became more drum corps like and added to the merging and blurring of those lines to today. With that said , it is alot different today. Noone will devote what's needed to puit a corps on the field for gas money. Just like " free or minimal charge for a rehearsal facility , sending kids running across highways for Mc Donalds for a meal, school busses, broken down transportation, etc etc. Not just in design or talented staff ( a reason some icons are still involved ) there are professionals needed from medical drivers ( not someones dad driving with no restrictions ) etc etc,. I have no issues forking out money for someone worth it , talented, devoted, there at all or most times BUT the amount of staff because it's not like that is quite alot I'm all for the improvements in health and safety that have occurred the past 50 years. That is something DCI has done right! The example of Mike Moxley was an extreme end of the pendulum. What I wonder now is if the pendulum has swung completely polar opposite, and needs to come back towards the middle to make Drum Corps more accessible to kids in terms to cost. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GUARDLING Posted March 26, 2022 Share Posted March 26, 2022 2 minutes ago, greg_orangecounty said: I'm all for the improvements in health and safety that have occurred the past 50 years. That is something DCI has done right! The example of Mike Moxley was an extreme end of the pendulum. What I wonder now is if the pendulum has swung completely polar opposite, and needs to come back towards the middle to make Drum Corps more accessible to kids in terms to cost. I get ya...totally I think accessibility , especially at a high level of the activity could be a thing of the past. Now corps have created programs to help some members BUT the pendulum would have to swing in alot more aspects in the world in general to make a significant change. Sad maybe but true I think. The shoe string many corps existed on is literally gone today Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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