cixelsyd Posted October 10, 2023 Share Posted October 10, 2023 4 minutes ago, C.Holland said: Let’s be real. Everyone of us who’s ever been in this activity as a member, educator, board member, or administrator, all know that nothing will truly change until something gets burned to the ground. AND it threatens everyone else’s (at the top) livelihood. WE can be the change we want to see, but we need those at the top to actually feel pain before they will fully start to institute true prevention (and purge) of problematic individuals. "Burned to the ground"? I expect this nonsense to be posted right about now... surprised at the source, though. By the way, Oregon Crusaders, Pioneer, Shadow and YEA! have already been burned to the ground, before the Spirit incident took place. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scheherazadesghost Posted October 10, 2023 Share Posted October 10, 2023 22 minutes ago, cixelsyd said: "Burned to the ground"? I expect this nonsense to be posted right about now... surprised at the source, though. By the way, Oregon Crusaders, Pioneer, Shadow and YEA! have already been burned to the ground, before the Spirit incident took place. To their point though, did any of those (or even Cadets) involve a lawsuit that, in addition to highlighting corps' culpability, also looped in DCI's culpability? Yes other orgs have folded, but not in this fashion (that I'm aware of.) And no one I've spoken to wants things to burn. They just want these instances and their victims to but addressed respectfully and thoroughly. Apparently that takes a torch or two, seeing as the subject matter is too intense for most to handle with any semblance of respect and thoroughness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IllianaLancerContra Posted October 10, 2023 Share Posted October 10, 2023 6 hours ago, HockeyDad said: I’m sorry, but this (what the SOA member alleges) is disgusting and sickening. And this isn’t from 2010. It’s from 2021. And it occurred despite literally countless prior examples, in drum corps and outside of drum corps. I have to conclude there is nothing that will eliminate this behavior in this activity, configured as it is with kids supervising kids, basically. The clock is counting down on this activity. I wonder how the “but DCI is the corps” will fly in a court of law. I know the DCI is the Corps mantra, but what do the actual legal documents for DCI’s incorporation say? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IllianaLancerContra Posted October 10, 2023 Share Posted October 10, 2023 (edited) 1 hour ago, C.Holland said: Let’s be real. Everyone of us who’s ever been in this activity as a member, educator, board member, or administrator, all know that nothing will truly change until something gets burned to the ground. AND it threatens everyone else’s (at the top) livelihood. WE can be the change we want to see, but we need those at the top to actually feel pain before they will fully start to institute true prevention (and purge) of problematic individuals. To borrow a phrase attributed to Eisenhower, ‘If you grab them by the b*lls, their hearts & minds will follow’. Edited October 10, 2023 by IllianaLancerContra More like auto-incorrect Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Holland Posted October 10, 2023 Share Posted October 10, 2023 35 minutes ago, cixelsyd said: "Burned to the ground"? I expect this nonsense to be posted right about now... surprised at the source, though. By the way, Oregon Crusaders, Pioneer, Shadow and YEA! have already been burned to the ground, before the Spirit incident took place. Open class? That doesn’t affect anyone up the food chain. Neither do the groups in the bottom tier. gotta bring big hurt to bring big change. and now a few words from our sponsor… Don’t bring a gas can and a zippo. Head on down to Bob’s House of Napalm during their Black Friday sale n pick yerself up an XL18! The favorite of the US Military and Meal Team Six wannabes alike. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cixelsyd Posted October 10, 2023 Share Posted October 10, 2023 4 minutes ago, scheherazadesghost said: To their point though, did any of those (or even Cadets) involve a lawsuit that, in addition to highlighting corps' culpability, also looped in DCI's culpability? No. But burning down DCI does not seem like the best solution... especially since the most recent proposed alternative to DCI was to let GH, JF and five of their friends run everything. Also not a fan of burning down Spirit of Atlanta. I have heard you give their post-2021 reforms high (and singular) praise. I hope a few corps can learn from them before they are burned to the ground. Quote Yes other orgs have folded, but not in this fashion (that I'm aware of.) And no one I've spoken to wants things to burn. Not 100% sure, judging from a subsequent post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scheherazadesghost Posted October 10, 2023 Share Posted October 10, 2023 9 minutes ago, cixelsyd said: No. But burning down DCI does not seem like the best solution... especially since the most recent proposed alternative to DCI was to let GH, JF and five of their friends run everything. Also not a fan of burning down Spirit of Atlanta. I have heard you give their post-2021 reforms high (and singular) praise. I hope a few corps can learn from them before they are burned to the ground. We're far away from burning things down. We have no idea how this lawsuit will turn out and, seeing as it's unprecedented, it seems unwise to jump to conclusions either way. I and many others are satisfied with accountability and sustainable change but have needed to push and push and push just to have the problem addressed, often at great sacrifice to our wellbeing. So yeah, fire comes to mind, and any person with a heart might understand why. How the corps and DCI handle this is up to them. If they can't take the scrutiny, accountability, or transparent change then that's on them 'cause they've been operating in some alternate dimension prior to now where those things don't seem to move them quickly enough. I have always believed that the good people involved are better than the two alternatives proposed herein so far: (a) nothing changes and the world sucks so oh well it is what it is abuse cannot be remedied OR (b) drum corps dies forever and never ever ever comes back. But I know this community often lacks the ability to discuss nuance so whadayagonnado? 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cixelsyd Posted October 10, 2023 Share Posted October 10, 2023 9 minutes ago, C.Holland said: Open class? That doesn’t affect anyone up the food chain. Neither do the groups in the bottom tier. gotta bring big hurt to bring big change. and now a few words from our sponsor… Don’t bring a gas can and a zippo. Head on down to Bob’s House of Napalm during their Black Friday sale n pick yerself up an XL18! The favorite of the US Military and Meal Team Six wannabes alike. If I hear you correctly, you are suggesting that member safety does not/will not matter to leadership if the corps (plural) who burn to the ground over it score below 90? But that it suddenly will matter if a sufficiently high-ranking corps combusts? Need I remind you that we (and they) just spent the past year watching our 5th-place corps flame out financially. Did that bring big change to the DCI financial model? (Did it bring any such change?) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HockeyDad Posted October 10, 2023 Share Posted October 10, 2023 I’m not claiming this lawsuit can burn dci to the ground. So we can do a hard stop about that. BUT - if it takes burning the activity to the ground to stop the sexual abuse of participants, then that’s what I’m for. It’s more important than wanting my 10 minute performances. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scheherazadesghost Posted October 10, 2023 Share Posted October 10, 2023 (edited) And, so everyone knows, survivors may be reading this. Can we not hint that their calls for accountability could lead to destroying the activity? That's not okay. Edited October 10, 2023 by scheherazadesghost clarity 4 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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