BG984 Posted March 15 Share Posted March 15 A history of DCI judging; the movement away from music scoring emphasis. This is an outline of the scoring systems/point allocations for DCI since it’s inception. Understand that every single change had to be voted on and approved by the DCI Board of Directors. Also, only the system used at the World Championship will be analyzed. Year No. of Judges Music/Visual/Neutral % Mus. Pts/ Vis. Pts Notes/Changes 1972 10 7/3/0 70/30 60/40 20 pts perc./20 pts brass 1973- 10 7/3/0 70/30 65/35 5 % removed from 1977 vis., added to brass 20 pts. perc./25 pts brass 1978- 11 8/3/0 72/28 65/35 Perc. analysis added 1979 1980 12 8/4/0 67/33 65/35 Vis. analysis added 1981 11 7/4/0 64/36 65/35 removed a perc. Judge 1982- 10 6/4/0 60/40 65/35 Brass analysis judge 1983 eliminated 1984- 9 6/3/0 67/33 65/35 GE increased..40 pts 1987 GE visual 15 pts GE vis. raised from 33.3% to 37.5% of GE score 1988 - 6 4/2/0 67/33 65/35 GE 55 pts 1989 1990 - 9 6/3/0 67/33 65/35 GE 40 pts 1993 1994- 7 4/3/0 57/43 55/45 GE Perc. eliminated 1999 GE Mus. Created Music Ensemble created 2000 - 8 4/4/0 50/50 50/50 Guard caption added 2003 *In 7 years (1994-2000) Visual judges assigned increased 17%, and a 15% reduction in scoring and 17% reduction in judging assignments in music 2004 - 9 5/4/0 55/45 50/50 2nd perc. judge added 2007 2008 11 6/5/0 55/45 50/50 Effect panel doubled to 4 judges 2009 - 10 5/5/0 50/50 50/50 one perc. removed 2013 2014 11 4/3/4 ? 50/50 GE is just overall GE first time in history that a visual judge can score a caption that was music the year before All GE judges required to extensively evaluate visual 2018 - 11 4/3/4 ? 50/50 a perc. Judge dropped 2023 A mus. Analysis added some highlights: 1994 creation of Music Analysis. An extremely difficult caption, because the judge should be able to indicate that 3rd baritones were slightly flat in pitch, and snare flam drags were flawless, in consecutive sentences....not many are that versed/perceptive in both brass and percussion. On a plus side, any evaluation in regards to how the percussion and brass are working together as a coherent musical ensemble is a good one. This caption remains a challenge depending on the background, knowledge, and perception skills of the assigned judge in both brass and percussion. 2014 GE Music GE Visual no longer exist, merged to just GE. For the first time, a judge with little or no music background/knowledge can comment/score regarding the effectiveness of the musical program, as well as visual. Those with a music background must comment/score regarding the effectiveness of both the visual and music aspects. Conclusion: for 20 years (1973-1993), even though the number and breakdown of judges varied, a significant emphasis on music was given in the scoring; 65% to 35%. In 1994, that spread went down to 55% to 45 %, and 6 years later it went to 50/50. Thus, in 6 years, music went from having a 30% emphasis edge, to none. Also, we went from 2/3 of the judging panel scoring music to 7 of 11 judges considering/scoring visual. Also, in the past few years, proposals did occur to return to the Music Effect/Visual Effect separation, and also to return the brass ensemble caption. However, these were voted down by the body. 4 3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DFA1970 Posted March 15 Share Posted March 15 Thanks for the homework. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lance Posted March 15 Share Posted March 15 This is why I love Crown and Bloo in particular. I can almost always count on a musical product that's just as important to them as visual. It's simply not the case for the majority of corps anymore, and I don't blame them with the scoring being so heavily skewed towards visual. The fact that people with zero musical background are scoring music is yet another reason why scores are really a joke in the activity. It's always been kind of a joke, though, lol. 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BG984 Posted March 15 Author Share Posted March 15 4 hours ago, Lance said: This is why I love Crown and Bloo in particular. I can almost always count on a musical product that's just as important to them as visual. It's simply not the case for the majority of corps anymore, and I don't blame them with the scoring being so heavily skewed towards visual. The fact that people with zero musical background are scoring music is yet another reason why scores are really a joke in the activity. It's always been kind of a joke, though, lol. In 2015, The Cadets became the only corps to win brass and percussion at the DCI Championship prelims, and not only not win the show, but not finish in the top 3. There have been years where the overall music winner did not win the title, but nowadays, you can win music and finish 4th. Conversely, you can be 4th in music (and I won't be surprised if someday soon, 5th) but win the title. Spreads given in GE/Visual/Guard will always prevail over scant edges given in music. We have color guard judges judging overall "effect" who wouldn't know the difference between two musical products if it bit them. Crown has had years where they won brass.....by a tenth........over groups that frankly could not shine their shoes in that caption. Not to say others weren't decent in brass, but the clear superiority in every aspect of brass performance was not acknowledged score-wise. I remember a day when people would wait with excitement at a regional (Allentown, for example) for the scores to be announced. Nowadays, most are in their cars on their way before they are even announced, not just because of the quick availability of the internet, but because competitive excitement is gone. All said, though....the only way there will be change is if it is proposed and approved by the drum corps themselves, and there has not been a stronger influence there than the visual community, an example being last year when some proposals that would have created more refined emphasis on music were soundly defeated. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vuitton Posted March 16 Share Posted March 16 (edited) 22 hours ago, Lance said: This is why I love Crown and Bloo in particular. Really? Bluecoats did a Beatles show without any Beatles music. I know I'll get shot for this, but it's true. It was, actually, my favorite show of 2019 and I felt it should have won based on it's merits and the extremely high performance levels, but it wasn't musical at all. The musical elements of the show were just a technical exercise with the Beatles music as an underlying component, overshadowed by the vast and endless runs. That's not music. WHAT THE BEATLES HAD WRITTEN IS MUSIC, and Lennon is a much better composer and orchestrator than the Bluecoats music staff. I don't mean to rag on the Bluecoats, because they are not alone. EVERYTHING is written for the judges and nothing is written for the fans. There is no musicality today, or there is rather very little. If the Bluecoats just played the Beatles music without all the runs tossed in all over the place, they wouldn't have scored as well because it wouldn't have been deemed as having as much content. But, it would have been a hell of a lot better. I quite enjoy modern DCI but musically it doesn't hold a candle the golden era. Listen to Regiment's 1996 opener and how it just built and bulit and built over 4 minutes to it's thundering conclusion. THAT is music. THAT is musicality. How the hell can a corps achieve that today when they are playing 15 different pieces in 10 minutes and the hornline is only playing for 4 of them? Edited March 16 by Vuitton 8 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BG984 Posted March 16 Author Share Posted March 16 48 minutes ago, Vuitton said: Really? Bluecoats did a Beatles show without any Beatles music. I know I'll get shot for this, but it's true. It was, actually, my favorite show of 2019 and I felt it should have won based on it's merits and the extremely high performance levels, but it wasn't musical at all. The musical elements of the show were just a technical exercise with the Beatles music as an underlying component, overshadowed by the vast and endless runs. That's not music. WHAT THE BEATLES HAD WRITTEN IS MUSIC, and Lennon is a much better composer and orchestrator than the Bluecoats music staff. I don't mean to rag on the Bluecoats, because they are not alone. EVERYTHING is written for the judges and nothing is written for the fans. There is no musicality today, or there is rather very little. If the Bluecoats just played the Beatles music without all the runs tossed in all over the place, they wouldn't have scored as well because it would have been deemed as having as much content. But, it would have been a hell of a lot better. I quite enjoy modern DCI but musically it doesn't hold a candle the golden era. Listen to Regiment's 1996 opener and how it just built and bulit and built over 4 minutes to it's thundering conclusion. THAT is music. THAT is musicality. How the hell can a corps achieve that today when they are playing 15 different pieces in 10 minutes and the hornline is only playing for 4 of them? So many staffs today work for "demand", and there is demand out there, though that certainly doesn't make it musical by any stretch. Picking great music that is already extremely well-composed/arranged, and then simply transcribing it mostly and staying "true to the original", is something that is all but ignored these days. Some staff actually list musical folks as "designers", instead of arrangers/composers, and it sounds that way. "Quality of arrangement/composition"...(ie does it make musical sense, does it flow, is it expressive, is it emotional, is the musical form coherent) is non-existent in today's DCI judging vocabulary. If it doesn't sound wonderful standing still, and does not move you emotionally, there is nothing the visual package is going to do to fix that......at least not for me............... Phantom's 1996 brass book was fabulous, and they maxed it out at finals............ditto 2008........I remember laughing in 2008, because they received such a great audience reaction compared to the corps that "beat them" in quarters and semis..........I actually left before the finals scores, because I didn't want to witness the "perceived travesty".......but received a call in my car that surprised me...........though the margin was also laughable.......it wasn't close, IMO........ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted March 16 Share Posted March 16 effect continues to be scheduled with one judge with a music background and one with a visual background...a few people have both. at the major regionals and finals week, that assignment is doubled. so in essence i have yet to see an entire effect panel of just two people with a visual emphasis background. MA is far less tick focused as you discuss. it's more of an overall total musical package sheet. yes there can be challenges with the judge having a background in brass or percussion background, and not being knowledgeable in both, but DCI has been trying to address that with several new recruits and better assignment of who works that sheet. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg_orangecounty Posted March 16 Share Posted March 16 I trust your research, I just don't remember that there were that many judges (10?) in the first half of the first decade of DCI, especially the first year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BG984 Posted March 16 Author Share Posted March 16 29 minutes ago, greg_orangecounty said: I trust your research, I just don't remember that there were that many judges (10?) in the first half of the first decade of DCI, especially the first year. In the early years especially, a significant portion of shows were run by associations outside of DCI.....also, my data was only from DCI Championship prelims/finals....from 1972 to present............it was interesting to note the changes, though, and the short 6 year elimination of the 30% edge toward music I find to be mind boggling.......... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BG984 Posted March 16 Author Share Posted March 16 3 hours ago, Jeff Ream said: effect continues to be scheduled with one judge with a music background and one with a visual background...a few people have both. at the major regionals and finals week, that assignment is doubled. so in essence i have yet to see an entire effect panel of just two people with a visual emphasis background. MA is far less tick focused as you discuss. it's more of an overall total musical package sheet. yes there can be challenges with the judge having a background in brass or percussion background, and not being knowledgeable in both, but DCI has been trying to address that with several new recruits and better assignment of who works that sheet. My references were only referring to panels at Championships, and thus currently 4 effect judges, all using the same sheet, regardless of background. So, indeed there are visual/guard judges who are making decisions involving the effectiveness of not only the visual program, but the musical program........yes, I do question their abilities to do so....... No "tick" system referred to (though I marched, taught, and wrote when that was still around!!) I apologize that I was referring not to MA, but actually Ensemble....specifically the change in 1994, when Percussion Ensemble and Brass Ensemble were dropped for "Music Ensemble". For many years, if a brass judge was picked, you still pretty much got a "brass ensemble tape", and maybe the entire perc. commenting was "percussion too loud here".......If a percussion guy was judging, he might talk about timing between brass/percussion, or musical cohesion, but you wouldn't hear him talk about the intonation of the brass ensemble..........there were very few guys totally knowledgeable with both brass and percussion.....that remains a problem today.......I actually judged the caption for many years..........interestingly, DCI dropped the word "ensemble" for "analysis" in 2012, but "ensemble" remained on the DCA sheets through last year......While I am at it, I can officially comment on things now that I have officially retired from judging forever, largely due to health......so I am no longer sworn to silence. The main part of my article was that at DCI in 6 short years, music went from a 30% emphasis edge in the scoring to ZERO. I can also tell you with certainty that a handful of visual gurus were largely responsible for pushing things through, and I doubt that the music edge will ever return...........in the last two years, a rule proposal, by a hall of famer, was presented to return to brass ensemble and percussion ensemble (with the ability of each judge to consider how they work together musically) for more accurate judging, and also to return to music effect/visual effect (which DCA still had through last year) for the same reason..........his proposals were solidly rejected. Interestingly, the former DCA corps have adopted DCI's sheets/scoring system.....I am just hoping for a good survival for them...concerned about how many fans will attend all-age championships, plus the additional costs for the corps..........I was there 27 years..........I wish them the best.............. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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