Is Drum Corps "School?"

[Lance]

Gee, thanks for the intelligent response. If you couldn't care less then why bother taking the time to post when the rest of this discussion is fairly interesting to read.

I thought that it might be an option. I was wrong. I'll bet it would have gotten a lot of votes, though.

Honestly, who cares? Criticize what you see on the field, criticize designers, criticize performers/students/whatever interchangeable term you want to use, criticize staff/instructors/teachers/whatever interchangeable term you want to use, criticize the cost of dues/tuition/whatever interchangeable term you want to us. But why does it matter, you know, at all, how people who march and people who don't march refer to themselves, or how they refer to money? IT'S GREEN STUFF THAT'S GOING SOMEWHERE ELSE! Obviously, you think that wasn't an intelligent thing for me to ask in this thread, and I'm sorry you feel that way, but I really would like to know.

[Fran Haring]

Look at the Interlochen Summer Music Camp...they call their staff 'Faculty' and the attendees are called 'Students'.

You say "tomato" and I say "tomahto"....... :P

Fran

[boxingfred]

I voted YES

Most corps members are students and most instructors are educators.

Drum Corps for me was like summer music school with the Cadets.

Mater fact I learned more about playing my brass instrument from Jim Prime and Donny Vanduren, then I did at four years at Duke Ellington School of th Arts from Don Zegal my brass instructor.

[Stick Stack]

I thought that it might be an option. I was wrong. I'll bet it would have gotten a lot of votes, though.

Honestly, who cares? Criticize what you see on the field, criticize designers, criticize performers/students/whatever interchangeable term you want to use, criticize staff/instructors/teachers/whatever interchangeable term you want to use, criticize the cost of dues/tuition/whatever interchangeable term you want to us. But why does it matter, you know, at all, how people who march and people who don't march refer to themselves, or how they refer to money? IT'S GREEN STUFF THAT'S GOING SOMEWHERE ELSE! Obviously, you think that wasn't an intelligent thing for me to ask in this thread, and I'm sorry you feel that way, but I really would like to know.

What's in a name? Well, let's see.

The Summer Music games- Marching Music's Major League.

Contras- Tubas

Sopranos- Trumpets

Drum Corps- Marching Band.

Each of these are examples where precise word usage is important. To me, the Contra/Tuba thing was brought about for accuracy. Most corps use Tubas and trumpets now.

For Drum corps, many people will fight and fight before it is ever called marching band. People can get offended if it's called the wrong thing. We all know it can be frustrating to see a picture of a drum corps in a newspaper with a big caption of "Marching Band" under it.

As for the first one, I think this is closest to the case for the argument of changing to the terms faculty and student and tuition. It's the subtext, the connotation behind it. DCI felt that the title Marching Music's Major League better fit their business strategy. I would speculate this would be to further influence and get high school kids interested. Dissapointed with your high school marching band? Or perhaps want to be the very best in the marching arts? Try drum corps. That kind of thing.

The more I think of it, the more I think this is a good idea. I still know that the perception high school band students have that drum corps pedagogy is less than stellar and possibly ANTI-musical is still out there. Perhaps if there was some kind of way to change this myth, and word usage helped, than by all means go ahead.

[DrumCorpsFan27]

I know a woman who teaches percussion there...for quite a few years...and this year as well. She said it's a great experience. Kim got her doctorate in percussion performance at Rutgers here in NJ and taught the HS band I now arrange for...she was my daughter's private teacher for a year. She was in Suncoast Sounds pit one year in the mid 80's.

^OO^

[CrunchyTenor]

Different learning skills? Special needs? Here's how they're dealt with:

"Thanks for coming to our auditions, good luck to you in the future."

Unless of course, there's space available and nobody else auditioned for the spot.

I remember a drum student I had at a HS where I taught. Anytime someone was struggling he wanted to cut them. I had to remind him that it was a school, and that everyone was entitled to the same instruction as he.

That's one area where schools and drum corps differ. Schools are there to teach everyone. Drum corps only takes those who pass the audition.

It wasn't like that when I marched or when I taught drum corps. We took all comers, before we got to finalist status, because we had room for them. Real auditions didn't become necessary until supply outweighed demand. Until then auditions were only for placement within the line, for brass, percussion and guard.

Also, David offered his opinion. That doesn't make him right or wrong. It just makes him a guy with an opinion. You don't have to agree, and many have made good arguments contrary to David's opinion. That doesn't give them the right to say he is "wrong". Get over yourselves if you expect David to do the same.

For what it's worth...

Garry in Vegas

Edited March 3, 2007 by CrunchyTenor

[Tom D'Bomb]

There are teachers in universities who have a title of 'instructor'.

Why ever does this all matter so much? IMO it's just another way to widen the generational divide here in DCP-land.

Why does this have to be "generational?" Is DC now days more "educational?"

I submit that drum corps today is LESS like a school experience simply because of the lack of the "public good" component. Do the taxpayers of a municipality really relate to the local DCI corps? (all 20 of them?).

Back in ye olden days... the "town" drum corps was the "town" drum corps - and more often, the "neighborhood" drum corps. In many cases the kids were all from the same school. The mayors and town boards and local politicians actually kept track of how "the corps" did at the US Open or VFW Nationals.

Yet we certainly didn't consider it "school."

And the travelling band of out-of-towners that make up today's junior corps certainly don't meet that criteria.

And even it is "school" - would you really want a school board discussing show design or complaining about why "the corps" can't beat another in Musical Analysis? Or God forbid, the school board voting on whether you can buy those new flags in the middle of the season.

And don't tell me that you want to believe that today is more educational because of the sophistication of the music.... it's still 11 minutes of music drilled into your head for 10 months... and that's not exactly college concert band.

Tom Allen

Backpressure Survivor

[Vagabond Skyliner]

Why does this have to be "generational?" Is DC now days more "educational?"

I submit that drum corps today is LESS like a school experience simply because of the lack of the "public good" component. Do the taxpayers of a municipality really relate to the local DCI corps? (all 20 of them?).

Back in ye olden days... the "town" drum corps was the "town" drum corps - and more often, the "neighborhood" drum corps. In many cases the kids were all from the same school. The mayors and town boards and local politicians actually kept track of how "the corps" did at the US Open or VFW Nationals.

Yet we certainly didn't consider it "school."

And the travelling band of out-of-towners that make up today's junior corps certainly don't meet that criteria.

And even it is "school" - would you really want a school board discussing show design or complaining about why "the corps" can't beat another in Musical Analysis? Or God forbid, the school board voting on whether you can buy those new flags in the middle of the season.

And don't tell me that you want to believe that today is more educational because of the sophistication of the music.... it's still 11 minutes of music drilled into your head for 10 months... and that's not exactly college concert band.

Tom Allen

Backpressure Survivor

Also in "Ye Olden Day's" People who had no musical experience could " LEARN " to play a Drum or Bugle.

Now they teach people that ALREADY know how to play a horn or drum, the music for this year

Now I ask. Which is More of a teacher - student thing?

[prodigal bari]

I said in a recent post that I did not care what one calls the 'staff;' just as long as the job gets done.

However, DC is not a school.

Drum Corps at its roots (and until it is changed, if it is changed) is a competitive/performance medium, first and last.

A 'school' discipline depends solely on the content and skills being taught; and has an educational goal as its primary aim (i.e., learning a compentency).

Although there is a lot of teaching going on in the corps activity and more educators working with the members than ever (both to the activities' credit) the PRIMARY goal is to produce a performance that will compete...and to say anything else is to assume that the recruited students and audience are naive.

Now, the expereiences inherent within the activity are not dismissed...they are the reason why people are involved in DC. I would dare say, however, that if the competitive element were removed from DC that it would die on the vine. (Look at what happened when BOA tried to take away placements...they almost lost the platform...'Indy, we have a problem' ) I know that people will follow me on this and say I am nuts...but let's be honest. The vast majority of participants thrive on the rush of competition...and also love to travel on busses, sleep on floors, eat out of trailers, and other DC secrets that you couldnt ever experience in most schools (like run around in sports bras and shorts...depending on the sex? )?

And seeing that the players these days are already accomplished musicians at their level, this can be compared to a performance preparation situation. Educational it is...but school it ain't.

And shouldn't that be a good thing? B)

Edited March 3, 2007 by prodigal bari

[93Bluecoat]

I am starting this to stop the OT discussion on another thread. I have heard terms such as "students," "faculty," and even "tuition" used in association with drum corps. I say that it is not. In fact, I have gone as far as to accuse drum corps stating this of being egotistical and pretentious. Some say it is merely semantics. I say it is more and it is inappropriate. Drum corps are not formal educational institutions, members are not student, instructors are not professors and directors are not deans. What do you think?

Drum Corps is not music education, although one can learn A LOT about music through the activity. The term 'music education' is a process that would include a well rounded approach to musicianship (including solo and small ensemble performance, music theory, history, and style) for every individual. That in itself negates drum corps from being music education.

DW