Tim K

My guess? People from corps probably read DCP posts to gauge fan reactions in the summer months, to learn what works as far as public relations is concerned, and get a feeling of how corps is received overall. They may also make sure there are no unauthorized videos posted as we recently saw with the Colts or out and out slander as we've seen as well. As far as G7 matters, matters concerning governance, judging, and other concerns that fill many DCP posts, they probably pay little if any attention believing we do not understand the intricacies of the issues, and in many cases they may be correct. I know I have been convinced that I have all the answers, even though I've never managed a drum corps. The only problem is my answers don't fit the questions. In short, they look at what is helpful, and pay little attention or ignore the rest.

I enjoy this young man's (David) videos. He has a sidekick as well and my guess is the two alternate filming. His comments remind me a bit of an experience I witnessed at the CYO Nationals in 1978. I was a high schooler in the stands and Phantom performed. They opened with Stravinsky and some of the people around me erupted in anger. Phantom did not play "songs." Bridgemen were ruining drum corps. 27th and BAC were sloppy. I know I probably should have fought to defend their honor for such an untrue claim, but I didn't need to: BAC was pretty formidable and with some of the legendary bus troubles 27th seemed to have, they could have run them over as they headed to their cars and claimed the brakes went and no one would have doubted it. Blue Stars "hotpants," tame even in their day, were also scandalous. I can't recall the other horrors in their eyes, but they left before scores were announced and claimed they were never going to attend again. My guess is they marched in the 50's and 60's. Today these classic shows are all considered "old school." I also appreciated that David has insight to know one day he'll be an old crank, however, he points to 2033 as the time he'll be in a rocker and complaining. David, let me reassure you, you'll only be 40 or so, your life will hardly be over and you won't be sitting in a rocker, you'll be working and trying to figure out how your going to pay for your own kids' education and allow them the opportunity to march drum corps. Maybe you'll even be earning a living a s a director of a drum corps! I think this video is also hopeful. Those of us old enough to remember a drum corps on every corner, at least in New England and New Jersey, look at the number of corps today and feel sad. When a venerable corps like Glassmen find themselves on hiatus, it makes matters worse. Also, with all the G7 talk, it's easy to be pessimistic. David and probably many others like him who populate drum corps today have the same pride, work ethic, and love of performing and competing that has been a drum corps staple for years. The activity may be healthier than we realize.

Poor Cardinal Cushing--You still hear "Cush" stories from older priests, often humorous and he did love the microphone, but he also loved drum corps and was always in attendance at major shows like Mission Drums and CYO Nationals. He'd supposedly show up at circuit competitions from time to time and just sit in the stands. My guess is that in the BAC archives there has to be a photo or two with the good Cardinal and BAC, probably after a CYO Nationals victory.

It may not be law which using the word cannot would imply, and I'm not a lawyer as I'm sure you can guess, but I am involved in education and it is my job to determine policy for a Catholic school. I do not know of any school that publishes photos or posts online videos without signed consent, and many schools do not publish photos online or post videos, period. Of course I've never taken a survey either. I do know that guidelines for schools based on "best practices" do not use the word recommend or suggest when they speak of consent forms for the use of photos or videos for publishing online or in print in the case of photos, nor do they suggest looking at state or district guidelines, but list the legal ramifications and and liability issues if you do not have signed consent forms. Usually these practices are written based on lawsuits so that may be why I thought it was law. As far as photos used in advertisement such as a school open house, a photo or video would be considered commercial and you would need parental permission. I belong to a camera club that includes amateurs, professionals, and aspiring pros, and when we have speakers on law regarding photography, they say you must have signed consent forms even if no money changes hands because it is commercial photography. Strictly journalistic photos of a school event, game, etc. do not require signed consent.

I can't speak about copyright laws even in a general sense, but I know you can run into problems with posting photos and videos involving minors without parental permission and I'm sure the Colts have minors in the corps.

Your points are excellent but I would add one important point, just in case anyone questions what you have to say. As far as publishing photos and videos, each corps most likely has signed consents from young people over the age of 18 and signed consents from young people and their parents under the age of 18. DCI has the permission of each corps to post and uses specific photographers and videographers. Schools cannot post photos or videos of students on Facebook or use photos or videos of students for advertising and publicity purposes without signed consents. Newspapers and newscasts can use photos or videoclips without permission if it used for journalistic purposes. If you have permission, it's not a leak.

Boston Crusaders did not get airtime on WCVB, Channel 5's 11:00 news, but at least they got recognition and were referred to as "The Boston Crusaders Drum and Bugle Corps," not band.

Sounded like a bit of a Jim Wedge arrangement in there with a bit of Bridgemen "Civil War Medley" as an intro, but to be fair, all the music in the arrangement is in he public domain, which would include the "Danny Boy" ending which is actually from Holst's first Military Band Suite. . 27th and BAC--one of the great rivalries of drum corps yesterday and what a love/hate relationship these two corps once shared. As someone who loved 27th and still miss them, and believes BAC can do no wrong--it worked for me. Great Job Boston Crusaders. I just watched a 9 PM local news show and they had the Boston College Screaming Eagles and the "Jim Dandies" from Maine as representing New England. Now I love BC and their strong Jesuit tradition of excellence and the band has improved over the years, and I am sure the Jim Dandies may be very talented unicyclists, but they are not BAC. The 11:00 broadcasts better include BAC when they show New England groups in the Inaugural Parade.

Iit was an attempt at humor, I guess not a very good one.

BAC did East Rutherford last year which was a TOC show, but that may have been because Cadets hosted it. Cadets have been in BAC hosted shows just about each year and vice versa. As you mention, BAC decided not to be part of the G7 proposal, at least from what I've heard from people with closer ties to BAC than mine (alums and volunteers) and what they say has been supported by posters such as "craiga" and other BAC alums. If they desired, they could have been a part of the hoopla. To me, this makes BAC admirable. My vote: no split.

For me, and keep in mind I don't believe a split will happen, forever the optimist, or perhaps blind fool. But if i were to venture a guess I'd say it's a tie between Crown or Bluecoats. Crown loves being the audience's sweethearts, but the fans of the G7 are generally not the ones who show adulation for Crown, so I think they'd go where the love can be found and I don't think it will be with the crowd that thought "Cabaret Voltaire" was a masterpiece or that Cavaliers just had an off year. Bluecoats is another possibility. They make very wise decisions. A dark horse though still a possibility would be Phantom Regiment. I'd love it to be Blue Devils. As champions fifteen times, and many times the standard bearers, I'd love to see them take a leadership role for remaining. I'd also love to see SCV take a stand against it since for many, SCV is the embodiment of DCI. If Cavies are stronger this year, I'd love to see them take charge and stand up, but if they are not as strong as in the past, it might not matter much and people would see it as self-preservation. Longshot: Cadets. George Hopkins has all kinds of ideas--some forward thinking others controversial--but the corps is one of the more traditional when it comes to performances.

I support corps through buying souvenirs, contributing to fuel funds, etc. and would probably do so at a DCI show or G7 show if it ever happened. As far as donating to a corps, I believe that it is important to support local corps first so if I am going to make a more significant financial contribution which I do, it would be to BAC, Spartans, and 7th Regiment--all wonderful organizations near my home and deserving of support. My guess is that I'd support BAC even of they were part of the G7 due both to locality and a belief in what BAC stands for and has for many years, which is why there is a G7 and not a G8. If I were to live in a region that did not have a drum corps, I would probably contribute to a corps that shares my values. I'd want a family atmosphere that nurtures its members. I'd want a corps that has a strong local commitment (even though most BAC members hail from out of state, the corps is still Boston through and through and plays a significant role in our area). I'd want a corps that tries to instill what drum corps is all about and while I'd love to see the corps be a contender, placement would not be as important as the experience (the corps of course would feel differently). So my contributions would probably go` to a corps like Colts/Colts Cadets, Cascades, Pioneer, Pacific Crest or Mandarins.

I'm not sure what I expect all of this will look like, but I do know what I hope will be the results. Years back when corps were more local, many did have year round programs since the purpose was to keep kids off the streets. This is why winter guard started in the Boston area, perhaps in other areas as well. The horns and percussion units would perform concerts either in gyms or auditoriums and often "competed" against each other. This was slightly before my time, but it seemed to be a way that rival corps showed what was coming in the summer. It probably also served a practical purpose as well. Since the old bugles did not correspond to bands, it was likely that an instrument would have to be retaught the following year so kids involved in these groups helped them remember how to play and were more ready for the summer. I've long wanted to see small ensemble groups be included with WGI. I actually wanted four categoiries: guards, drum lines, horn ensembles, and small combined ensembles. Now I'm not looking for a return to that style I mentioned earlier, but I do believe that if it's primarily a fall and winter activity, it could spur an interest in drum corps and bring a new audience to drum corps. The reality is that bands feed drum corps, but many kids in bands have never heard of drum corps and it's not open to woodwinds (and I'm not advocating woodwinds in drum corps) unless a young person is willing to learn a brass or percussion instrument. Having a group under the drum corps umbrella that can potentially spark an interest in drum corps is a good thing. They also have a great potential audience. Drum corps fans would flock to these shows. As far as those who wonder if it will take away from drum corps, the Boston area had circuits that included bands (who were often adamant than drum corps that they were not "marching bands"), drill teams, and of course drum corps. All three groups shared instructors and though the rivalries were intense and there was a bit of one upmanship: drum corps believed they were all that, no matter how good or bad, bands did not see drum corps as musicians since at the time many corps did not teach its members to read music, and drill teams believed they were the only ones who knew how to march. But each group comepeted together in different categories and each supported the other's shows.

I'm not sure what I expect all of this will look like, but I do know what I hope will be the results. Years back when corps were more local, many did have year round programs since the purpose was to keep kids off the streets. This is why winter guard started in the Boston area, perhaps in other areas as well. The horns and percussion units would perform concerts either in gyms or auditoriums and often "competed" against each other. This was slightly before my time, but it seemed to be a way that rival corps showed what was coming in the summer. It probably also served a practical purpose as well. Since the old bugles did not correspond to bands, it was likely that an instrument would have to be retaught the following year so kids involved in these groups helped them remember how to play and were more ready for the summer. I've long wanted to see small ensemble groups be included with WGI. I actually wanted four categoiries: guards, drum lines, horn ensembles, and small combined ensembles. Now I'm not looking for a return to that style I mentioned earlier, but I do believe that if it's primarily a fall and winter activity, it could spur an interest in drum corps and bring a new audience to drum corps. The reality is that bands feed drum corps, but many kids in bands have never heard of drum corps and it's not open to woodwinds (and I'm not advocating woodwinds in drum corps) unless a young person is willing to learn a brass or percussion instrument. Having a group under the drum corps umbrella that can potentially spark an interest in drum corps is a good thing. They also have a great potential audience. Drum corps fans would flock to these shows. As far as those who wonder if it will take away from drum corps, the Boston area had circuits that included bands (who were often adamant than drum corps that they were not "marching bands"), drill teams, and of course drum corps. All three groups shared instructors and though the rivalries were intense and there was a bit of one upmanship: drum corps believed they were all that, no matter how good or bad, bands did not see drum corps as musicians since at the time many corps did not teach its members to read music, and drill teams believed they were the only ones who knew how to march. But each group comepeted together in different categories and each supported the other's shows.

I agree, if anything the opposite would be true. The all instrument ensembles will give woodwind and I presume strings an opportunity for competition and all instruments are welcome from the beginning, so it wouldn't be changing drum corps.

This is an interesting prediction, and while it probably wouldn't shake up things all that much this year. It could make things different down the road, and it would add variety.

I don't think they are going to add woodwinds to drum corps at this point if for no other reason than 2013 shows are already planned. I don't think it will have to do with the G7 either and if it does, it's not Mr. Boo's silence that surprises me, it's Mr. Hopkins, after all he's the one generating the most ink on this subject. As far as Michael Boo's silence, it may simply be he has other things in life to do than to respond to DCP posts. I'd love to think it has to do with finals being on Pay Per View since I don't think I'll be in Indy this summer, but would this increase revenues or take away from attendance at Lucas Oil? In the end, I think it will be some kind of fundraising gimmick. To me it has "fundraising" written all over it, "not public relations"which would be the case if it involved a major announcement such as a topic as important as the G7. Of course, I've been wrong before, so don't bet the farm on my speculation.

I agree that it is hard to move up, but of the ten corps you mentioned who placed ahead of Spirit, none of them repeated their 2011 placement in 2012. Blue Devils, Crown, Phantom, SCV, Bluecoats, BAC, Madison all moved up, Cavies, Blue Knights, and Cadets placed lower. My guess is that Crossmen will be building off of last year's success and Spirit could likewise move ahead. It will depend on the quality of their show, the return of veterans and the talent of rookies.

They will!!!

I was happy to see Spirit in the Top 12 in 2011 but I didn't expect it to happen in 2012. Then 2012 comes along and Spirit had some early season success that made me think we'd see Spirit in the Top 12 again in 2012. When I saw them at DCI East, I found that "Luck Be a Lady" had moments that reminded me a bit of the late 70's Spirit and the show was engaging. Reports from Spirit seem to be good, as are the reports from the young man who plays mellophone who has posted drum corps videos on Youtube. We'll probably only know for certain when the season begins, but I think they'll be at least as good as last year and if as many veterans as they claim have returned, perhaps a bit better.

I agree. While we've heard quite a bit from George Hopkins, who floats all kinds of ideas both good and bad, and Misters Gibbs and Fielder have also been mentioned, three if not four corps have been rather silent, unless I've missed something which is quite possible. There are so many threads on this subject no one can keep track of everything said. Also none of the directors seem to call me and ask me for my advice, and I'm not going to sit by the phone waiting for a call because it's probably not going to happen, so my thoughts are purely speculation. However, if there were to be a split, my guess is that at least three corps would not leave: Phantom, Crown, and Bluecoats. My reasons: Phantom: has come so close to financial insolvency that while the potential of more revenue from a split may be appealing, there's also too much of a risk if the venture fails. Crown: Crown does best when audiences go wild and perhaps more than any corps feeds off of the audience, and while many in the stands love Crown, Crown is not the favorite of those who adore the G7 corps. This may just be my hope. If Crown joins the spilt, we'll probably never see them in Boston again since I do not foresee G7 shows in New England. They snubbed BAC which alone would alienate most fans, and a spilt could potentially destroy DCI which would potentially alienate the 27th Lancer alum crowd since George Bonfiglio and 27th played a huge role in the founding of DCI. You have to have people fill the stands to generate the revenues the corps hope to get.. Bluecoats: Judging from the 990's, Bluecoats tend to run a tight ship financially and are known for being prudent. They may take a risk on the field, but they'd never risk the well-being of the organization. Also, I'd love to see this underrated corps win a DCI championship. When push comes to shove, I understand the desire for more revenues, especially for the California corps who have higher travel expenses. The power grab is unreasonable, but it's human. The belief that the corps that are in the G7 are the most beloved and will always be the best is shortsighted to say thd least, as we have seen with Cavaliers placing 8th, some years where Bluecoats and SCV have been closer to the corps who placed in the 5-9 category rather than the 1-4 group. Also, survival at the expense of other corps is in excusable. I hope there is not a split. DCI would not be the same without the G7, and the G7 alone all season would not be as interesting as the G7 at DCI shows.

I thought I remembered the commentators saying on the PBS Broadcast of 1978 that Santa Clara added a reprise of "The Bottle Dance" for finals. I know I saw them earlier that season but I don't remember "The Bottle Dance" in the show and do recall being surprised when I saw it on TV. Now this broadcast would have had Pete Emmons as the authority who all but said his own corps SCV probably wouldn't win that night. It also had Gene Rayburn and his lovely wife who no doubt loved what they saw but didn't know much about it and said all kinds of incorrect comments, so it may have been said but it may not have been correct. Does anyone know?

I agree. As soon as the show started and the first notes were played, I had a feeling they would do it, and they more than did it. Finals was a more polished performance which I thoroughly enjoyed and has transferred well to CD and DVD, but semi's had an electricity that was nothing short of amazing and if you weren't at Indy or Big, Live, and Loud, you missed a great show, so plan accordingly for 2013!!!.

I'm old enough to remember "drum corps sharp" as a standard for any unit marching in a parade and I'm an old schooler at heart, so I probably should be reprimanding Crown, but I do enjoy Crown and think Crown seems to be getting quite a few lumps for their parade performances. They get quite a few lumps anyway, but I've seen Crown in parades. I've seen Phantom too, though it probably goes back a few years, though based on the video, the style is not different. Phantom's style is more regimented (no pun intended) than their field show. Crown's style is much like their field show. Now I have never seen Phantom at a moment where there's a pause in the parade. They've just marched by me and were playing music. Perhaps they get up close and personal, but I can't say. I've seen Crown march by in a similar fashion and I've been at points where they've had to stop at pauses along the route. When they are marching and playing they are in straight lines, the marchers are in step, though not as formal as Phantom and they may have some typical Crown moves, but they are in sync. When they pause they get up close and personal, may play a tune that is light hearted, and may let loose a bit. Crowds love it and it's well performed, and the crowd absolutely goes wild when they return to formation and march away. The styles may be different, but in both cases it's well planned. In the end I think it's personal preference. Also, there is a big difference in venues. The posted PR clip is from a Memorial Day Parade which requires a certain decorum. I believe most of the Youtube clips of Crown parade performances are from Bristol, RI's July 4th parade with floats, clowns, unicyclists (the Cycling Murrays seem to be at just about every New England parade--I think they can bi-locate), the Mummers, and various Shriner's groups. You don't find this at a Memorial Day parade, nor should you. Perhaps if we look back we can see that precision and traditional are not the same. One of drum corps most "revered" corps, the 27th Lancers (again, no pun intended...well maybe it is intended) was praised for their precision. The almost always perfect wheel, the rifle line that exemplified excellence, and their perfect lines in complex and difficult early Zingali drills were razor sharp. No one said this about 27th's arch-rival Bridgemen, at least at the time. they were entertainers and footloose and fancy free. They were often branded with the ever horrible drum corps insult "band" which was far more serious back in the day but when I watch Legacy DVD's today, while still loyal to my three Massachusetts favorites: 27th, North Star, and shamefully absent through no fault of theirs on DVD until 1999 BAC, I can admit now I did enjoy the Bridgemen and I'm often surprised at how clean and precise the Bridgemen were, especially the Bridgemen shuffle, perhaps not as crisp as 27th (or BAC for that matter), but still very good and better than most. .Nontraditional does not mean imprecise.

Since at least the 1970's. I can recall that in the 1970's when Boston area drum corps, CYO bands, and drill teams had feeder units, the "senior" groups often did larger parades on Memorial Day, July 4th, etc. and the feeder units did local parades. When you think about it, it only made sense to be paid for a parade. Marching units have to pay transportation and staff cost to get to parades. There was also competition to get into parades. The Bristol, RI July 4th parade was the parade equivalent of DCI. Marching in South Boston's St. Patrick's Day Parade meant your unit was ready for the season and led to other parade offers. Parades allowed units to compete. My guess is hat in this financially strapped time, every little bit helps.