When will Cadets catch Crown?

[2000Cadet]

Soooo.......I retract my previous "trading all the way to texas." It might be, may be, could very well be....that HNC will not catch Crown at all !!

I HIGHLY doubt that. If Cadets don't make any huge changes like they did last year, and/or if Crown doesn't peak early, they could have more of a chance if they clean what they have and make their little changes and stuff like that.

[FTNK]

Crown is really KILLING Cadets in GE. As we all know, it's all about GE these days. I think it's going to be a long summer as Cadets sink back through the rankings.

[DcFr3aK]

We still don't really know how Cadets will fare agains SCV and BD! Only time will tell how Crown's and Cadets' shows hold up against the west competition and time!!!

But for the time being, it seems that Cadets have a lot to do to keep up with Crown. It was also a very wet show this evening, so I'm thinking with their high velocity on the field was hindered.

Both these shows are ones for the year books!

Keep up the great work!

[jwillis35]

Trust me, the Cadets show has plenty of GE. Amazing GE! They will be fine. They have to clean it and fine tune it, but the show is there if you ask me. I saw both corps twice, although that was last week, but from my read both shows are excellent. Both shows have about equal demand, great talent, and some wonderful music. Crown, for all their demand and great performance, does not have as super charged a show as they did last year. It's not one of those shows that will put the crowds on their feet multiple times. It is good, no doubt. What they do well this year is perform, and boy do they do that well.

But Cadets also have incredible demand, great performance, and a great show. The difference, I think (even with Crown winning GE by a good margin now), will ultimately be GE, only more so in favor of the Cadets come August. I just think their show has more going for it and really doesn't need huge wholesale changes. They just need to clean with perhaps some minor tweaks.

Crown may not have to change much either, but my gut instinct tells me they will have to make some changes come July when others start closing the gap. I think how they handle that will largely determine where they go from that point.

What is not in question at all is this: both Crown and Cadets are two of the best corps out there this year. I think those two with BD are your top 3 in DCI at this point.

Edited July 3, 2009 by jwillis35

[corpsband]

Trust me, the Cadets show has plenty of GE. Amazing GE! They will be fine. They have to clean it and fine tune it, but the show is there if you ask me. I saw both corps twice, although that was last week, but from my read both shows are excellent. Both shows have about equal demand, great talent, and some wonderful music. Crown, for all their demand and great performance, does not have as super charged a show as they did last year. It's not one of those shows that will put the crowds on their feet multiple times. It is good, no doubt. What they do well this year is perform, and boy do they do that well.

I think the Cadets GE relies too heavily on drill. Remember they came out of Annapolis with ~250 pages of drill and I think they've added more! Cavies traditionally generate a lot of effect through drill BUT they are so well coordinated musically and visually. For some reason I felt like the Cadets show was "wow cool drill" but not so well coordinated musically and visually.

I'm also concerned about variety of effect. While it is pow, pow, pow with drill effects, are there other ways this show could lead me on a journey more effectively?

Its been a long time since I've seen it live so I'm certainly open minded about it.

Edited July 3, 2009 by corpsband

[Canuck DCGroupie]

Crown is really KILLING Cadets in GE. As we all know, it's all about GE these days. I think it's going to be a long summer as Cadets sink back through the rankings.

I disagree.

Saw the show in Erie. I am still having a hard time trying to understand Crown's Show. They have more horns than Cadets but the Cadet's book is harder and more dynamic.

I am not sure how judges evaluate the sections in the show where the Crown members are in free form and moving all over the field. Too much of this. I found it very boring and there was no real in your face moments other than one company front.

FYI, I counted one tuba fall, and 4 rifle drops in a 2 minute period with Crown and when members were moving and getting up from the ground, it was sloppy.

Sorry but Cadets GE will move up and not sink as stated above. They have a much harder, faster and more traditional drum corps show than Crown and in the end will pass them, not yet but mid July for sure.

I think things will change when the judges get on the field and see more inconsistencies in Crown's drill and GE.

Edited July 3, 2009 by Canuck DCGroupie

[corpsband]

I disagree.

Saw the show in Erie. I am still having a hard time trying to understand Crown's Show. They have more horns than Cadets but the Cadet's book is harder and more dynamic.

I am not sure how judges evaluate the sections in the show where the Crown members are in free form and moving all over the field. Too much of this. I found it very boring and there was no real in your face moments other than one company front.

FYI, I counted one tuba fall, and 4 rifle drops in a 2 minute period with Crown and when members were moving and getting up from the ground, it was sloppy.

Sorry but Cadets GE will move up and not sink as stated above. The have a much harder, faster and more traditional drum corps show than Crown and in the end will pass them, not yet but mid July for sure.

I think things will change when the judges get on the field and see more inconsistencies in Crown's drill and GE.

Whenever I hear "but the X's show is so much harder" it raises red flags. There's nothing subtle about Cadets demand and I'm sure the judges are more than capable of comparing the written book for both corps.

Falls and drops don't result in deductions any more. And people are falling or dropping in early July probably means the book is pretty demanding!

Finally field judges are not gonna help GE scores.

[Lancerlady]

I can see why Crown is ahead. Crown's horn line is incredible, especially for this time of the year. I'm not so much impressed with the drill, it's a little spastic. I hope they've changed it since that first show I saw on the "website" we're not allowed to post from.

Also I was disappointed in Cadets design and arrangements.

Electronics are over rated and unnecessary, and it's just not working for me. If that's the reason why they wanted them so bad...I'm a little ... by them.

If Cadets get a better drill, work out some arrangement issues, they will move ahead of Crown.

[BOSMarcher]

FYI, I counted one tuba fall, and 4 rifle drops in a 2 minute period with Crown and when members were moving and getting up from the ground, it was sloppy.

I think things will change when the judges get on the field and see more inconsistencies in Crown's drill and GE.

I think it is known that people falling do not make for significant changes in score... especially when it comes to recovery. Judges award points for recovery, as well (whether it involves a fall or not). The Cavaliers had a fall on Finals night in 2001... but they still won.

... in addition, take a look at the Cadets 2002 show if you want to count falls and drops. Their placement didn't change either.

[Canuck DCGroupie]

I think it is known that people falling do not make for significant changes in score... especially when it comes to recovery. Judges award points for recovery, as well (whether it involves a fall or not). The Cavaliers had a fall on Finals night in 2001... but they still won.

... in addition, take a look at the Cadets 2002 show if you want to count falls and drops. Their placement didn't change either.

Thanks for the clarification on falling etc, didn't know that.

I just feel the overall show by Crown has too much in free form parts that to me would be hard to judge and is quite dirty. I think once the field judges are out there, the marks will change again.

Sorry but I find HNC's drill once clean will overpower Crown's.