Madison Scouts 2010

[Medeabrass]

Throwback unform change is suicide? >>>see The Cadets. Hasn't hurt them one bit.

Lack of show design? >>>I am sure they didn't bring Vanderkolff and Mason aboard for nothing.

Out there? >>> see Spartacus, a retro show, BD with the 1980's wings in 2007, Cadets WSS. Scouts doing tunes they have done in year's past is nothing new.

Maybe it's just me, but I thought Mason made it pretty clear on the goal's for this corps this year, in his Nov interview online and also with Steve Vickers. It's all about getting a temperature of where the corps is at and getting the madison brand back. that excitement.

I see no risks being taken here. They placed 15th last year. Not much risk when you place that far back. Risk would be if they had been in the top 5 for the last however many years and going a totally different direction, and messing with success.

Well said. I would add that "being out there" has worked for this design group from a "competitive" stand point in the past. I don't think they are too worried about trying to conform to what they think the judges will like. They're more concerned with improving the overall performance of the corps. If they do that, they're going to move up anyways. Worrying about all that other stuff won't be much of a concern until they're closer to pushing the big boys.

On a side note, I was visiting with some Star friends at our last alumni corps camp about Madison's show design and lack of a theme. I don't know if it was intended, but they are actually pushing today's envelope by not having a theme. It reminds me of when I go to 6th Street in Austin and see way too many people trying to be different just like everybody else. The normal looking person is the one who is truly being different. One thing I can guarantee, this design team will never ever worry about conforming to current trends.

Edited February 26, 2010 by Medeabrass

[contrajedi8]

No. Tell me, what was the theme of Harmonic Journey? More topically, Power, Pizzazz, and All That Jazz, or even something as vague as, say, A Drum Corp Fan's Dream? And what about those titles makes them necessary? Do we need someone to say "We're playing jazz music this year" or "This is music that appeals to average drum corps fans." I certainly don't mind them, but if Phantom had just showed up in 2003, played four unrelated pieces and left the field without ever giving their show a moderately useless name, my experience of that show would be the same, and I'd still like it.

(disclaimer: all that having been said, "Faust" and "Spartacus" are two of my favorite shows. There's nothing to a themed show or an unthemed show that makes it innately better than the other, just execution and design)

Agreed.

[Medeabrass]

Doesn't the rep they chose (Rhapsody and Slaughter) constitute some kind of Theme? How can there be a show without a theme? Without a theme it just becomes a concert without any cohesiveness in the performance. Unless, that’s the kind of things you want... But really, I think the pieces do "fit" together nicely in a program which means that there MUST be some kind theme that lead the designers to choose those two pieces. We just might not know about it or they might not announce it.

Star of Indiana didn't have a theme in '93. The movement and visual simply reflected the mood of the music. Some will disagree with me but I think our show was cohesive.

When did a friggin' theme become necessary for cohesiveness...This is going to sound bad but that is a neophyte statement to make...look at some of the great shows before 1995 that didn't have a theme and tell me they're wandering around aimlessly like an old elephant waiting to die. I think a really good show is cohesive in and of itself without the "playbill-like" explanation of a theme tellling you what to think or where they're going...you, the viewer get to decide what it means to you. Discovery, thinking, and interpretation is part of the fun to me.

[MissionImpossible Scout]

You want your theme for the Scouts show this year, here you go

The theme is "Being Bad freaking ###"

[MissionImpossible Scout]

there's a possibility the judges won't stand for it.

That's not a problem in the slightest. I haven't known a true Madison Scout who gave a #### about what a judge thought. The Scouts don't care about Judges. They care about hyping crowds and puting on what they think is a great show. They don't need a judge to tell them if they have a crappy show or a great show. They'll know.

[BigBadMadMan]

there's a possibility the judges won't stand for it.

That's not a problem in the slightest. I haven't known a true Madison Scout who gave a #### about what a judge thought. The Scouts don't care about Judges. They care about hyping crowds and puting on what they think is a great show. They don't need a judge to tell them if they have a crappy show or a great show. They'll know.

While I would agree in premise, the fact remains that this is still a competitive activity. However, if you build a sound foundation, the rest will come. THEN the two can walk hand-in-hand rather than be mutually exclusive (competitive success vs. the Madison Scout crowd appeal)

[euponitone]

No. Tell me, what was the theme of Harmonic Journey? More topically, Power, Pizzazz, and All That Jazz, or even something as vague as, say, A Drum Corp Fan's Dream? And what about those titles makes them necessary? Do we need someone to say "We're playing jazz music this year" or "This is music that appeals to average drum corps fans." I certainly don't mind them, but if Phantom had just showed up in 2003, played four unrelated pieces and left the field without ever giving their show a moderately useless name, my experience of that show would be the same, and I'd still like it.

(disclaimer: all that having been said, "Faust" and "Spartacus" are two of my favorite shows. There's nothing to a themed show or an unthemed show that makes it innately better than the other, just execution and design)

Hrmm...just picking on one of those, but harmonic journey had a pretty obvious theme. It wasnt all that deep, but it was there... As for the other ones you mentioned (both madison)...not sure...

[BlooContraGuy]

Well said. I would add that "being out there" has worked for this design group from a "competitive" stand point in the past. I don't think they are too worried about trying to conform to what they think the judges will like. They're more concerned with improving the overall performance of the corps. If they do that, they're going to move up anyways. Worrying about all that other stuff won't be much of a concern until they're closer to pushing the big boys.

On a side note, I was visiting with some Star friends at our last alumni corps camp about Madison's show design and lack of a theme. I don't know if it was intended, but they are actually pushing today's envelope by not having a theme. It reminds me of when I go to 6th Street in Austin and see way too many people trying to be different just like everybody else. The normal looking person is the one who is truly being different. One thing I can guarantee, this design team will never ever worry about conforming to current trends.

Thanks for putting it in terms I understand!

Star of Indiana didn't have a theme in '93. The movement and visual simply reflected the mood of the music. Some will disagree with me but I think our show was cohesive.

When did a friggin' theme become necessary for cohesiveness...This is going to sound bad but that is a neophyte statement to make...look at some of the great shows before 1995 that didn't have a theme and tell me they're wandering around aimlessly like an old elephant waiting to die. I think a really good show is cohesive in and of itself without the "playbill-like" explanation of a theme tellling you what to think or where they're going...you, the viewer get to decide what it means to you. Discovery, thinking, and interpretation is part of the fun to me.

If more corps start to pull off what Star did in 93, I would definitely not be complaining.

[Rimba47]

WHY DOES THERE HAVE TO BE A THEME?????

Can't a corps just go out and play a **** show with just some **** good music w/o there having to be a **** theme now? When did this happen? I don't recall seeing that in the rule book. Hoppy?!?!?!

Every great piece of music, art, sculpture, production, play, essay, book, and show has at least a title. Every drum corps show has a theme because MUSIC in general is full of thematic ideas! When I say "theme" I'm not just talking about "Spartacus" "This I believe" or "The Machine". I'm talking about the summation of the music, drill, and guard work and its collective idea. To say that a drum corps show has NO theme is to ignore all the intricacies of the show. A theme-less show would be no show at all. Even music for the sake of vibrating columns of air is a theme imo. If Madison is making the decisions that they’re making because they want to be loud and fast well then… that’s a theme.

That being said, I'm not saying that Madison has to announce a theme or show title. They certainly don't. I agree that a corps could just come on a play 4 awesome pieces without an announced theme or show title and it can be cohesive and audience pleasing. BUT, that doesn't change the fact that it has theme. While most Drum Corps announce a show title and theme, it doesn't mean that their show is nameless or theme-less at its core.

Edited February 26, 2010 by Rimba47

[crfrey71]

Every great piece of music, art, sculpture, production, play, essay, book, and show has at least a title. Every drum corps show has a theme because MUSIC in general is full of thematic ideas! When I say "theme" I'm not just talking about "Spartacus" "This I believe" or "The Machine". I'm talking about the summation of the music, drill, and guard work and its collective idea. To say that a drum corps show has NO theme is to ignore all the intricacies of the show. A theme-less show would be no show at all. Even music for the sake of vibrating columns of air is a theme imo. If Madison is making the decisions that they’re making because they want to be loud and fast well then… that’s a theme.

That being said, I'm not saying that Madison has to announce a theme or show title. They certainly don't. I agree that a corps could just come on a play 4 awesome pieces without an announced theme or show title and it can be cohesive and audience pleasing. BUT, that doesn't change the fact that it has theme. While most Drum Corps announce a show title and theme, it doesn't mean that their show is nameless or theme-less at its core.

I can easily rebute this, yet again.

Drum corps had styles and the shows were based on styles, not necessarily themes, back then. Since we are talking about the Scouts, please tell me what the theme of one of their more famous shows, in 1981, is about? The reportoire that year was Numero Uno, Malaguena, Down Wind, and Through the Eyes of love (Ice Castles). They finished in 3rd that year.

You didn't need themes back then because corps had styles. The shows were built around that corps' style.