Would you walk away if DCI shows were like in the 80s and 90s

[dcpincollector]

Just because something changes and you don't like it doesn't mean you have to walk away. I remember having to deal with this when my children were babies. But finally they grew up.

You will always have the right to "walk away", but please don't "walk away" and keep coming back to complain. Make a clean break and leave those of us that can tolerate change to our fun. Make a clean break and leave the rest of us alone!

If you want drum corps to be the way it was when you were in, buy the CD's and DVD's and enjoy yourself. Maybe you should go watch DCA. They say that they have still have "pure" drum corps. These threads keep popping up and it is getting "old" to say the least. It is starting to verge on stupidity.

[WOOHOO]

Just because something changes and you don't like it doesn't mean you have to walk away. I remember having to deal with this when my children were babies. But finally they grew up.

You will always have the right to "walk away", but please don't "walk away" and keep coming back to complain. Make a clean break and leave those of us that can tolerate change to our fun. Make a clean break and leave the rest of us alone!

If you want drum corps to be the way it was when you were in, buy the CD's and DVD's and enjoy yourself. Maybe you should go watch DCA. They say that they have still have "pure" drum corps. These threads keep popping up and it is getting "old" to say the least. It is starting to verge on stupidity.

Bravo!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[ahquad]

Has my vote for any election you'd run in. Kudos.

Just because something changes and you don't like it doesn't mean you have to walk away. I remember having to deal with this when my children were babies. But finally they grew up.

You will always have the right to "walk away", but please don't "walk away" and keep coming back to complain. Make a clean break and leave those of us that can tolerate change to our fun. Make a clean break and leave the rest of us alone!

If you want drum corps to be the way it was when you were in, buy the CD's and DVD's and enjoy yourself. Maybe you should go watch DCA. They say that they have still have "pure" drum corps. These threads keep popping up and it is getting "old" to say the least. It is starting to verge on stupidity.

[BRASSO]

That is what I meant by nothing personal to the members, because I know the equipment from that time was unacceptable. I'm sure they were trying just as hard then as now to be the best performers they could, and it is ignorant to think otherwise, and that truly is not what I meant.

In spite of what I just said, bad performance is bad performance, no matter the reason, even if that reason is reasonable.

Well, to be clear, there can be a WHOLE different meaning definition to " bad performance " and that of " subpar technical abilities" according to accepted musical norms. Lets not confuse the two here.

For example, It is NOT neccessarily an " incorrect " statement at all to believe that the 2010 Blue Devils show is a " bad performance ". One can say this, as " bad performances " are a purely subjective personal evaluation whereas " technical abilities " can be much more adequately and objectively quantified and defined. Some movie criitics, as a further illustration, can say a particular actor gave a " bad performance" in a role, while another equally qualified movie critic would believe just the opposite was true regarding that actors " performance " in that movie role. Both crtics however would be on more solid footing when they discussed that actors acting technical " abilities "., skills, and so forth.

So " no " it is not true that DCI Champion Corps of the 70's and 80's gave " bad performances ". It would only be true in your OPINION, and that opinion may not be shared by others. Likewise, it would not neccessarily be accurate for me to say with certitude that that the 2010 Blue Devils gave us " bad performances " this year either, even If I found their show unsatisfying or even boring.. It would only be true with my OPINION. I'd be on less solid footing if i said that the 2010 Blue Devils had inferior technical abilities over previous era Champions. That's why I would never make such a claim regarding the Blue Devils technical skils and profiency levels being subpar compared to earlier DCI Corps Champions.

Edited September 20, 2010 by BRASSO

[WOOHOO]

Well, to be clear, there can be a WHOLE different meaning definition to " bad performance " and that of " subpar technical abilities" according to accepted musical norms. Lets not confused the two.

For example, It is NOT neccessarily an " incorrect " statement at all to believe that the 2010 Blue Devils show is a " bad performance ". One can say this, as " bad performances " are a purely subjective evaluation whereas " technical abilities " can be much more adequately defined. Some movie criitics as a further illustration can say a particular actor gave a " bad performance" in a role, while another equally qualified movie critic would believe just the opposite was true regarding that actors " performance " in that movie role. Both crtics however would be on more solid footing when they discussed that actors acting technical " abilities ".

So " no " it is not true that DCI Champion Corps of the 70's and 80's gave " bad performances ". It would only be true in your OPINION, and that opinion may not be shared by others. Likewise, it would not neccessarily be accurate for me to say with certitude that that the 2010 Blue Devils gave us " bad performances " this year. It would only be true with my OPINION. I'd be on less solid footing if i said that the 2010 Blue Devils had inferior technical abilities over previous era Champions. That's why I would never make such a claim regarding the Blue Devils technical skils and profiency levels being subpar compared to earlier DCI Corps Champions.

Well, since I focused on ensemble blend earlier, and never brought up technical abilities, my "bad performance" statement was obviously focused on ensemble blend. But perhaps I wasn't clear, so there you go. Their "bad performance" of "ensemble blend" was simply unacceptable.

BTW, before we go down this painfully obvious road, yes, I know that this is an opinion, so please do not inform me of that obvious statement. I, like anyone else, do not need social acceptance to have this opinion, or to share it. All I am doing is sharing a statement based on my current beliefs, which are based on my current knowledge, which, like all opinions, are subject to constant change.

Edited September 20, 2010 by WOOHOO

[BRASSO]

Well, since I focused on ensemble blend earlier, and never brought up technical abilities, my "bad performance" statement was obviously focused on ensemble blend. But perhaps I wasn't clear, so there you go. Their "bad performance" of "ensemble blend" was simply unacceptable.

" Technical abilities and profiency " are only one component of " performance ".

Those who are commercially successful in the entertainment realm will acknowledge for us that " performance " does not entirely rest solely with the intergration levels between disparate elements among and between the performers. The " performance " rests as a shared experience between the performers and the recipients of that performance, ie the audience. One can have a " bad performance " and yet have the various musical sections all be in perfect, technical sync. This is why most professional performers in the Performing Arts look both at themselves AND their audience to determine whether or not they gave a smashingly successful performance or a... " bad performance ".

Edited September 20, 2010 by BRASSO

[WOOHOO]

" Technical abilities and profiency " are only one component of " performance ".

Those who are commercially successful in the entertainment realm will acknowledge for us that " performance " does no entirely rest with intergration levels between disparate elements among and between the performers. The " performance " rests as a shared experince between the performers and the recipients of that performance, ie the audience. One can have a " bad performance " and yet have the various musical sections all in perfect, technical sync. This is why most performers in the Performing Arts look both at themselves AND their audience to determine whether or not they gave a smashingly successful performance or a " bad performance ".

I agree, there is more to performance than one aspect, but I am only focusing on one aspect in this assessment. I made a comment on one aspect of 70's drum corps, blend, which wasn't good.

[deftguy]

I would RUN back to DCI in a heartbeat if they returned to doing 80's and 90's type shows. With the skills these young kids have, they would have a field day putting good shows on the field.

However, I am a realist, and it ain't going to happen EVER! Kids these days have the same attitude about those shows as I have about shows done today. Even a simple "old school" move is met with an eye roll.

[Big Bad Bari]

Well..... I have to say that IMO the corps play with too much control now...

When you listened to a corps from the 70's, 80's and 90's You can almost hear the heart of each player as they emoted! Certainly you can hear the "personality" of each hornline... And again this is just MO... But today the corps are so controlled in their musicality that they sound like HUGE pipe organs with the same level emotion you can got out of one!

I know I sound like I am bashing... I am not, I love these kids and think the world of them... There are no where as many TICKS in their recordings that they have to listen to for posterity as there are in mine! But I do like to feel the HUMAN emotion coming through the bells!!!

[BRASSO]

I agree, there is more to performance than one aspect, but I am only focusing on one aspect in this assessment. I made a comment on one aspect of 70's drum corps, blend, which wasn't good.

Fair enough. You are on more solid footing ( my opinion here ) when you want to be critical of technical aspects of Corps from the 70's, 80's ( or even this year too )

One can say that a Corps gave " bad performances "... even a 2010 DCI winning titleist.... and be on solid footing here as well, imo.

I can say that the Blue Devils this year were unbelievably superior in proper brass technique, while also stating that they gave " bad performances ". The two are not a contradiction at all. Likewise, one could state that the 1976 Blue Devils had subpar issues in some aspects of proper brass tecniques but still gave a " great performance ". Again, the two are not mutually exclusive at all, imo.

In short, " playing " a trumpet or drum is by no means the same thing as " performing " with a trumpet or drum. Highly successful professsional trumpet players and professional percusssionists know precisely the critically important difference here too.

Edited September 20, 2010 by BRASSO