First 2 show results thread

[oldtimedrummer]

Bluecoats 1st in drums on Saturday, 7th on Sunday???

Same thing @ Crown first in Ensemble Music Saturday, sixth on Sunday? SCV went from second to seventh in Visual Performance? Makes one wonder.

Edited June 21, 2011 by oldtimedrummer

[oldtimedrummer]

Yes, these things are possible. It seems to defy logic, but when examined it makes sense.

First show = 1st read for judges, incomplete shows, varying levels of performance from the corps.

Second show = 2nd read for the judges, and in some cases judging in different areas, again varying levels of performance, the order of the corps was reversed, and on and on.

We always say on here, and it's true, that it's not so much the score but the spread. I wouldn't look at it as Crown's score going down. Other corps were simply seen as being just as good, and the 2nd read for the judges helped to clarify to them where each of these shows are at the moment.

And of course this will change...it's a long season.

How can you justify gross inconsistency on first and second "reads", when the judging panel was different each night? It was a first read for each panel. I can see things moving around a little bit, but Bloo going from first to seventh in drums, SCV second to seventh in Visual Performance, and CC first to sixth in ensemble music, is pretty extreme IMO.

Edited June 21, 2011 by oldtimedrummer

[Euphscott]

Blue Stars. Loud. :-)

That was not the case live at Saginaw. They had the least volume of all the corps in my opinion from 40 yard line halfway up.

For the record, Bluecoats and Cavaliers seemed the loudest of the evening. But that won't exactly win them any awards!

[chaos001]

If the weather cooperates tonight.

Funny, I always thought the dynamic range was controlled by the volume the players were playing. Closer might make them work harder (what a novel idea!), but it can't actually "limit" them. Did think BS's amp's were a little hot tonight too.

Loved - Crown, Cavies, PR, BS, SCV perc.

Liked/OK with - Coats and Cadets

Didn't like - BD and SCV horns

We'll see what my team can do toinght in Martin TN - Go Teal! NEM!

[Old Corps Guy]

Conspiracy theory:

The wide variations in scores has to do with the judges on day 2 not having the scores from day 1.

Someone had to say it.

[BozzlyB]

Really not paying much attention to scores for a couple of weeks. I think we'll continue to see movement over the next few weeks and have a much better idea of where the groupings will be come beginning of July.

[BoyWonder1911]

Well there. Carolina Crown can now say that they've beaten the Blue Devils.

Other than that, I'm also surprised that Bluecoats' percussion went from 1st to 7th, and that Crown went from 1st to 4th. But I do think they performed better the first night. The wind was worse on Sunday, if I remember correctly, the wind carries the sound away.

SCV percussion was very, very good.

I think the top 3 is set, will be Cavs, BD and Cadets in the top 3. I don't think Crown has the show to compete with them, but I don't see anyone else beating them, their music is more difficult and executed better than anyone below them. I think Crown takes 4th this year.

After 1-4, I can't really say who will place what anymore...Bluecoats are good, have a good show, and at the same time, not. I think Phantom's show is flat and mostly uneventful, but who knows what they are going to do with the show later in the season?? They could add a lot of things.

SCV has a really good visual program, and awesome percussion, but they need to clean. Their brass will get better, I'm sure, but it is going to come down to whether or not the judges actually like the brass book. There are hardly any in-your-face moments. It's a very intense show, and this show could also go either way.

I won't comment on the Blue Stars other than I'm disappointed with how the judges placed them, but I will try to not read too much into it. I just would really, really like to see them move up out of that 8th slot. It just seems like they aren't respected as much as they could be from a lot of people. Is it the uniforms? Some have said the gray makes them look soft and weak, therefore they are a soft and weak corps. I think the gray and white makes them look sharp.

Oh well.

It is the very first week. I am looking forward to watching the other 15 WC corps too. Get to see Spirit, Teal Sound and Music City's debut tonight.

Edited June 21, 2011 by BoyWonder1911

[BigMo]

Conspiracy theory:

The wide variations in scores has to do with the judges on day 2 not having the scores from day 1.

Someone had to say it.

I TOTALLY AGREE. I have been saying for several years that having the recaps online after the show has impacted judging. Each caption judge wants to be "in the ball park", that is human nature. Seeing the previous scores DOES make an impression. That impression may be anywhere from "slight" to "strong", depending on the judge.

I personally like the fact that the judges did not have the recaps from the first night. They were forced to judge it as they saw it! (What a novel concept!) I think it would be interesting to have DCI decide not to release recap scores to the internet for a month or so, or even a full season. Each corps would receive recaps, but hopefully they would not publish them.

When I have judged, I never had the luxury of having previous scores. (This was not DCI). I was forced to really pay attention and watch carefully.

For me, I am not terribly upset with the scores moving around. Someone made a very good point - IT'S EARLY. Shows are not complete. This early situation may have very little to do with placement when we get to Indianapolis.

[jimmyjazz]

How can you justify gross inconsistency on first and second "reads", when the judging panel was different each night? It was a first read for each panel. I can see things moving around a little bit, but Bloo going from first to seventh in drums, SCV second to seventh in Visual Performance, and CC first to sixth in ensemble music, is pretty extreme IMO.

I think people are getting too hung up on ordinal rankings. Imagine a competition where 8 performers (you pick the medium) received the following scores:

A: 90.7

B: 90.6

C: 90.5

D: 90.4

E: 90.3

F: 90.2

G: 90.1

H: 90.0

Now imagine that the following evening, group "A" had a bit of an off night where every other competitor got a bit better. The scores went:

B: 90.9

C: 90.8

D: 90.7

E: 90.6

F: 90.5

G: 90.4

A: 90.3

H: 90.2

"Oh my God, how could Group A drop from 1st to 7th???" I realize this isn't a direct analogy for what happened last weekend, but come on, we're talking about 2 juding panels who (a) don't know the shows and (b) saw different things. Slight differences from night to night can cause large differences in ordinal rankings, especially when we're talking about a tightly bunched group of corps at the top of the game. Relax.

[bluecoats88]

Funny, I always thought the dynamic range was controlled by the volume the players were playing. Closer might make them work harder (what a novel idea!), but it can't actually "limit" them. Did think BS's amp's were a little hot tonight too.

Well I don't see the scaffolding keeping them in the front of the field a detriment to their volume, but I do see it as helping to make them louder and more together becasue they are closer to each other and closer to the audience.

The problem I see with the scaffolding is that it keeps the whole corps in front of the center X the entire show. there were only a couple of times when any part of the hornline got behind the center X. This is just like last year when the coffins framed the field and stacked the corps thus limiting their use of the field.

Sure it will make them sound louder and make it easier to play together since they are keeping the hornline in a tighter area, but visually they will be killed due to the lack of demand and field coverage.