dcvet95 Posted August 21, 2011 Share Posted August 21, 2011 You aren't catching my drift. The current discussion relates to Ryan's effect on the hornline. NOT JDs. JD isn't the leader of a "trouble section". HOWEVER, when a section of the corps places UNDER the total placement of the corps, that is considered underperforming your placement. When a corps is 9th and the brass is 6th, that is a compliment, not a degradation. This year, however, the corps placed 5th and the hornline consistently placed below that placement. JDs arrangements are, and have been, great. So this isn't a discussion of JD dropping the ball, this is a discussion about how the caption head alters the relative placement of the hornline compared to the corps. Since 00, I'd venture to guess the hornline has met or surpassed the placement of the corps, just about every year. Not the case this year, and they were one of the corps weaknesses. Actually... I do understand how relative placement works. I've been in this activity a LONG time (and have won a couple of brass trophies myself). While you can argue symantics about "relative placements", I will go with my ears. The last three years of PR have been similar in achievement. Like I said before, the biggest drop off in brass performance in my opinion was between 08-09. Apparently the judges saw it that way too. With Ryan at the helm, the brass performance stayed about the same. I think regiment's placement this year had a lot to do with the return of a great visual staff and one helluva show (props to JD). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralTsoChicken Posted August 21, 2011 Share Posted August 21, 2011 and for me, music is all about emotions. This is the very reason I think Mr. Hypemachine, Tommy Andre Feagin would be awesome in this job. As for Kennedy, his arrangements are nice... however I've never heard one that wasn't kitschy and some of it seems dowdy in comparison to what other corps are doing. A little too much Boerma in him for my tastes, especially in regards to Phantom Regiment. So no, you aren't in the minority there! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sax1210 Posted August 21, 2011 Share Posted August 21, 2011 Too each his own. I loved Kennedy's Boston's Les Mis this year as it fit the visual beautifully. The Cadets '89 version ( and Boston's version in '88 ) were in a different time where the music was more in the forefront of the scoring sheets. The '89 Cadets version today would have gotten killed on the Visual and Guard sheets of today. Kennedy did not write this Les Mis. version for 1989 judging sheets. He wrote the arrangement to fit the wonderful visual design that was created for Boston to be able to compete well under the current scoring sheets. For perspective, I can't think of much music from ANY the 70's and 80's Drum Corps that I believe was brought back again in these times with better music arrangements when looked at purely through a musical lens. From strictly a musical arrangement ( not profiency levels ), I enjoy on balance the arrangements written of all these songs better from earlier decades...including updated versions of earlier songs from top Corps like BD, SCV, and even Cadets themselves. Usually ,I find the earlier written arrangement have more depth, and are longer, not chopped up to fit the visuals that are now required of modern Corps and the modern judging sheets. For example, I enjoyed Cadets '84 West Side Story music arrangements way more than the updated WSS versions they did decades later. Few, if any of the modern arrangements brought back have better arrangements in my view. But when looked at thru the prism of the visual component, the visual and music go together much better for the most part with todays Corps than in the 70's and 80's combined music and visual. If I go to '89 Cadets Les Mis production on Fan Network and put on the mute button and just WATCH the visual of '89 Cadets Les Mis., the offering is subpar compared to the 8th place finishing Boston Crusaders visual from this year ( tarp and all ). Finally, Boston's version of Les Mis. this year received a 7th, 8th place in GE Music from the 2 GE Music judges and 8th in Brass at Finals. This year's Corps I'm told had 90 High School aged students in line. Way more than most recent years. Jay Kennedy wrote the arrangements that fit the visual and in keeping with the anticipated young talent level he would have in the brass line that he expected this year. When looked at from this perspective, it seems clear that he knew what he was doing. Additionally, Boston was a hit with most audiences with this year's Les Mis. production, and that can not be lost either. The Berklee School of Music in Boston's national and worlwide reputation for first rate faculty instruction stands on its own. Jay Kennedy's has been on the faculty at the Berklee School for Music for years. He's also been a DCI judge in the past. Boston is very fortunate to have him writing the Crusaders music, imo. There are very few audiences the last decade that think that Boston is " boring " musically, or that they generally play music most people have never heard of. Kennedy could easily write the most esoteric music from the most obscure composers one has never heard of for the Boston Crusaders. Thankfully, for its many fans he has not chosen to go down that path with this Corps and with Drum Corps audiences. Thats how I see it anyway re. Jay Kennedy and his Music arrangements for Drum Corps audiences, and in particular with the Boston Crusaders. I appreciate your opinion though, it is nice when a veteran of the community takes time to actually explain things for us yungins. Not to kiss ###, but I really enjoyed your post about the "sit-in" on the Legendary show thread. Fascinating stuff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralTsoChicken Posted August 21, 2011 Share Posted August 21, 2011 I will go with my ears. Well, I will respect your opinion but continue to disagree. The high brass, especially trumpets early season, were the weakest of the top 8 I saw. It was rough. And all the way thru the end of the season they struggled in that department. Especially the (way too slow) fanfare section with all the exposure. It just really never got better. I will agree about JD and the Vis staff being headed in an awesome direction and really getting the show. Jamey Thompson is a VERY underappreciated drill designer and JD did a great job, even if most of the material was a lot more ballad(ie) than we are used to hearing during an entire drum corps show. I appreciate this dialog, dcvet95. You offer good input and aren't the over the top dramatic type, or blinded by homerism. You should post more often! Even if we don't agree, I've definitely enjoyed your posts of recent. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jjeffeory Posted August 21, 2011 Share Posted August 21, 2011 Hire Prime for 2012 while looking for a long term candidate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralTsoChicken Posted August 21, 2011 Share Posted August 21, 2011 Two others come to mind. Mike Forbes- Drum Corps lineage, and has made his bread and butter arranging for tubas/euphs, plus has band work, brass band work, and other arranging composition background. There is no doubt that with Mike at the helm, the low brass would still sound like PR low brass. Michael Klesch- basically "saved the day" during a time of recovery and debt for PR, extensive drum corps background, classical music guru. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCImonkey Posted August 21, 2011 Share Posted August 21, 2011 (edited) Michael Klesch is "taken" Edited August 21, 2011 by DCImonkey Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zeke Posted August 21, 2011 Share Posted August 21, 2011 So who comes in now? T Andre Feagin? Now THAT would definitely be interesting. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhantomCav Posted August 21, 2011 Share Posted August 21, 2011 Well, I will respect your opinion but continue to disagree. The high brass, especially trumpets early season, were the weakest of the top 8 I saw. It was rough. And all the way thru the end of the season they struggled in that department. Especially the (way too slow) fanfare section with all the exposure. It just really never got better. I will agree about JD and the Vis staff being headed in an awesome direction and really getting the show. Jamey Thompson is a VERY underappreciated drill designer and JD did a great job, even if most of the material was a lot more ballad(ie) than we are used to hearing during an entire drum corps show. I appreciate this dialog, dcvet95. You offer good input and aren't the over the top dramatic type, or blinded by homerism. You should post more often! Even if we don't agree, I've definitely enjoyed your posts of recent. I'm with you. Phantom's brass was a little shaky, relative to what they usually are. Listen to the end of Spartacus and what the high brass can do while making it sound SO easy. The mellos and trumpets this year just sounded....strained, or something. And just a bit dirty in places. I like to blame the Jupiters, but who knows. It was a good show for all of that, because the ballads tended to have dark sounds, which benefited a strong Euph section. On the bright side, with Shaw gone (a Jupiter employee, I think), maybe Phantom can get rid of those pieces of junk at the end of the current contract? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dcvet95 Posted August 21, 2011 Share Posted August 21, 2011 Well, I will respect your opinion but continue to disagree. The high brass, especially trumpets early season, were the weakest of the top 8 I saw. It was rough. And all the way thru the end of the season they struggled in that department. Especially the (way too slow) fanfare section with all the exposure. It just really never got better. I will agree about JD and the Vis staff being headed in an awesome direction and really getting the show. Jamey Thompson is a VERY underappreciated drill designer and JD did a great job, even if most of the material was a lot more ballad(ie) than we are used to hearing during an entire drum corps show. I appreciate this dialog, dcvet95. You offer good input and aren't the over the top dramatic type, or blinded by homerism. You should post more often! Even if we don't agree, I've definitely enjoyed your posts of recent. Agreed about the dialogue :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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