If BD Wins, We Riot!

[Big Bad Bari]

Also, if you're one of those sanctimonious types who considers football and NASCAR audiences to be a bunch of uncultured, uneducated vermin, I'd sure hate to be stuck sitting next to you at a dinner table.

Right back atcha! In fact, I probably would prefer to eat with someone who didn't spit so much food during the conversation, that rain gear was required!

[Granny Smith]

I don't think it's an evolution at all. My experience has been that the crowds are by far much classier people than those at most public sporting events that name call, get drunk, get in fights etc.

We beat this discussion to death back in 07 and 08 when folks were accusing Hop of single-handedly destroying the activity and were booing the corps to express their displeasure, including "hash gate".

The philharmonic are paid professionals, not students performing a summer youth activity. If the philharmoic plays crappy or plays something I don't like, I'll certainly make my voice heard, but I can do it without booing. And so can everyone else. I was raised to be respectful of others. I don't always succeed, but I don't let myself off the hook either. I surround myself with those who behave in a similar manner.

I don't profess to be a DCP know-it-all. I've never asserted my opinion mattered more than another. And certainly people have the right to do whatever they want in terms of boing,clapping, whistling or name calling.

I still stand by my position that booing is classless and acheives nothing other than making the ones booing feel some temporary release of anger which is likely from something totally other than what they claim to be angry about.

As for Gen Y as a whole, I agree with your observations. And it isn't the fault of an entire previous generation either. I don't have kids, but certainly wouldn't raise them to behave the way I see a lot of that generation do.

My point is that the OP (and others) chide people for booing when I actually think there's a place for it in the activity. I agree with a previous poster who distinguished between booing after a show and booing during scores. I think it was very clear that people were booing the scores that were assigned by the judges. Had BD finished second (second is still really really good) and Crown or Cadets first I don't think you would have heard any booing. But because of the actual results in Atlanta people booed and I don't fault them for doing so.

The second point I'm trying to make is that we need to stop coddling the members. Let 'em hear the booing. Frankly, those marching for the Blue Devils will be stronger for it if those leading them don't try to shelter them. They are getting a real life lesson in their experience and honestly that's one of the great things about drum corps.

[JKT90]

What I'd like to know is exactly what is BD doing that the judges see, which I do not. Apparently, I don't know as much as I thought I did bc to my eye I don't see it.

And quiet honestly, I think that's where the frustration, Booing come. If it were obviously dominate it probably wouldn't be as big a deal, as it is, people don't get it and are left wondering , seriously, what's that all about. So, I say we have the head DCI judge offer an explanation as to what they see them doing so much better than everyone else after finals.

Edited July 29, 2013 by JKT90

[Cappybara]

Right back atcha! In fact, I probably would prefer to eat with someone who didn't spit so much food during the conversation, that rain gear was required!

Lol I love elitists like you. Congratulations, you managed to stereotype a whole fan base!

[DrumManTx]

Sorry, but your post is too sanctimonious.

I personally have never booed, but I have shaken my head on a number of occasions. An entire generation (I'm talking to you Millennials) was brought up under a sissy system that everyone was a winner: "C'mon. Don't say bad things about nobody...everyone tried the same and had fun, so let's give everyone a trophy."

This is a competitive activity comprised of young adults--many of whom are going to be entering "real life" soon enough and they're learning some of the most valuable life lessons right now. They are NOT all winners and drum corps is a competitive activity with scores and winners and losers and stuff. They have staff who yell at them and make them run laps. Expectations are put on them and guys in green shirts and khaki pants tell them they did good or did bad.

Booing isn't the end of the world and it's not gonna hurt these young people. If it does, then they need to be booed more. Welcome to life.

Sorry for sounding crotchety, but this "everyone's a winner and don't hurt their feelings" sentiment is for the birds.

Amen. Thank God my parents didn't raise me under the everyone is a winner attitude. I'm glad I'm not one of those sissies.

Edited July 29, 2013 by DrumManTx

[Fran Haring]

"The Jets kick off to open the game...and the ballgame is over".

Booooooo!!!!

Unfortunately... too many times over too many years... that is an exactly correct scenario!!!

Edited July 29, 2013 by Fran Haring

[Granny Smith]

Disagree. Are you saying that these kids are ready for the real world the same as a 30 year old who's gone through college, worked a job of 10 years, is married with with three kids? I think not.

It's one thing to treat them as adults helping them grow, it's another to expect them to be adults. Have you hung out at the mall lately? :rolleyes:/>

Thank you for making my point. Yes, I have recently walked through the mall and what I saw troubled me. Young adults sitting at a table in the food court staring at their phone and texting while they should be out working (yeah, yeah...I know there are exceptions).

Are 19 year olds ready for the real world? Probably not. That's the problem. They should be. When I was 19 I had been living away from my parents for over a year in a city about three hours away. I had a full-time job, an apartment and a car payment. I had a savings account where I put half of my pay to help get myself to college.

It's time we start expecting them to be adults.

[hostrauser]

I think the question most people aren't asking is: Are we a creative activity or an enjoyment activity? Most DCPers I think will fool themselves into answering "BOTH" even though we rarely seem to act that way.

Is there anything wrong with putting out shows like Jersey Surf's or the Madison Scouts'? No. Is there anything wrong with putting out shows like Carolina Crown's or the Blue Devils'? Also no. Although, from my perspective, there seems to be VASTLY more tolerance and encouragement of the former than the latter.

I can't even count how many new and exciting pieces of music drum corps has introduced me to, pieces I had never heard before but now listen to regularly. Everything from Glass and Ligeti to Chick Corea and Radiohead. People can talk about woodwinds and electronics being the doom of DCI but, for me, the day I stop being a DCI fan is when drum corps shows just become rote pandering to the lowest common denominator of fan.

Variety is the spice of life, that's not just a cliché. I'd be bored to tears if I went to DCI Champs and had to watch 25 shows just like the Madison Scouts. I'd also be bored to tears if I went and had to watch 25 shows just like the Blue Devils. It's cannot just be a franks and beans activity, there has to be room on the menu for the filet with truffle oil risotto, too. Both are enjoyable in their own ways.

Scores? DCI scoring is about execution. Even the Effect captions. There is never more than one or two corps (if that) that can out-execute the Blue Devils in any given year, so there is never more than one or two corps (if that) that can beat the Blue Devils. It is that simple.

As for the generation gap, everyone likes to think theirs is flawless and it's the others that have messed everything up. In reality, every generation is great and every generation is flawed for different reasons. I've never heard the contrast between how a generation views itself and how an "outsider" might view that generation put any better than this quote from the comedian Rob Delaney: "The 'Greatest Generation' sure said the N-word a lot."

Edited July 29, 2013 by hostrauser

[BRASSO]

Faulty reasoning. If your generation led us all to water, so to speak, then what would be the cause of so many of us collectively choosing to refuse it? Some bizarre genetic anomaly that just happened to crop up for all births within a certain time period? It has to come from somewhere, and the most obvious answer is, "the environment that people older than us made for us to grow up in."

The " environment " that our forefathers handed down to us was borne out of protest asnd revolution. I don't want to get preachy here with this, but for better or worse, remaining silent is just not in Americans DNA. Booing of course is not civil behaviour. But Civil Disobedience is as American as apple pie, whether it comes from the Right ( Aristocratic Colonial Merchants against the Brittish Crown thru to the Tea Party of today) or from the Left (US Socialist Workers Party Protests of the 30's to the OWS's of today ). The worst thing thst could happen to a society in my opinion are those forces that want to silence others voices of discontent. I dislike it when I hear booing, and don't personally engage in it. But I dislike the thought of those that want to stifle freedom of expression and freedom of speech even more. Those people are control freaks and tend to creep me out the most.... ok, enough of that preachiness from me for the day, sorry.

Edited July 29, 2013 by BRASSO

[drilltech1]

Disagree. Are you saying that these kids are ready for the real world the same as a 30 year old who's gone through college, worked a job of 10 years, is married with with three kids? I think not.

It's one thing to treat them as adults helping them grow, it's another to expect them to be adults. Have you hung out at the mall lately? :rolleyes:/>

Age and maturity are not corrrelative functions which automatically co-exist in the same person at the same time.

I think Granny Smith is yearning for more maturity in the memberships. Facing booing is a possible opportunity for that maturity to prosper.

Let's face it: at 18, we allow these same individuals to vote for the President, the leader of the free world. At 18, we draft them into the military at times of history and give them the weapons and choice to take another's human life.

At 18 in most States, the law allows them to make a life long commitment to marry (although maturity needed to do this well is not correspondent with age by any means, witness the divorce rate.) And most colleges today boot them off the campus after first year to live their own adult life in their own apartments and residences.

A little booing should not be devastating to a mature person.

But it is also true that many of us take offense when our posts are given red negs by others (a visual boo) and that sensitivity and age also go beyond chronology.