trumpetcam Posted July 27, 2014 Share Posted July 27, 2014 (edited) It seems like a sticky slope for Crown. Their design is very brass based and by picking the most challenging music, they know that they can continue to define the standard for brass in the activity. However, as we have seen, it sometimes limits their ability to pace the overall design effectively for the drum corps proper. It all goes back to the whole idea of designing to win captions or designing to have the totality of a package. I know they don't approach it this way, but as the brass team and Klesch clearly drive the design (as they should with that program) it could ultimately be at the cost of creating a championship dynasty like BD. I see both sides, but do you think Michael Gaines would have done less "Gaines" drill for Cavies just so other corps would have a chance? Or would have Tom Float changed his writing just because? Asking them to make it easier for corps to compete in a caption really makes no sense in that respect. As a brass player, I like the 'take no prisoners" approach, but wish Crown could continue to find a way to create a design that felt more holistic as a package. I afraid we may see last year as the "one that worked" for Crown and I'm hoping it doesn't become a 4th place corps that just wins Brass every year. Edited July 27, 2014 by trumpetcam Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trumpetcam Posted July 27, 2014 Share Posted July 27, 2014 To be fair they met in San Antonio and Houston.... True. But them going on back to back was as close to a real assessment as the judges could get comparing the quality. Both are comparable in several captions, with the obvious disparity being the statement that George O. made in VA. I'll be curious to see if that particular spread maintains over the next week.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cajal Posted July 27, 2014 Share Posted July 27, 2014 Here's the thing... They picked MUSIC that demonstrates the same skill over and over again. It's MUSIC, that draws people to shows, not showing a diverse set of skills. So do corps design shows with entertainment in mind or do they just go down a checklist and demonstrate a diverse set of skills? The music is what it is. So should they not play it because it uses the same set of skills? I absolutely think they could've put other 'spacey' songs in there without beating us over the head with hornline runs. That's my own OPINION, or personal preference. They're winning brass, so they did a fantastic job competitively. Remember, it's just a preference. I watched the show with a non-drum corps savvy friend and they remarked "Why did they play something that sounded like warm-up scales/exercises for half of the show? They were great, but it's too much" I tend to agree. Just a preference, that's all. I'm not bashing Carolina Crown. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wilme861 Posted July 27, 2014 Share Posted July 27, 2014 If I may, I think he was pointing out that it was bigger, louder, faster, higher just for the sake of being bigger, lounder, faster and higher. As if to prove they can do it. Sometimes ability and get in the way of more "throughtful" approach. I remember a couple of years ago Crowns drill was performed so insanely fast that it was almost impossible to get into formation before they were frantically running to another. The design of the drill could not be appreciated because of this. And it seemed, to me, that they were performing at this pace just to prove they could do it. Crown's visual design team seems think they have to do everything they can do in one show. That's not a very mature attitude, imo. That drill in 2012 was designed that way because of the show itself, especially the first half. The corps were superheroes through most of the show so they tried to mimic that in the drill and music. The design team did a great job with that show and yes it was ridiculously difficult that year but superheroes shouldn't have an easy show :) Obviously, it could have been brought down some and that would have helped clean it up but that's not how Crown operates. And for those that say they just play notes for the sake of playing notes, it's already been said but that's all from the source material. Klesch stays very true to the source material with his arrangements for Crown. The design team and music staff know they can play this ridiculously hard music so why not play that level of music? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wilme861 Posted July 27, 2014 Share Posted July 27, 2014 I absolutely think they could've put other 'spacey' songs in there without beating us over the head with hornline runs. That's my own OPINION, or personal preference. They're winning brass, so they did a fantastic job competitively. Remember, it's just a preference. I watched the show with a non-drum corps savvy friend and they remarked "Why did they play something that sounded like warm-up scales/exercises for half of the show? They were great, but it's too much" I tend to agree. Just a preference, that's all. I'm not bashing Carolina Crown. Fair enough Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jjeffeory Posted July 27, 2014 Share Posted July 27, 2014 I absolutely think they could've put other 'spacey' songs in there without beating us over the head with hornline runs. That's my own OPINION, or personal preference. They're winning brass, so they did a fantastic job competitively. Remember, it's just a preference. I watched the show with a non-drum corps savvy friend and they remarked "Why did they play something that sounded like warm-up scales/exercises for half of the show? They were great, but it's too much" I tend to agree. Just a preference, that's all. I'm not bashing Carolina Crown. I know you're not, but others will. If you listen to the originals, some of them have even MORE notes than what Crown played! The last piece in particular. Interstellar Suite is electronic music and it's got all of those notes in there. You can even try to find Spirit's version from 1,000 years ago. It's lots of runs... So they didn't write the music, they're playing stuff written by other people and edited for their purposes, So basically people that don't like the show probably wouldn't like the original music either. Personally, I want to be entertained more than fulfill a rubric. The entertainment way, there's a greater chance for variety. The rubric way, you're just checking off a list. It doesn't have to be creative. We get some sad shows that people don't like and complain about at championships. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cajal Posted July 27, 2014 Share Posted July 27, 2014 I know you're not, but others will. If you listen to the originals, some of them have even MORE notes than what Crown played! The last piece in particular. Interstellar Suite is electronic music and it's got all of those notes in there. You can even try to find Spirit's version from 1,000 years ago. It's lots of runs... So they didn't write the music, they're playing stuff written by other people and edited for their purposes, So basically people that don't like the show probably wouldn't like the original music either. Personally, I want to be entertained more than fulfill a rubric. The entertainment way, there's a greater chance for variety. The rubric way, you're just checking off a list. It doesn't have to be creative. We get some sad shows that people don't like and complain about at championships. Absolutely agree. Corps taking different approaches is essential, both competitively and for entertainment purposes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Dixon Posted July 27, 2014 Share Posted July 27, 2014 Gessh, I'm not a Cadets homer anymore, but seriously? Those two examples are nothing like Crown this year. ...and the year isn't even over. I was talking about design misfire. Which yes, I believe Crown's program this year is, it's less so now after many revisions the past few weeks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trumpetcam Posted July 27, 2014 Share Posted July 27, 2014 (edited) I would say that a lot of scalar runs, particularly in brass friendly keys, tends to sound "monotone" after a while. Brass gymnastics are great and while they are clearly the technically superior brass program in the activity today, you don't always have to do everything. I still think they would win brass if they had even a third less technical demand in the show. I'm also a believer that the program and music is a direct reflection of the personality of the arrangers and instructors. I have no idea who they are personally, but it certainly seems to often be a "testosterone driven" approach to music making. But, I guess so is drum corps in general... They just "play the game" better than the rest right now and if you can win and still play in Bb and Eb major, go for it! I just feel that the other keys and tonalities have some interesting colors as well and luckily there are enough other corps playing in those keys to make the whole picture and sonic pallet of a drum corps show worthwhile. To each his own I guess! Edited July 27, 2014 by trumpetcam 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BoyWonder1911 Posted July 27, 2014 Share Posted July 27, 2014 I still think Crown's 2009 show was a better musical program than this year's. But their hornline is better this year than 2009. I still think Star's hornlines in 91 and 93 were better. OMG those mellophones. You don't have to have a ton of difficult runs to be good. There are a lot of other subtleties that judges notice than you or I may not on first hearing that can make a hornline great. Things like being in tune, balance, tone, blending, crisp articulation throughout the entire brass line, etc. Just check out Star 1993. They may not have played very loudly but they were incredible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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