exitmusic Posted July 3, 2015 Share Posted July 3, 2015 Exactly my point. So there's really no point in trying to "innovate" because there will always be people who find it "cringeworthy" to use your words, especially when it comes to Cadets. No, there is innovation that works and innovation that doesn't work. Innovating for the sake of innovating rarely works in any aspect of life or business. The Cadets have always been great at marching and playing, and their real innovation of the 80s and early 90s was finding new ways to do cool things marching and playing that no one had ever done or even attempted. The corps has not fared well with similar attempts at innovating with additional tools, namely voice. Others (Crown, BD, Bluecoats) certainly have. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2000Cadet Posted July 3, 2015 Share Posted July 3, 2015 I know it's just one night of scores... And analyzing score is NOT my strong suit... But I took a quick glance at the Foxboro breakdown and the Cadets GE-Rep #'s were both ahead of BD. The VA-Comp score is right there with BD as well. Can someone help a severely "numbers analysis challenged" individual such as myself understand how those scores are indicative of a 'boring' and 'same old' show...? In all honesty, I'm trying to understand what I'm missing here... I've only seen a couple posters post about The Cadets' show being boring. Funny thing is those same couple posters also posted extremely negative posts about BD as well. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cleveland1 Posted July 3, 2015 Share Posted July 3, 2015 Interesting thoughts here. My two cents. I think the uniform is fine and does not need to be updated or changed in a big way, but i wouldnt mind if it did (then again i'm not an alum). Ive only seen this year's show once so i am not too familiar with it, but it does seem to me that the cadets have lacked the same powerful design as angels and demons had. There was a story, it was explicitly shown on the field, the corps were actors not just performers. Side by side and this year's the power of 10 don't have the oomph i think. Meanwhile i found 12.25 and american portrait to be rather silly. But the cadets don't need to really change their ways to still compete at the top, i don't think anyone wants the cadets becoming BD in terms of style. They just need to put out better shows, which is easier said than done. In regards to staging, i thought that side by side is a good example that the cadets can do it well. There is a fine line that corps like BD walk between clutter and well designed, i dont want DCI to become a field of as many props as there are people. In essence, i think that the cadets just need "that show" in order to win. Most corps need "that show" in order to beat BD. Cadets had it in 11, crown had it in 13. "that show" is hard to come by and force to happen. But the staff at cadets are capable of making "that show" and their members are capable of performing it. Will next year be "that show"? What will" that show" look like now? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GUARDLING Posted July 3, 2015 Share Posted July 3, 2015 1st cadets won only a few years ago and continually are a contender. hmmmm seems pretty successful to me. How many would kill to be that bad...lol Now with that said, I think Hop will do what he has to if he felt certain things were holding them back. This is why , for me anyway i dont have any problem at all when the uni changes up a bit or they try a new prop etc etc. I think some, and I do mean some, dont want cadets to change much for reasons that have noting to do with staying competitive. Say what you want about Hop but he has kept his corps in the thick of things for decades now. I believe he will do just what he feels he should and not apologize for it either. Good for him . ( I'm actually not a Hop fan ) but can't deny what works!...lol 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chaddyt Posted July 3, 2015 Share Posted July 3, 2015 (edited) 90% of the time Cadets do bodywork, I can't help but feel it's forced and awkward. Some of that has to do with the bodywork itself being a tad on the stale side. But the other part is that the uniform image conflicts with the movement. You have this rigid, old-school, militaristic look that's trying to pull off these choreographed, WGI elements, and it just looks out of place, IMO. It's going to have to change at some point. They could take a page out of BAC's book to see how to update one's look while keeping the elements the uniform is known for. Edited July 3, 2015 by chaddyt 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cappybara Posted July 3, 2015 Share Posted July 3, 2015 It's not that Cadets CANT do modern. I think 2011 and 2012 was modern done pretty well. The only issue is that the design staff has shown they can't do modern CONSISTENTLY well. Sometimes, their staff goes overboard and tries too hard. The Cadets have shown an upward trajectory in terms of putting out shows that are better designed. I think they've gotten better at it every year, but occasionally screw up and it ends up getting overblown. I still really think Cadets should change their uni, but otherwise, keep doing what they're doing. They may screw up once in a while, but they DO know how to put out a good product. This year is a fine example of that. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim K Posted July 3, 2015 Share Posted July 3, 2015 (edited) First a disclaimer: I'm not completely sold on this year's show but I won't dismiss it either. I felt the same way about "Angels and Demons." With Cadets sometimes you have to wait and see. Regarding cheesy, 2012 and 2014 received that label, at least on DCP, but not by the people in the stands,and given that 2012 did not medal but did place in the top three at I believe all other shows, not by the judges. In 2014 every show except finals was first or second. That's hardly a record to be ashamed of, and again audiences loved the show. "Toy Soldier" with its creative spelling and Little Geoffrey was a bit cheesy for my tastes, and that's coming from someone who enjoys a Hallmark channel Christmas movie. But the shows some call cheesy have not titled, but they've been competitive. This year's show reminds me both in style and substance of "Side by Side" which I enjoyed a bit more than this year's show, but I love Barber's music as opposed to simply liking Shostakovich. However, if we simply judge innovation by uniform choice, use of electronics, or doing what has not been done before, we may be missing other innovative touches. There's no question this year's show is demanding, it has new sounds, and packs an incredible punch. That too can be innovative. True innovation often keeps what works while also moving forward, and Cadets fits that description. Edited July 3, 2015 by Tim K 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRASSO Posted July 3, 2015 Share Posted July 3, 2015 (edited) The Cadets need to update their uniform. The look is too restrictive for the current design trends. I'm not talking a wholesale revamp, but it definitely needs to be modernized. Here I was thinking we all here appreciated diversity in uniforms. Why can't there be a legitimate place for both the traditional cadet style uniform as well as the more modern clothing that really is realistically and stylistically in the realm of a costume now, not a " uniform" ? Why wouldn't it be appropriate for the Cadets then to wear cadet styled uniforms ? They are after all called " Cadets ", no ? if the Cadets are going to utilize costumes for their attire, then naturally that would require a change in their name as well. It would look ludicrous and ridiculous for a Corps called " The Cadets " to wear costumes like that of ( for example ) Crown. There is already too much sameness in the activity. The LAST thing that is needed is even LESS diversity in attire, imo. Heck, in earlier decades, Corps had far more diversity in uniforms, ie 27th, Bridgemen, Cadets, Hawthorne Muchachos, Kilties, Troopers, Velvet Knights, Chatelaines, Cavaliers, Star Guardsmen, Boston, etc all had uniforms that were far more different among each other than what we typically see among the Corps today. Except for colors, many of the uniforms( costumes ) of today are made by just one or 2 uniform manufacturing companies that monopolize the activity now. We need MORE diversity in uniforms and styles now... not less, imo. The Cadets uniform is classic. Its iconic. Since the1930's, it has remained essentially the same. and for those 80 years few were calling for them to "modernize it ". If the Cadets ever decide to lose themselves by morphing into a costume style of attire that is prevalent today, I say good luck to them with THAT. ( haha!) Edited July 3, 2015 by BRASSO 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
exitmusic Posted July 3, 2015 Share Posted July 3, 2015 It's not that Cadets CANT do modern. Yeah, I think it is. They caught lightning in a bottle in 2011. Other than that, the design team has been the same since the early 90s and one starts to wonder whether they haven't figured out how to adjust. I absolutely LOVE this year's show, but it certainly isn't state of the art. That said, if the state of the art swung back toward this type of show, I'd be a happy camper! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cappybara Posted July 3, 2015 Share Posted July 3, 2015 Here I was thinking we all here appreciated diversity in uniforms. Why can't there be a legitimate place for both the traditional cadet style uniform as well as the more modern clothing tat really is in the realm of a costume, not a " uniform" ? Why wouldn't it be appropriate for the Cadets to wear cadet styled uniforms ? They are after all called " Cadets ", no ? if the Cadets re going to utilize costumes for their attire, then naturally that would require a change in their name as well. It would look ludicrous and ridiculous for a Corps called " The Cadets " to wear costumes like that of ( for example ) Crown. There is already too much sameness in the activity. The LAST thing that is needed is even LESS diversity in attire, imo. Heck, in earlier decades, Corps had far more diversity in uniforms, ie 27th, Bridgemen, Cadets, Hawthorne Muchachos, Kilties, Troopers, Velvet Knights, Chatelaines, Cavaliers, Star Guardsmen, Boston, etc all had uniforms that were far more different among each other than what we typically see among the Corps today. Except for colors, many of the uniforms( costumes ) of today are made by just one or 2 uniform manufacturing companies. that monopolize the activity now. We need MORE diversity in uniforms now... not less, imo What kind of argument is that??? Your premise is that just because the corps name is "the Cadets" that their uni should stay the same. Which makes absolutely no sense. Phantom Regiment is a militaristic corps as well. Their uniforms are hardly militaristic. Your point about diversity of uniforms are fair. I don't think anyone is suggesting an overhaul of Cadets' uniforms, just a modernization of them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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