BRASSO Posted June 12, 2017 Share Posted June 12, 2017 (edited) 18 minutes ago, mingusmonk said: Granted, I don't read every thread on this forum, but where did we learn what their lawyer said? Well, unless we believe that Carolina Crown acted unlawfully on Facebook when they stated they may be forced to prohibit the public's access to their practices, we give the benefit to the doubt to Carolina Crown that they acted lawfully here in that facebook admonition warning to the public. Perhaps Eleran here.. another Lawyer on DCP... could enlighten us here if he believes that Crown may be acting unlawfully should they attrempt to restrict the public's access to Crown's practices. My understanding has always been that Corps that might intend to restrict the public from their practices can do so. I know that sometimes pro sports teams lease out public schools facilities for practices, then on occasion they prohibit the public's access to those practices. So just putting two and two together here ( as a non lawyer ) I just assumed that the lawyers with these Pro ( and College ) teams had the legal right to bar the public to their practices if that was the team's wishes. So absent any claim by any other Lawyers, I'm assuming that Carolina Crown as well is acting lawfully here in their threat to have to bar the public from their practices if their wishes on the part of the public are not met moving forward here. Edited June 12, 2017 by BRASSO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stu Posted June 12, 2017 Share Posted June 12, 2017 In most, if not all, jurisdictions within the United States: If someone is sunbathing in their own fenced-in shrub encased backyard, and the next door neighbor flies a drone into that yard, hovers it directly above the sunbather, takes a photo, records what is being said, and the sunbather whacks the drone out of the air crashing it to the ground, the sunbather is liable for destruction of property while the neighbor is not liable for anything. Why? Because the owner of the backyard does not own the ‘airspace’ above the yard and thus has no reasonable expectation of privacy from anything that is open to view and being heard from that open air backyard. I would wager that the same holds true for any corps rehearsing outside in an open air stadium; that since nobody owns the airspace anything that can be seen and heard coming from that area is fair game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fred Windish Posted June 12, 2017 Share Posted June 12, 2017 Hard to believe ANYONE turned away from a corps practice outdoors, non-ticketed, would go to the time, effort and expense to contest the whole thing in court, bring suit, etc. I would simply wander away, decide not to support that corps in any manner, tell all my friends how poorly you were treated, etc. OR - Stand just outside the stadium and blow your OWN bugle, beat your OWN drum, blow your OWN whistle, blast your OWN air horn, etc. in the direction of the practice field ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GUARDLING Posted June 12, 2017 Share Posted June 12, 2017 1 minute ago, Fred Windish said: Hard to believe ANYONE turned away from a corps practice outdoors, non-ticketed, would go to the time, effort and expense to contest the whole thing in court, bring suit, etc. I would simply wander away, decide not to support that corps in any manner, tell all my friends how poorly you were treated, etc. OR - Stand just outside the stadium and blow your OWN bugle, beat your OWN drum, blow your OWN whistle, blast your OWN air horn, etc. in the direction of the practice field ! or how about respect what the corps asked for whatever the reasons may be 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fred Windish Posted June 12, 2017 Share Posted June 12, 2017 2 minutes ago, GUARDLING said: or how about respect what the corps asked for whatever the reasons may be Of course! Really, how many people would not simply respect the corps and move along? Hard to believe someone would make a big deal out of such a thing! 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stu Posted June 12, 2017 Share Posted June 12, 2017 21 minutes ago, GUARDLING said: or how about respect what the corps asked for whatever the reasons may be I agree with respecting the request of the corps. However, here is a biting question concerning respect in the other direction: From the inception of DCI, during before show warm-up time where battery sections will walk two or three blocks from the stadium to go warm-up, how many corps have actually respected the wishes and desires of the people who live on those streets who did not want all that racket occurring ‘directly’ in front of their homes? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whitedawn Posted June 13, 2017 Share Posted June 13, 2017 3 hours ago, BRASSO said: Well, unless we believe that Carolina Crown acted unlawfully on Facebook when they stated they may be forced to prohibit the public's access to their practices, we give the benefit to the doubt to Carolina Crown that they acted lawfully here in that facebook admonition warning to the public. Perhaps Eleran here.. another Lawyer on DCP... could enlighten us here if he believes that Crown may be acting unlawfully should they attrempt to restrict the public's access to Crown's practices. My understanding has always been that Corps that might intend to restrict the public from their practices can do so. I know that sometimes pro sports teams lease out public schools facilities for practices, then on occasion they prohibit the public's access to those practices. So just putting two and two together here ( as a non lawyer ) I just assumed that the lawyers with these Pro ( and College ) teams had the legal right to bar the public to their practices if that was the team's wishes. So absent any claim by any other Lawyers, I'm assuming that Carolina Crown as well is acting lawfully here in their threat to have to bar the public from their practices if their wishes on the part of the public are not met moving forward here. Nothing stops Carolina Crown from putting up a sign saying, "PUBLIC NOT ALLOWED" no matter where they go, even if Carolina Crown has no way to enforce its own rule. It isn't illegal to attempt to dissuade someone from doing something that they are probably allowed to do. My sense is that Crown's legal conclusion ("Distributing recordings of our rehearsal is a copyright violation") is not legally sound but will probably stop 85% of people from doing it or at least make them think twice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whitedawn Posted June 13, 2017 Share Posted June 13, 2017 4 hours ago, Eleran said: Real property law, if they are on private property. The owner's rights of exclusive use of the property flow to the leaseholder, of more likely in DCI's case they occupy pursuant to a license agreement, within which the owner can still grant the same exclusive control of the space. Are corps tenants or licensees or invitees? If they are tenants, their rights flow from the lease and in the maximum they have the rights that the Landlord has, whatever those are. If they are licensees, and that license includes an exclusive right, my sense is that they could petition Lessor to summarily eject a trespasser, but who knows what that mechanism looks like? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRASSO Posted June 13, 2017 Share Posted June 13, 2017 (edited) 32 minutes ago, whitedawn said: Nothing stops Carolina Crown from putting up a sign saying, "PUBLIC NOT ALLOWED" no matter where they go, even if Carolina Crown has no way to enforce its own rule. It isn't illegal to attempt to dissuade someone from doing something that they are probably allowed to do. Yes. Their signage would be legally permissable too under the circumstances you are describing here as well. I believe that this is settled legal matter here as well ( as far as I know anyway ) that the simple legal answer to the simple legal question above for the OP's question will be.... " Yes ". Edited June 13, 2017 by BRASSO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRASSO Posted June 13, 2017 Share Posted June 13, 2017 (edited) 2 hours ago, Fred Windish said: Of course! Really, how many people would not simply respect the corps and move along? Hard to believe someone would make a big deal out of such a thing! Most would. But not all. Hardly a day does not go by when somebody asks somebody to legally move along from where they are... and they do not do so. We would certainly HOPE that Drum Corps fans would respect the Corps wishes at practices. But its clear that some are not. This is the reason that Carolina Crown is thinking about imposing draconian measures to restrict access too ALL fans at their future practices... as some Crown fans are already violating Crown's requests at their open practices. Edited June 13, 2017 by BRASSO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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