Do drum corps have a legal right to restrict access to rehearsals held in publicly accessible venues?

[whitedawn]

2 hours ago, Tim K said:

To the question at hand, Allentown is a public facility, the show in Cranston RI is held at a municipal facility, same holds true for the stadium in Lawrence, MA. The no video and recording rule is read throughout the show. While public property does not become private when it is rented, the tenant must be able to grant permission about recording.  My guess is a corps could restrict video and photography, but a sign would have to be posted, but if someone from the corps said stop, the recording would have to stop.

Almost

At a show, an attendee is attending the performance subject to the license granted (the small print on the back of a ticket).

I don't know how a corps would legally stop someone from recording, even if that recorder did not have a legal right to be there. Signs may scare off some people, but they generally have no legal meaning.

[LabMaster]

So a question sort of along these lines of this topic but maybe a bit more on the public' accessibility to a corps rehearsal facility:  thinking of corps on tour, at a public ( PUBLIC) high school.  They rent the stadium and there are minimal access restrictions ( not completely fenced in).  Can the corps restrict the public from coming to the stands to watch rehearsals?

 The school and all property are owned by the towns taxpayers and the rehearsal visiting public are residents (taxpayers, aka landlords) who authorize the rental of the stadium.  The building access is of course not available.  But can the stadium/stands be made off limits?

dont get into the recording aspect.  I'm curious about not allowing the public access to watch rehearsals. 

[Tim K]

1 hour ago, LabMaster said:

So a question sort of along these lines of this topic but maybe a bit more on the public' accessibility to a corps rehearsal facility:  thinking of corps on tour, at a public ( PUBLIC) high school.  They rent the stadium and there are minimal access restrictions ( not completely fenced in).  Can the corps restrict the public from coming to the stands to watch rehearsals?

 The school and all property are owned by the towns taxpayers and the rehearsal visiting public are residents (taxpayers, aka landlords) who authorize the rental of the stadium.  The building access is of course not available.  But can the stadium/stands be made off limits?

dont get into the recording aspect.  I'm curious about not allowing the public access to watch rehearsals. 

Based on some limited experience renting facilities, a stadium that is rented usually includes the seating area, so it is possible a corps could restrict viewing in a stadium area. If the field is not fenced in without seating, it would be a bit more problematic to restrict spectators.

[garfield]

1 hour ago, LabMaster said:

So a question sort of along these lines of this topic but maybe a bit more on the public' accessibility to a corps rehearsal facility:  thinking of corps on tour, at a public ( PUBLIC) high school.  They rent the stadium and there are minimal access restrictions ( not completely fenced in).  Can the corps restrict the public from coming to the stands to watch rehearsals?

 The school and all property are owned by the towns taxpayers and the rehearsal visiting public are residents (taxpayers, aka landlords) who authorize the rental of the stadium.  The building access is of course not available.  But can the stadium/stands be made off limits?

dont get into the recording aspect.  I'm curious about not allowing the public access to watch rehearsals. 

All I can tell you is that our stadium cleared 60 minutes before the show starts so fans don't get to see the run through of the corps staying at the show school.

An announcement is made on the PA system.  If a fan refused to leave on some legal grounds, we'd escort him out of the stadium, call the cops, take his statement, and wait for his attorney to contact us.

But, by God, he will not see that show run-through for free.

 

[garfield]

5 minutes ago, Tim K said:

Based on some limited experience renting facilities, a stadium that is rented usually includes the seating area, so it is possible a corps could restrict viewing in a stadium area. If the field is not fenced in without seating, it would be a bit more problematic to restrict spectators.

Yes, of course.  The stadium includes the seating area unless specifically excluded.  Especially if both are enclosed in a common fence where it would be hard to police one without the other.

That the area is not fenced off is considered in the lease agreement.  Caveat Emptor.

If there's no fence and you're worried about keeping your show practice quiet, perhaps this is not the school or show for you.

Cadets have spring training at two private universities.  Facilities that match one's needs can be found; not all are required to submit to the public.

My understanding talking with school alums is that Cadets' rental facilities also includes restricting school students who, otherwise, would have free access to the areas being used by the Cadets for spring training.  (I happen to have a client who's on the Board at ONU - they LOVE having Cadets there!)  The summer student body is informed that certain areas are off limits for general access and permission must be granted to access while Cadets are there.

ONU may be known for their engineering school but I'd bet their attorneys looked very closely at Cadets' ability to restrict access prior to including into their contract.

 

[LabMaster]

1 hour ago, garfield said:

All I can tell you is that our stadium cleared 60 minutes before the show starts so fans don't get to see the run through of the corps staying at the show school.

An announcement is made on the PA system.  If a fan refused to leave on some legal grounds, we'd escort him out of the stadium, call the cops, take his statement, and wait for his attorney to contact us.

But, by God, he will not see that show run-through for free.

 

Only looking for a response to attending rehearsal.  Remember I'm the taxpayer at my towns public high school watching a corps rehearsal.  It's not a show site, just a tour rehearsal site.  Can the corps prevent me from watching rehearsal?

[LabMaster]

1 hour ago, garfield said:

Yes, of course.  The stadium includes the seating area unless specifically excluded.  Especially if both are enclosed in a common fence where it would be hard to police one without the other.

That the area is not fenced off is considered in the lease agreement.  Caveat Emptor.

If there's no fence and you're worried about keeping your show practice quiet, perhaps this is not the school or show for you.

Cadets have spring training at two private universities.  Facilities that match one's needs can be found; not all are required to submit to the public.

My understanding talking with school alums is that Cadets' rental facilities also includes restricting school students who, otherwise, would have free access to the areas being used by the Cadets for spring training.  (I happen to have a client who's on the Board at ONU - they LOVE having Cadets there!)  The summer student body is informed that certain areas are off limits for general access and permission must be granted to access while Cadets are there.

ONU may be known for their engineering school but I'd bet their attorneys looked very closely at Cadets' ability to restrict access prior to including into their contract.

 

This is for a towns public high school.  The football field and stands (stadium if you will) although available for rent is a publically owned facility by taxpayers (me) who are the lessees.  One of the people who rented the facility to the rehearsing g corps.  Can the Landlords per se' , the taxpayers and lessees be prevented from sitting in stands and watching rehearsal?

[Eleran]

Being a tax-payer does not give you the right of unlimited access to the high school football stadium on a 24/7 basis, any more than you have access as a tax-payer to the classes inside the building.     Just because a facility is paid for through tax money does not make it a "public space". 

[GUARDLING]

36 minutes ago, LabMaster said:

This is for a towns public high school.  The football field and stands (stadium if you will) although available for rent is a publically owned facility by taxpayers (me) who are the lessees.  One of the people who rented the facility to the rehearsing g corps.  Can the Landlords per se' , the taxpayers and lessees be prevented from sitting in stands and watching rehearsal?

I have rented space in and around schools for decades and often in the agreement no one other than members and staff are allowed. There are also  liability issues and we all have to cover members, staff etc etc. 

Many districts also have rented schools out for things like church, weddings, special events ( private ) don't think in my experience that outsiders to the renter have that right, In fact maybe just the opposite.

[LabMaster]

21 minutes ago, GUARDLING said:

I have rented space in and around schools for decades and often in the agreement no one other than members and staff are allowed. There are also  liability issues and we all have to cover members, staff etc etc. 

Many districts also have rented schools out for things like church, weddings, special events ( private ) don't think in my experience that outsiders to the renter have that right, In fact maybe just the opposite.

I understand and get that limitation on the school facility.  On the building.  My specific curiosity and question for you is: were the school you rented the facilities from, public schools?  Were the areas you rented, in the buildings? Were the football field stands totally closed off or open?  The stands at our towns field are open, no fencing to close it off.  The track is also open, to the point I can run the track anytime I please during the day.  My question is specifically, can I be told I can't sit in stands to watch a rehearsal on the football field?  Thanks in advance.

Edited June 10, 2017 by LabMaster