Bluecoats getting the shaft this year

[Lance]

15/10

would read again

[2muchcoffeeman]

Good Lord, this thread.

[Vdad76]

3 hours ago, whitedj2002 said:

I stated you could excuse, or not, my observations, I am responding to a specific post. Criticism ### for tat! You missed that I am responding to a specific fanatic with imo....my opinion! Never looked for affirmation!

Got it.  You're right I didn't see the specific post you were responding to.

[Treefidy]

1 hour ago, pudding said:

Perhaps if you'd read further than "mic", you'd see that I'm not complaining about the existence of mics in and of themselves, but rather Vanguard's specific use of them to solely amplify their strongest brass players to the level of being almost equal to the entire rest of the brass section for the sole purpose of giving their brassline less musical demand. 

That you think that visual is so important that it trumps both Music and GE in terms of accreditation is laughable. There's really nothing more to say on this matter, since any time anyone brings up music to you you immediately swerve straight back to visual as if that's some kind of panacea.

Since you want a breakdown so bad, let's go. Bluecoats first:

Sure, they do a lot of standing/body movement and playing. I'll note that in the other thread, you were incredibly in favor of body movement as having superior demand to traditional marching, so in the name of consistency I'd expect you to actually like that the Bluecoats are doing body visuals while playing. That said, about 2:30 into the Bluecoats show is an extended period of marching and playing, around 190 BPM, only 16 counts of which are half time. You also conveniently ignored the rhythmically difficult section at the end of their opener, while they are doing the follow-the-leader through the prop.

Lots of body movement during the ballad, including hip movement, kneeling, and standing up. There's also marching and playing, too.

You're quick to criticize the closer. Let's examine. Sure, there's a lot of park and blow. There's also a lot of your favorite, body movement while playing. You also seem to be ignoring the last moments of the show, the unwinding drill while the full brass line is playing melodic material (or countermelodic in the case of the mellos). Also, I would note that the brass line is playing in front of the staged shotgun mics, so there is no ambient amplification at the end of the show.

You have me extremely confused with someone else. I think body movement is incredibly rudimentary dance/yoga and is rewarded significantly more so than marching difficult drill when it really is not nearly as difficult.

Moving on from that. Your analysis of the Bluecoats is laughable when compared to your analysis of SCV.

So here's my pudding break down of Bluecoats:

The opening bars are a simple chorale piece (Prelude) played by a stationary mic'd brassline. Sure, there are timing challenges, but the fact that they are being blasted over a sound system covers those up. You'd just blame the echo anyway. Meanwhile, the guard is dancing on a gimmicky jagged ramp (is that supposed to be as instrumental to the show as the half pipes used last year?) 

Percussion Break 1. (While the hornline dances in a poorly diagonally dressed rectangle with bowler hats and the tubas stand in the same place for an hour playing the same bassline)

This percussion/dance break lasts 50 seconds, while the guard stands around on the ramp still. The last 10 seconds they finally run down off the ramp (where I don't think they were actually doing anything at all during the break) and the hornline switches places. The first difficult piece of hornline music takes place for 25 seconds, while the hornline members shimmy their legs while standing on the ramp. The guard is staged horribly in front of the field and the tubas have marched about 20 total yards in the show so far (we're 3 minutes in). The hornline exits the ramp in two single file lines toward the front and back, following the leader across the field while the baritones play a few quarter/1/8 note riffs, with the melos coming in with a cord shortly after. The hornline does some rotating rectangles while playing some 1/8 notes and rotate into a 4 lined wave form, where they will stand for the next 10 seconds of show while playing the most difficult riff of music so far. They then turn back field and play while marching in what I assume is an amoeba or some sort of Mexican jumping bean that turns in to snake drill. This is the most impressive part of their playing and moving so far (other than half of it being in two circles while being marched at half time) as they deconstruct the snake into a kite or something. It's pretty messy, but its a diamond with a tail. They do some body movements here and then...

Percussion Break 2. (While the hornlines do the some more snake drill they were just doing before, this time not playing, eventually morphing into two blocks, then one, then they disappear under the ramp.)

After 25 seconds of drum break the low brass emerges from under the ramp in some sort of poorly dressed rectangle (they like these apparently). The rest of the brass line comes out the other side and everyone breaks into 8 blocks, then 8 poorly dressed rotating lines, which eventually become a outline of a rectangle which eventually becomes umm, I think a stylized outline of California around the ramp? Poorly dressed lines rotate into the snake follow the leader form as they continue playing the same riff OVER AND OVER for 20 seconds. The riff ends in a chord then they construct a block while playing 1/16th notes. They hit the block and finish on a chord.

Percussion Break 3. (this time just the pit while the horns construct an arch facing back field.)

They eventually set their horns down and run around like they are airplanes flying around the field, then do some body movements while the baritone soloist misses 30% of his solo and finally pick up their horns, moving back field. This is the BEST MUSICAL MOMENT OF THE SEASON with zero actual impact. They kneel and play music and slowly rotate on their knee facing back field. The guard is doing some dancing in which a third of them are on a different count than the other 2/3rds, in a blob of some sort that isn't dressed while the hornline finally turns around (but it doesn't sound like it due to mic'ing) and plays a beautiful chord. The guard shrinks into a small dot and lifts someone up for some reason.

The hornline hops around on the tarp. 

Percussion Break 4. (This one lasts 1 minute and 36 seconds. and ends at the closer)

The closer is literally 16 solos (while the hornline marches their most difficult drill of the night) and parking and blowing the most difficult brass parts. The show ends with the hornline in a line off of the field and the guard running up the ramp for no reason.

 

How'd I do?

 

Edited August 2, 2017 by Treefidy

[Vdad76]

3 hours ago, whitedj2002 said:

Btw I respect everything you typed and see the validity from my bias, best coast perspective! :)

Thanks.

[pudding]

2 minutes ago, Treefidy said:

You have me extremely confused with someone else. I think body movement is incredibly rudimentary dance/yoga and is rewarded significantly more so than marching difficult drill when it really is not nearly as difficult.

Moving on from that. Your analysis of the Bluecoats is laughable when compared to your analysis of SCV.

So here's my pudding break down of Bluecoats:

The opening bars are a simple chorale piece (Prelude) played by a stationary mic'd brassline. Sure, there are timing challenges, but the fact that they are being blasted over a sound system covers those up. You'd just blame the echo anyway. Meanwhile, the guard is dancing on a gimmicky jagged ramp (is that supposed to be as instrumental to the show as the half pipes used last year?) 

Percussion Break 1. (While the hornline dances in a poorly diagonally dressed rectangle with bowler hats and the tubas stand in the same place for an hour playing the same bassline)

This percussion/dance break lasts 50 seconds, while the guard stands around on the ramp still. The last 10 seconds they finally run down off the ramp (where I don't think they were actually doing anything at all during the break) and the hornline switches places. The first difficult piece of hornline music takes place for 25 seconds, while the hornline members shimmy their legs while standing on the ramp. The guard is staged horribly in front of the field and the tubas have marched about 20 total yards in the show so far (we're 3 minutes in). The hornline exits the ramp in two single file lines toward the front and back, following the leader across the field while the baritones play a few quarter/1/8 note riffs, with the melos coming in with a cord shortly after. The hornline does some rotating rectangles while playing some 1/8 notes and rotate into a 4 lined wave form, where they will stand for the next 10 seconds of show while playing the most difficult riff of music so far. They then turn back field and play while marching in what I assume is an amoeba or some sort of Mexican jumping bean that turns in to snake drill. This is the most impressive part of their playing and moving so far (other than half of it being in two circles while being marched at half time) as the deconstruct the snake into a kite or something. It's pretty messy, but its a diamond with a tail. They do some body movements here and then...

Percussion Break 2. (While the hornlines do the some more snake drill they were just doing before, this time not playing, eventually morphing into two blocks, then one, then they disappear under the ramp.)

After 25 seconds of drum break the low brass emerges from under the ramp in some sort of poorly dressed rectangle (they like these apparently). The rest of the brass line comes out the other side and everyone breaks into 8 blocks, then 8 poorly dressed rotating lines, which eventually become a outline of a rectangle which eventually becomes umm, I think a stylized outline of California around the ramp? Poorly dressed lines rotate into the snake follow the leader form as they continue playing the same riff OVER AND OVER for 20 seconds. The riff ends in a chord then they construct a block while playing 1/16th notes. They hit the block and finish on a chord.

Percussion Break 3. (this time just the pit while the horns construct an arch facing back field.)

They eventually set their horns down and run around like they are airplanes flying around the field, then do some body movements while the baritone soloist misses 30% of his solo and finally pick up their horns, moving back field. This is the BEST MUSICAL MOMENT OF THE SEASON with zero actual impact. The kneel and play music and slowly rotate on their knee facing back field. The guard is doing some dancing in which a third of them are on a different count than the other 2/3rds, in a blob of some sort that isn't dressed while the hornline finally turns around (but it doesn't sound like it due to mic'ing) and plays a beautiful chord. The guard shrinks into a small dot and lifts someone up for some reason.

The hornline hops around on the tarp. 

Percussion Break 4. (This one lasts 1 minute and 36 seconds. and ends at the closer)

The closer is literally 16 solos (while the hornline marches their most difficult drill of the night) and parking and blowing the most difficult brass parts. The show ends with the hornline in a line off of the field and the guard running up the ramp for no reason.

 

How'd I do?

 

You've revealed yourself as nothing but a hater and a homer. I'm not going to respond to you anymore since it's obvious you have nothing but vitriol. Good night. 

[Vdad76]

5 minutes ago, Treefidy said:

You have me extremely confused with someone else. I think body movement is incredibly rudimentary dance/yoga and is rewarded significantly more so than marching difficult drill when it really is not nearly as difficult.

Moving on from that. Your analysis of the Bluecoats is laughable when compared to your analysis of SCV.

So here's my pudding break down of Bluecoats:

The opening bars are a simple chorale piece (Prelude) played by a stationary mic'd brassline. Sure, there are timing challenges, but the fact that they are being blasted over a sound system covers those up. You'd just blame the echo anyway. Meanwhile, the guard is dancing on a gimmicky jagged ramp (is that supposed to be as instrumental to the show as the half pipes used last year?) 

Percussion Break 1. (While the hornline dances in a poorly diagonally dressed rectangle with bowler hats and the tubas stand in the same place for an hour playing the same bassline)

This percussion/dance break lasts 50 seconds, while the guard stands around on the ramp still. The last 10 seconds they finally run down off the ramp (where I don't think they were actually doing anything at all during the break) and the hornline switches places. The first difficult piece of hornline music takes place for 25 seconds, while the hornline members shimmy their legs while standing on the ramp. The guard is staged horribly in front of the field and the tubas have marched about 20 total yards in the show so far (we're 3 minutes in). The hornline exits the ramp in two single file lines toward the front and back, following the leader across the field while the baritones play a few quarter/1/8 note riffs, with the melos coming in with a cord shortly after. The hornline does some rotating rectangles while playing some 1/8 notes and rotate into a 4 lined wave form, where they will stand for the next 10 seconds of show while playing the most difficult riff of music so far. They then turn back field and play while marching in what I assume is an amoeba or some sort of Mexican jumping bean that turns in to snake drill. This is the most impressive part of their playing and moving so far (other than half of it being in two circles while being marched at half time) as the deconstruct the snake into a kite or something. It's pretty messy, but its a diamond with a tail. They do some body movements here and then...

Percussion Break 2. (While the hornlines do the some more snake drill they were just doing before, this time not playing, eventually morphing into two blocks, then one, then they disappear under the ramp.)

After 25 seconds of drum break the low brass emerges from under the ramp in some sort of poorly dressed rectangle (they like these apparently). The rest of the brass line comes out the other side and everyone breaks into 8 blocks, then 8 poorly dressed rotating lines, which eventually become a outline of a rectangle which eventually becomes umm, I think a stylized outline of California around the ramp? Poorly dressed lines rotate into the snake follow the leader form as they continue playing the same riff OVER AND OVER for 20 seconds. The riff ends in a chord then they construct a block while playing 1/16th notes. They hit the block and finish on a chord.

Percussion Break 3. (this time just the pit while the horns construct an arch facing back field.)

They eventually set their horns down and run around like they are airplanes flying around the field, then do some body movements while the baritone soloist misses 30% of his solo and finally pick up their horns, moving back field. This is the BEST MUSICAL MOMENT OF THE SEASON with zero actual impact. The kneel and play music and slowly rotate on their knee facing back field. The guard is doing some dancing in which a third of them are on a different count than the other 2/3rds, in a blob of some sort that isn't dressed while the hornline finally turns around (but it doesn't sound like it due to mic'ing) and plays a beautiful chord. The guard shrinks into a small dot and lifts someone up for some reason.

The hornline hops around on the tarp. 

Percussion Break 4. (This one lasts 1 minute and 36 seconds. and ends at the closer)

The closer is literally 16 solos (while the hornline marches their most difficult drill of the night) and parking and blowing the most difficult brass parts. The show ends with the hornline in a line off of the field and the guard running up the ramp for no reason.

 

How'd I do?

 

Any show could be broken down like this if you are looking for the faults, which are pretty opinionated, which is anybodies perspective that loves a certain corps, wants to see them win and defends what they do to the bitter end.  

[Treefidy]

7 minutes ago, pudding said:

You've revealed yourself as nothing but a hater and a homer. I'm not going to respond to you anymore since it's obvious you have nothing but vitriol. Good night. 

Says the guy who doesn't even actually know who is playing and when during SCV's show. You broke SCV's show down into a crudely biased and absolutely horribly stated mess of drivel, and expected me to give you sugar back. FOH...

I gave you gold buddy.

[Treefidy]

6 minutes ago, Vdad76 said:

Any show could be broken down like this if you are looking for the faults, which are pretty opinionated, which is anybodies perspective that loves a certain corps, wants to see them win and defends what they do to the bitter end.  

You read his break down? He got what he gave, but in far more detail...

[N.E. Brigand]

I haven't read any of this thread yet, but in passing I'll just note that, though a big fan of this year's Bluecoats' show, which I saw live twice and thought at that time was likely to get them a second championship, I said last night to garfield after they performed at his show, "I can see why they're currently ranked fourth".