Tim K

Personally I enjoy the full retreat at the end of a show and was surprised there wasn't one at CYO Nationals Tribute last Saturday. There was one two years ago and the report was the reason we did not see a full retreat in 2012 was due to BAC being in California. I can see where a review could cause traffic jams between corps with one corps setting up and the other exiting, but with organization that would be an easy fix. DCA corps usually wave as they pass by and that might not go over with everyone, but a review is a simple gesture that says thank-you to the crowd. However, the crowd has to do their share. We have yet in the Northeast not to have drum majors present for scores, but people leaving after the last corps finishes is getting more and more the case. Missing scores and encores for me is missing a good part of the fun.

If BAC offers the same encores to the New Haven crowd as they did last evening in Quincy, don't be tempted to leave early to avoid traffic knowing you can see the scores online. Last night their encore was one for the ages. No details now--just wait and see. It's a great group of corps. All three Open Class corps have interesting shows and some great guard moves. Personally, I could understand the placements of the World Class corps but I thought the scores should have been closer. Part of me wants to make the three hour trek to New Haven to see how they fare this evening but the weather does not look too promising and it is a hike. However, I can't wait till Bristol on Wednesday and next Friday when I'll see these same corps again.

Chapter and verse, I'm not sure. trombones are also in this category. I believe it has to do with the way the instruments are carried and or positioned, but I could be wrong.

Did drum corps "evolve" into bands or is it the other way around? As a band person who has followed drum corps for nearly 40 years, most of the innovations I saw first on the drum corps field later made their way to bands. What has changed is that most bands do not try and duplicate what they see done by a drum corps first as they would have not too long ago, but drum corps still sets the standard. Now as I say this, I know there are very innovative bands, but I don't think we're at the point where drum corps x says band y did this so we have to do it too. I do agree that the changes in instrumentation have made drum corps less distinct, but for me, the loss is in the intangibles that made drum corps drum corps. Since very few corps have feeder units or a training in smaller local corps, that uniqueness seems to be gone. Now I know that back in the glory days kids were not trained as well musically in many corps, many as late as the mid 70's could not read music at all. Yes, "Mr. Smith" at the local elementary school was far better at musical training than "Mr. Smith" the good hearted dad who volunteered at the local drum corps and may have only learned how to play the day before he had to instruct (there are tons of these stories), but beginning in drum corps at 8 or 9, continuing until age out, competing locally and perhaps when you're older competing nationally, the special training and traditions, are all but lost now. There are many reasons for this: cost of running a drum corps, lack of interest, more activities for kids, and improved school programs are all factors, but from my vantage point this is what is lost in drum corps and it's not coming back. School programs are excellent, but it's just not the same. BTW: This is not unique to drum corps. AAU, DCI's athletic equivalent is often blamed for ruining kids sports.

No. French horns like those used in an orchestra are not allowed either.

I'll be leaving in about an hour for Quincy, and right now it looks storm free! Showers are not predicted until after 9, and there's just a 10% chance. It was 30% at noontime.

Just saw the most recent forecast: a storm system that was believed too be far south this morning is now expected to hit the Outer Cape and West of Boston may be hit by scattered showers, but the Quincy area looks o.k. and the forecaster said not to change plans but to "keep an eye to the sky."

I hear "trumpet" and "soprano" used interchangeably but I rarely hear "tuba" except when recruiting. I think "contra" sounds more drum corps-ish and while the use of trumpet/soprano may be generational, I've heard kids who play tuba and lug those babies around all summer call them "contras," including a young man who marched with Crossmen last year who stopped by to say hello to his aunt and uncle who were sitting behind me in Indy. As far as color guards are concerned, referring to flags, along with rifles and sabres is not new. Today where guard members are doing so many interchangeable things, color guard is probably the best overall term. Whether a color guard is a color guard debate may be older than the debate about instrument terminology. I went to a show with a friend I n 1979. His grandparents drove us and the grandfather said "There was not one color guard in that show." 27th Lancers competed in that show and since it was early season, BAC and North Star probably competed as well. Today 27th may be the iconic color guard of yesteryear, along with Anaheim Kingsmen and Phantom Regiment.

I've been to BAC shows in the rain. Something will probably go on at Veteran's Stadium in Quincy. The question is whether it will be judged. The forecast calls for "chance of scattered showers" and the farther south you go, the less likely you are to run into showers, at least that's the forecast now. My hope is that Quincy is far enough south, but the northernmost town on the South Shore has weather that is closer to Boston than Cape Cod which I learned from living a few towns over. Regarding umbrellas, the stadium is primarily used for high school events though it is a bit larger than most high school football venues. I don't remember any restrictions other than coolers, so an umbrella is probably fine. However, if the show is judged, use your umbrella at your peril. God help you if a show is blocked. This audience will be a seasoned audience who takes shows seriously and a crowd that a little weather never stopped them. My advice: one of those plastic rain coverings that had a hood will keep you dry and will not block anyone's view.

The weather report changes all the time in New England anyway, or so they say, but today's forecast seems to change by the minute! Pop up thunders showers are predicted, but they were predicted yesterday and in most areas to the south of the state, conditions were somewhat dry. Of course a little rain never stopped BAC and there are all kinds of stories of cadets and Phantom marching in the rain. Last summer I saw Bluecoats in the rain and I was impressed they were so oblivious to the horrible weather and made me appreciate them all the more. So something will happen in Quincy tonight at CYO Nationals Tribute. But suppose the shows does go on as scheduled storm free: Will we see any changes, perhaps more "color" from BAC for the home crowd? (BTW: there will be enough people at the show tonight who remember the grey uniform of 1959, perhaps even wore it, so there will be tears of joy on some faces, trust me) Will it be Bluecoats over Phantom or Phantom over Bluecoats? Will last year's rivalry and neck in neck early season competition between 7th Regiment and Spartans pick up where it left off?

I didn't attend the show, but when I saw Surf's score, it did seem low, at least lower than this time last year. It was their first show and no doubt there were nerves and I'm hoping that when I see them this evening, they will fare better. Regarding BAC, more than a few believe the scores are lower than they should be and I certainly thought so after seeing the Akron show in the theater, but this is a show that will evolve as the season progresses and a bit of s surge is not unusual for BAC. In 2011 they were behind Madison on more than a few occasions, and Blue Knights topped them at least once. My guess is that by late July, BAC will be where it wants to be, although if a surge took place this evening in Quincy, you'll hear no complaints from me!

I was going to predict Cadets in Quincy, MA tonight, but as I checked scores this morning, I saw Crown scored over 80 last evening.

I have heard the "music major" comment for years, on DCP and in conversations, and usually it is followed by referring to guard members in a derogatory way. Now when I speak with kids marching today or their parents, most seem to be majoring in some kind of engineering field, but I do not keep a record of my conversations and quite frankly, I don't even speak with what could be considered a handful of today's marching members. For me, there is a distinction between music majors and music education majors that is important for drum corps. Music major would refer primarily to performance, perhaps composition or arranging. As another poster mentioned, music education usually refers to requirements for a teaching degree. My guess is that most kids who major in music who march drum corps are probably ed majors and this id a good thing. Think about it: don't you want a person teaching English who loves to read and perhaps tries his/her hands at writing the great American novel? Do you want a science teacher who only assigns materials from a text book or one who may love to experiment? Would you put your faith in a math teacher who cannot balance a checkbook even with the help of Quicken? Wouldn't a history teacher who visits Williamsburg, VA and prefers the stops along the Colonial Highway to neighboring Busch Gardens have more credibility? We would want a creative art teacher rather than one who simply hands out Crayolas and coloring books. A music education major involved in drum corps would be a perfect combination. They have to love music, are totally immersed in it and can bring that enthusiasm to a school situation. Since music programs can be the "catch-all" in many schools and quite often the only place a kid feels at home, someone enthusiastic who knows what hard work is, works well with others, and is dedicated would be a perfect candidate. I say all of this as someone who ahs both taught and hired teachers. Now I attend live musical performances too, so I am not slighting performance majors or those in composition either, but since educational excellence is crucial, I am glad there are music ed majors in drum corps.

I'm going with Cadets, which means it will probably not be the Cadets. After "Spartacus" going from 3rd to 2nd to 1st in 2008, I figured anything was possible so I picked Crown in 2009. I knew it would be Blue Devils in 2010 but that was a no brainer. In 2011 I picked Blue Devils, in 2012 I picked Crown, so I'm thinking my method for picking a champion may be somewhat flawed. Seriously, my reason for Cadets is based more on gut feeling than anything else, but often I see Cadets early in the season and late in the season, just prior to Big, Live, and Loud, or last year Indy and Allentown. I'll be seeing Cadets live on Saturday, but at the theater I felt like I was watching champion in the making, which I've felt before with Cadets even if a show has a long way to go. On Monday I was surprised at how good the Cadets already were but also could see why there were rumblings about why Cadets are not where they want to be at this point. To me it feels like we'll be seeing a late season masterpiece. I may feel differently after Cadets, Blue Devils, and Crown face each other in a few weeks, but right now I have a feeling it may be Cadets' year, though in my heart I want a new champion and do hope it will be Crown's year. Now what would really make things interesting is if we had a "sleeping giant" on our hands which would be Phantom or Bluecoats. I know I would not object to a Phantom victory and believe their "Enigma Variations" could be the favorite musical arrangement of the season and Bluecoats would be a new champion and their show could well be the sleeper hit of the summer.

I attend shows with and without others, and last year in Indy, I was supposed to meet up with some friends who never showed up, so by default I attended alone. Pros if attending show alone: You get to watch the shows in their entirety and not be interrupted, you don't have to worry about if the people with you are bored and may annoy you about going home, and what I enjoy most, you meet other people. Drum corps fans are friendly and opinionated so all kinds of conversations arise. Cons of attending a show alone: You feel funny going crazy for your favorite corps. My guess is that it would be hard to be a Blue Devils fan in the midst of a group of Crown lovers and if you are alone, it might be hard to express your true feelings. That would probably be the case with any block section, except maybe BAC and Madison. Fans from Boston love Madison and since the Scout section was near BAC's section at Indy, the feeling seems to be mutual but the rivalry is still real. Actually I have some advice for sitting alone. If your favorite corps sells "block tickets" for a section which is often the case at major shows, buy one of these tickets. It helps support the corps and chance are you'll meet someone you know.

I'm not sure I will have an all-time favorite show this year, but if you have followed drum corps since you we're twelve and you celebrated your fiftieth birthday this past year, you have more seasons without an all-time favorite than with one. That being said, I think I will enjoy more shows this year than in the past because from what I saw at the theater Monday night and on the Fan Network does impress me and I see a great deal of potential. At heart I'm old school, and most of my favorite moments were before 1990, and there have been a few years I have thought my ticket money could have been used for something better, but what I have found helpful is following certain corps from the beginning and watching the show improve and finding a corps with a killer piece of music. This engages me and before long I have an appreciation of most of the competitors.

I can think of another clear example, granted you don't see that often--out of step. The original poster mentioned figure skating as another objectively judged show, at skating shows a program is handed to the judges as to what jumps to expect, what takes place when and where, and commentators have the same program and can point out when the skater succeeds or fails: the triple comes out as a double, the landing is not clean, etc. A fall is an automatic penalty. The points and deductions are based on specific criteria. How the show flows is clearly the opinion of the judge and there are preferences as to whether a judge prefers an athletic show, artistic show, etc., and some of results have been far more controversial in the skating world than whether BD should have won last year. Now if I am not mistaken, I believe that you judge high school band programs which do use the same methods as drum corps and I am sure you understand the intricacies involved better than I do. All I judge are judges' results. I know there is a difference between what a person likes and what will win a show. I loved Star's 1987 circus show, I was mixed regarding 1991 (not with Zingali's drill-a masterpiece), but I know why one show won and the other placed 7th. "Angels and Demons" did not lift me from the depths of Hell to the heights of Heaven, "12.25" captivated me, but I know why Cadets won in 2011 and agree with the decision. However, there are times when I have seen shows where a corps has a bad night and is way off, a close contender has a great show, but the lackluster show tops the apparently stronger show. How did judges reach the decision? That's what people do not know and why I believe that a few objective areas as well as deductions for dropped equipment and the like would clarify matters. Judges comments could also become a matter of public record, but that could create the risk of stampedes as die hard fans run to either praise or tar and feather the judges.

To some extent, my feelings on the matter have been stated by Hockey Dad and Brasso. There does need to be an objective component to the judging system. I don't think an objective component would drastically change results since show design is based on what judges are looking for, but an objective component would give credibility to the more subjective components. Deciding what the objective components would be could be difficult. It's rare to see major errors in most DCI shows which may be why the Tic system became in the view of many subjective. That being said, dropped equipment is still dropped equipment just as falling after a jump in figure skating is still falling on the ice. We can objectify. Now as far as judges knowing directors--the drum corps community is small. Judges and directors will know each other. I don't think it make all that much of a difference. Back in the day, there was a Massachusetts corps that was beginning to make some noise locally and nationally. One girl in the corps had an uncle who was an influential judge. The rumor was he was the reason the corps was succeeding. The young woman and her corps believed "Uncle Judge" was the reason the corps did not place higher.

First observation: very impressed at such an early season show. Just some of my thoughts. Cadets: Most of the attention regarding who will win in Indy has focused on the action in California, and I was in that group, but after tonight's broadcast of the Akron show, Cadets could be the corps to beat. The show is hardly where Cadets want it to be, as rumblings have stated, but it's far from a slow start. The drum line has attitude and got a good amount of camera time. I also thought the show highlighted Cadets' natural talent at producing good shows. We've had three gimmick shows from Cadets in 2010-2012 (Little Geoffrey and Toy Souldier--don't know why they spelled soldier that way, Angels and Demons in 2011, and 2012's 12.25). Enjoyed all three shows but it was nice to see what I thought was straight drum corps. Phantom: I thought after seeing the show they were contenders for either first or second in Akron. Third surprised me. "Enigma Variations" will be Phantom Classic, can't wait till a MP3 download is available. The guard begins as the epitome of feminine and ends kind of "Zena the Warrior Princess" combined with "Clan of the Cave Bear" but it works. Probably won't place as high as "Turandot" but is on a par with "Juliet." Bluecoats: When I heard they were opening with Paul Simon's "America" I thought it would be a good fit for them and for drum corps and I was correct. People have commented about the great guard moves in other threads but I'm not sure these moves caught the attention of the camera. Their show concept may need a few views to appreciate but it is consistent and works. I would have placed them third, but the score was so close to Phantom, it's really quibbling to go into great debates. They'll definitely make things interest8ing this summer. Boston Crusaders: I assumed they would be solidly in fourth place and bit closer to Bluecoats and Phantom. The show is perhaps their most mature concept that I've ever seen (followed them since 1975 though I'll admit, in the early years I was only about 12, still I know what I liked), and the grey worked better than I thought, though it may be a bit too grey. Since they fared much better the following night and people who saw both shows claim it was vast improvement, I'm not changing my prediction they will fare well this year, and they seem to be well prepared though there is need of tweaking. My thought that they should have been closer in scoring to Bluecoats may be the boas of a longtime BAC fan, but a sixth place placement seemed too low. Spirit: Like everyone else, I enjoyed the show. Stronger musical show this year, but seems to be missing the flair of 2011 and 2012 but it's early and the show didn't seem complete. However all is forgiven as soon as they play "Sweet Georgia Brown." They should find a higher placement in Indy this year. I expected a fifth place finish, behind Boston but ahead of Cavies. Cavaliers: Mixed reaction. The show concept works better than I expected. The show lacked the bravado I associate with Cavies, with lots of dropped equipment and an uneven musical performance. To be fair, camera angles were not in their favor and we saw more of the costume change than we probably would have if we were in the stands which for me was a huge distraction. When results were read, Steve Rondinaro and Dennis Delucia expressed surprise at the judges' appraisal of Cavies. The show is stronger than last year, and it will improve, but I don't expect it will end in the top 7 All in all, it looks like it will be another interesting season.

Why not?. Last year the kids got lobster in Lawrence and steak in Indy, so this is a natural progression. If it's staff only, that works too. Think about it. You're with over 150 kids between theages of 16-21 all summer, teaching, acting like a surrogate parent, and doing all kinds of things that are not in the job description. They deserve it.

Regarding "booing" at shows, particularly the recent Crown/Blue Devils episodes from last year and now beginning again this year: the jeering rarely comes from the Crown section at shows where corps have blocks of tickets. I first noticed this at Allentown and later in Indy. My question regarding these so-called Crown fans has been are they cheering for Crown and bitterly disappointed at the results or are they cheering against the Blue Devils? There is a difference and while there can be many opinions regarding Blue Devils shows, but there is also some illogical vitriol and this goes back to the 70's. As one who proudly hails from Red Sox Nation, I have friends who love going to Major League baseball games in other cities and rooting against the Yankees. I also know when Baltimore had lean years, many Orioles fans began rooting for the Red Sox, not because they had newfound love for their East Coast neighbors to the North, but the Sox had the chance to defeat the Yankees. Perhaps in Marching Music's Major League, Concord, CA is home of "the Evil Empire" and the Blue Devils are drum corps equivalent to the Yankees.

Not sure where you live and whether it will be a day trip or overnight stay. If you're staying overnight, hotels in Quakertown are more reasonably priced than Allentown and the drive is pretty easy. There is not much to do in Allentown between the shows unless you are planning on watching the corps rehearse, so bring something to do if you are staying overnight. Eat prior to the show or plan on eating after it's finished. The concession stands tend to have long lines and lots of junk food. It's almost like being at a fair--fried Oreos and just about anything else fried you can imagine. Yocco's has great burgers and lots of corps members eat there so if you go after the show, you'll hear all kinds of stories. Hamilton Family Restaurant is good too, but it's sit down and the wait can be long. Supposedly judges eat there but when I ate there, most of the customers wondered what was happening at the stadium and thought they picked the wrong time to eat there! It's a great atmosphere and the crowd loves it, so enjoy!

Much to early to draw that conclusion. While last night's victory was a huge boost as far as momentum is concerned for Crown, the scores were too close to have it be considered a decisive victory for Crown or a major defeat for Blue Devils. What it does show is that early chatter prior to the season was either wrong or misinterpreted, and I'll put myself in the guilty as charged category. I read everything that came from Cadets either via mail or Facebook and believed they were bracing us for a slow start though not a slow finish, and put them lower this season at least as far as the beginning is concerned. I think I misinterpreted what I read. I also believed what I heard about Blue Knights which seems to be somewhat incorrect and where I did not hear all the hype from Crown that I heard last year at this time, I expected they would be good put perhaps not as strong as 2011 and 2012.

Your seem very well versed in music,. However, I would like to just say a few things regarding this comment. I do not dispute that a composer might feel this way about drum corps in general, but I don't think the statement is fair. For one thing, most people marching in drum corps are students, they can't be second rate since they are still aspiring. Compared with other student musical groups they are certainly not second rate and since there is not really a professional equivalent to drum corps, I'm not sure where the criteria would be. Also, I don't think composers not liking the way their music is presented is all that unusual. Though Chuck Mangione was a guest host for a DCI telecast one year, it was rumored that he was not as fascinated by drum corps as drum corps was by his music. John Williams supposedly was not thrilled about his music being used either. I've never met Mangione and while I did shake John Williams hand at a Boston Symphony fundraiser, I was part of the larger public, not the major donors (I p[aid $25 to get in), so he didn't confide his opinion to me. And of course there's the situation involving "Empire State of Mind" and Madison's rendition--not sure if it was by Jay Z and the lovely Ms. Keyes ort their lawyers but of DCP is to be believed, both celebs were pretty upset with the "marching band rendition" of their song. I also think that composer may be a bit off base about music and visuals. While many drum corps perform pieces that are meant for the concert hall, corps also use music from films, ballet, opera, and Broadway. This is meant to have both a visual component to it as well as the musical performance. "The Nutcracker" has great music but "The Nutcracker" with a growing Christmas tree is a bit more exciting. "Carmen" is enjoyable when excerpted, it's even better when we can see the lovers' tension on stage. Now we should be focusing on Crown. I will admit I have, in the past, wondered about Crown's musical choices, and no they do not always select what I would consider "audience friendly" music, same holds true with many corps, yet crowds go wild. I'm one of them, and the reason I believe this happens is because Crown knows how to capture interest from the first note and holds the audience's attention until the moment the corps leaves the field. though there are some Crown critics, I believe their guard as well as strong brass performers do this quite well. For me, studying the music and being familiar with it prior to a show would not necessarily be helpful. Out of curiosity I googled "Flume" performed by Bluecoats latest season. The original was edgy and sounded nothing like Bluecoats who had a far more melodious version. If a corps selects music that is unfamiliar, it better be music that can easily be appreciated. If it can't, the visuals need to be strong enough to grab the audience. Overall I believe Crown does this well and judging from early reviews, have every reason to expect they will this year too.

Great statistical info. You did your homework. Some years the difference between 12th and 13th is small point wise, but the ramifications can be huge. In 1978 many a fan was shocked to turn on PBS to watch finals and see Kilties had placed 12th. Most lists had BAC, Freelancers, Garfield, or perhaps Cavies in that spot. Don't ask a Crossmen alum from 1979 if he/she rejoiced when Troopers had a renaissance late in the season and made finals. In 1980 North Star just made finals, in 1981 I think they had a stronger show, but they placed 13th (they were on my prediction list as finalists both years). Some 27th Lancer alums still cite bus problems that meant less rehearsal time as the reason they could not fine tune some of their show and make finals in 1986, and if you look at how they placed that season, they're probably not all that far off the mark. Fast forward to 2011, I think it was pretty clear Spirit would return to finals and Glassmen would be 13th. In 2012, until Crossmen's score was announced, the debate was pretty fierce as to whether it would be Crossmen or Blue Stars. Action between 10-15 makes the season exciting. A corps surging to the top from behind also makes life interesting. We're already seeing what could end up being an interesting season after one four corps show. I will bet there's more than a few of us with egg on our faces today after reading about the show and hearing complimentary reports about the Blue Knights. All winter long we heard reports of poor recruitment, a show that people predicted would not be great, and a downward spiral after last year's show which was not, to be nice, everyone's favorite. Turns out the show may better than most expected and predictions may have to be revamped. There could be some other corps that will prove to be exciting, and perhaps a few "sure things" that will disappoint. Can't wait to get to a "movie theater near you" to see what Monday night brings and what the results of the West Coast shows will be.