Tim K

I don’t recall if it was “Ghost” or “Brasso” who manned the phones at WGBH Channel 2, Boston’s PBS affiliate in the earliest days of the broadcast. He told all sorts of horror stories of unpaid pledges and I know he was correct, but that did not make it different from a lot of PBS pledge drives. It was also in the dark ages of PBS fundraising/development and long before the huge endowments some affiliates have, and of course lack of endowments of smaller stations. Today they are much more sophisticated and successful and in general do not depend on donors supporting a particular show. PBS looks for more variety hoping to entice donors who want a wide range of shows. PBS does not do live broadcasts all that often. Usually an affiliate produces a program and distributes it to other affiliates. Live broadcasts are expensive and unpredictable. So even if they did broadcast finals, it would not be live. This is not all that different than before. I think 1980 was the last time DCI was live in the Boston area. The challenge today could be licensing and broadcasting rights. something that could be a possibility is a PBS crew covering a general overview of a drum corps season. They have done similar endeavors with theater camps, science camps, and different sports.

Just signed it!

I don’t think you would see it live, but it might work as a show to attract new members for PBS. Years ago it was broadcast as a fundraiser with poor results, but PBS has become more sophisticated in fundraising. The broadcast as a way to attract new fans is also a possibility. Il Divo, Celtic Women and Celtic Thunder owe a huge debt to PBS as does Chris Botti. All were first broadcast as PBS fundraisers. Yanni’s best selling recording was his PBS special. “Riverdance” was first broadcast in the United States as a PBS fundraiser. Would DCI be another “Downton Abbey?” Probably not, but it would beat watching reruns of Suze Orman and Rick Steeves.

I think that this year, who places 2nd, 3rd, and 4th will be a huge deal, especially if Blue Devils win. 2nd was tied last year and Bloo and BAC both want at least 2nd without a tie. Crown would love a return to the top three and believed they s deserved a better placement last year and Crown, BAC, and Bloo seem evenly mag he’d.

The prestige of the top three goes back to the earliest days of DCI. Until 1980 SCV prided itself on being the only corps to place in the top three each year at finals. It was a big deal when Blue Devils placed in the top three for the first time in 1975 and in 1982 when Garfield Cadets made the top three for the first time. Honoring the top three is pretty common in many activities.

Are you surprised?🙂 He mentioned on his FB page he was heading to Denver, so heading to San Antonio via Broken Arrow makes sense.

I agree and I think I have put dates and venues in show threads I’ve started over the years though with Broken Arrow, I think folks have had July 18th on their mind since the tour was announced. The first meeting of the top 4 of last year which will in all likelihood will be the top 4 this year. I will say, I do like the clever names for the threads that have been used this year.

I love Allentown and in some ways enjoy it more than Indy. I’ve also been to Atlanta but never San Antonio. What I enjoyed about Atlanta which I assume is also the case in San Antonio is the youthfulnness and enthusiasm of the crowd which differs from Allentown which tends to be more of a reunion atmosphere. It is my understanding that Allentown is practically pure profit for DCI. Use of the facility is reasonable, the volunteers have the show down to a science, and there’s ample places for get togethers. You could move it to let’s say Met Life Stadium or if you really wanted to go East, Gillette in Foxboro, MA. I don’t think the crowds would follow and I don’t think it would attract a new audience. If it became a one day event, you’d lose out on the reunion atmosphere, a two day event would be costly. I’m sure there would be other facilities that would be possible, but I don’t think it would work.

I don’t believe they are assigned Friday or Saturday but if that’s not the case I stand corrected. Though there have been a few changes, most years who will compete on Friday or Saturday is announced when the tour is announced, so Friday or Saturday night is not based on the current year. A few years back when Boston Crusaders performed on Friday night, publicity by the corps to buy tickets in their block made it sound like it was their choice to compete Friday night. Though I’d have to look it up, it seems that most years Blue Devils compete of Friday, Crown and Cadets on Saturday.Personally I love the Saturday show. The Friday show is great, but Saturday has that Allentown feel.

With the exception of the domed shows, do they have afternoon performances anymore? The last time I remember sitting in the stands at an afternoon show which usually fell on a Sunday was at least 30 years ago and the local circuits with Class C/B/A or Junior/Prep/Senior were still in existence.

Just a few thoughts on performance order. In 2014 I went to Atlanta and the following night a TOC show in Charlotte. In Atlanta where Cadets performed near the end of the show, they were on fire. Everything went as it was supposed to, the show was on target musically, the audience loved it. The Cadets placed 2nd. The following night Cadets either opened the show or competed second. The program seemed dry, it elicited little emotion from the crowd. I did not see any horrendous errors. Again, Cadets placed 2nd. Cadets 2014 was a show I enjoyed and had seen live five times and as I look back, I wonder if the corps was not warmed up, or whether I as a fan was not warmed up. Given all the driving I had to do, finding parking, getting to my seat, etc., it may have been me. I know as the night goes on, I usually get more riveted though I also know there are times when a corps with a weaker show competes after a corps with a stronger show and it did hurt if not the score, but it did impact my perception of the performance. I’m also more likely to spot errors. Each session is different. I think the top 4 placements at Broken Arrow will be the top 4 in San Antonio and Atlanta. The 5-7 placements in San Antonio will be the 5-7 in Atlanta. However it would not surprise me if the the results and who landed in first, second third, fifth, etc. could be different. If this happens discussions about the role performance order played could be interesting.

I saw the props up close and personal. They passed me as they were moved to the stadium and I saw them being put on the truck. They are not as cheaply made or cheesey as you describe and they do add color. They may need to be used differently, and perhaps they have made changes, and something else may be needed. I’m not a huge fan of the uniforms, but they work. I still think we’ll see them in the 5-7 category. It will be interesting to see how they fare at Little Rock tomorrow night and at Broken Arrow next week.

In the past you began to hear rumblings about the next season at Atlanta, probably based on discussions at San Antonio. By Allentown there were credible predictions and not so credible rumors. By Indy it was all but public knowledge but nothing can be said until after Labor Day because, no names or corps mentioned, a certain former director of an East Coast corps was angry certain staff members found a home further East and the corps announced it the Monday after finals. I think that could be when we hear specifics about whether SCV will return come San Antonio or Atlanta. Personally thinking a SCV return will not happen. I think there are just too many problems to be solved, not to mention the revenue needed. Staff members in many cases have found a new home. If it happens, great, but I don’t think they’ll be a top contender right away. Finalist perhaps. Mandarins seem to be in 5-7 contention. If they should reach as high as 5, that’s where SCV left if in 2022. If that happens, would Mandarins members leave to go to an unknown? I’m thinking no. For one thing, I’ve often heard it’s a very tight knit group. Yes we can say SCV won a title not too long ago, and they have a glorious history, but for people auditioning in 2024, many were in middle school in 2018. It’s ancient history.

I agree that 2014 was when we saw the anti-Blue Devils talk begin to decrease. It could be obnoxious. G7 didn’t help matters and some shows were not always audience friendly. I think there were two big things that happened. One is Crown winning in 2013, especially where there was so much suspense with BD winning prelims and Crown winning semi’s and then finals. So many thought 2009 “Grass is Always Greener” should have won, and 2012 as well (I was in that camp, at least they should have won semi’s). The second is that 2014’s show is one of the all time overall favorite shows. However, the one thing that is always true. In Allentown when you go to Yocco’s (not me anymore. A little too greasy) or stop at the convenience store on your way to the car, or the airport on Sunday in Indy, you get to talk to marching members and win or lose, the kids are very similar.

If he doesn’t go there when it comes to Cavies, we’d have to send an ambulance because something would be seriously wrong!🙂

I agree that the later start accounts for higher scores. I also think Jeff Ream has some good insights regarding design. When we hear critiques this season, we’re hearing more about what a corps has to add rather than revamp and change. The later start gave the corps to be better prepared on many fronts.

To answer the question at its most basic level, Boston Crusaders will win a title before Mandarins medal. Right now Blue Devils is undefeated and many people who have seen the show live believe BD will be undefeated for the remainder of the season. I still think we need to wait and see how Boson Crusaders fare when they meet Blue Devils for the first time this weekend and at Broken Arrow next week when BD, BAC, Crown, and Bloo are together for the first time. Will there be a battle for first? If not, will Crown still place higher than Bloo and BAC? Mandarins are on the rise, but where they, like Blue Devils, have not had significant competitive challenges this year, we have to see how they fare in their next match-ups. I have had Phantom and Cadets in the 5th and 6th slot with Mandarins, Cavies, and Blue Stars in 7-9. I’m thinking we could see Mandarins battling Cadets and Phantom for a 5-7 placement, but I think it will be a few more years before the medal.

Spirit is stronger than many expected, but are they as strong as their last competitive year? At this point, the remaining 11 of last year’s top 12 are in a stronger position than this time last year, or so it seems and some who lost a bit of ground due to the pandemic have recovered. I could see Spirit in the top 15 but not quite the top 12. Crossmen could prove to be the most improved corps from where they are now come the end of the season, but it sounds as if they lost ground between last year and this year and there’s still a lot of work to do. A friend with close Crossmen connections used to say talented kids would stay a year or two with Crossmen and then move on to a destination corps. The corps could rely on the talent and used it well even if it was for a short time. I’m thinking that has not been the case since the pandemic.

My head says Blue Knights. My heart wants Pacific Crest, Madison, or Academy. The Champion of the Underdog in me says Crossmen.

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The 1980 comment is a joke. Interestingly looking back at that time, some things have never changed. Fans both loved and resented Blue Devils. The sheer power of the corps was admired. There was also resentment that they were too modern and the fact they were the first non charter member to be a dominant force. Regarding SCV, I am saying that in the past we had a closer competitor to Blue Devils for basing predictions, this year we don’t. Though I am a big spectator and often base my predictions on facts combined with gut feelings, and very often find myself eating crow when results are announced, scores help us predict much better than “I saw them live and they’re great” or “The Flo broadcast shows they need work.” If you want to see how much scores work in predicting, look at comments about Crown and BAC last week and comments about Bloo’s first non competitive performance and then look at predictions based on the first match up. Somewhat different.

Blue Devils seemed to have a great run last night and could have an undefeated season as many have said, and betting against Blue Devils is not wise, but there are a few things to keep in mind. 1. Most years BD had SCV as a competitor. With no disrespect to Mandarins, SCV was a more formidable competitor and based on the closeness of the two corps’ scores, we could determine how good BD was any given year and whether a show was one of “those shows.” That being said, without SCV, there’s no need for judges to score the top corps higher, so BD’s scores this year may be more accurate and not a case of “West Coast inflation.” 2. I think people underestimated Crown, especially those who predicted a 5th place spot for them, BAC will always have cranks no matter how good they are, and Bloo can have rough spots early on. I’ll wait till Broken Arrow till I predict an undefeated season for BD. Who am I kidding? There are some BD shows I’ve loved, most recently 2014, 2015, 2017, and even though it was an SCV year, 2018, but I still believe 27th should have won in 1980, and I want to see BAC win this year, so I’ll admit my bias and won’t predict an undefeated season till it happens and I’m at the airport heading home on August 13th where I’ll no doubt run into Blue Devils marching members and congratulate them on the season.🙂

I think Cadets have many of the basics in place. I think the prop movement needs to be a bit smoother but I still have them battling with Phantom for 5th and 6th place though after hearing what I have about Mandarins and improvements made by Blue Stars, that could change.

Not to slight Mandarins who seem to be have a great show, short of a huge penalty which rarely happens today, Blue Devils and an undefeated season is pretty safe until the first time the meet BAC, Crown, or Bloo. Crown could be in for a challenge tonight, though I’m thinking that I, like many, underestimated Crown in predictions. A home show along with momentum could mean a victory tonight. Regarding Surf, if they are judged as a WC corps in their first shows, since they are the only WC corps in the shows they will be undefeated until NightBEAT which I believe is the first time they face WC competition.