DCP No Longer Important?

[garfield]

I think that DCP is great for many of the things you list above, and is important for some aspects of our activity. With a small niche activity we have, there truly are not many places that DCI can look to for customer input.

But there is little on here, IMO, to base any kind of substantial market research on. There is no clear data that:

* DCP is filled with the key demographics that DCI is hoping to attract

* people on here truly are customers of DCI. They say they are, but there's no evidence to support it with just a cursory reading of threads

I would suspect market researchers would not consider DCP a very credible opportunity to gain any real concrete opinion on the direction of DCI (just as the Chicago Cubs do not consider their fan forums any where near as credible as a true market research survey). What DCI should do (and does, I think) is contact people who purchase their products and poll the people who are their customers. That at least, would be a start.

Also, for what it's worth, a lot of the criticism on here comes from people who are well past their DCI marching age (to put it lightly; and I'm one of those people). It seems clear from advertisements and graphic designs of websites that DCI is looking to target fans mostly of marching age (high school and college students). If that's the case, then trying to gain market research by reading posts by people far past their demographic doesn't seem wise.

Yes, I will admit that there are benefits of DCP as a community. We are ALL passionate about the activity, those of us that marched know that we help out our brothers and sisters; that passion and compassion comes through with donations, sponsors, and other ways of helping those in need. But I think that's where the legitimacy of DCP ends (outside of sharing opinions, debating scores, etc which is legitimately fun but not necessarily productive)

Gee, now I'm really depressed.

BUT WE HAVE THE MOST EXPERIENCE! WE'VE SEEN MORE SHOWS! WE GREW THE ROOTS! WE GIVE MORE MONEY!

<sigh>

I feel better. Old, but better.

[jamesjones0611]

there is NO one director radically looking to change things?

um, maybe not in this year's proposals. But he may have waited before proposing some old ideas again

You have no idea what you're talking about. George doesn't want woodwinds in DCI. He only proposes those radical changes so that the less-radical ones don't seem so crazy.

Heard it from his own mouth.

[IntheMood]

I think that DCP is great for many of the things you list above, and is important for some aspects of our activity. With a small niche activity we have, there truly are not many places that DCI can look to for customer input.

But there is little on here, IMO, to base any kind of substantial market research on. There is no clear data that:

* DCP is filled with the key demographics that DCI is hoping to attract

* people on here truly are customers of DCI. They say they are, but there's no evidence to support it with just a cursory reading of threads

I would suspect market researchers would not consider DCP a very credible opportunity to gain any real concrete opinion on the direction of DCI (just as the Chicago Cubs do not consider their fan forums any where near as credible as a true market research survey). What DCI should do (and does, I think) is contact people who purchase their products and poll the people who are their customers. That at least, would be a start.

Also, for what it's worth, a lot of the criticism on here comes from people who are well past their DCI marching age (to put it lightly; and I'm one of those people). It seems clear from advertisements and graphic designs of websites that DCI is looking to target fans mostly of marching age (high school and college students). If that's the case, then trying to gain market research by reading posts by people far past their demographic doesn't seem wise.

Yes, I will admit that there are benefits of DCP as a community. We are ALL passionate about the activity, those of us that marched know that we help out our brothers and sisters; that passion and compassion comes through with donations, sponsors, and other ways of helping those in need. But I think that's where the legitimacy of DCP ends (outside of sharing opinions, debating scores, etc which is legitimately fun but not necessarily productive)

Thank you for your reply: From my personal experience DCI's customer service sucks. If I am having an issue with the Fan network I have learned to never ask DCI. Their response time is days, here on DCP it is mins. I have seen polls on here that have asked what our ages are. When there was an issue with how the shows were being recorded this year on the fan network if it were not for the root cause discussion that happened on DCP I feel the issue would of not been addressed nor would it of been fixed. (By the way I did not understand what they were talking about. LOL) Over the years I have seen issues talked about on DCP and the next thing you know DCI is talking about that issue. Interesting how some people on here always say no one reads DCP. Really, all I will say about that is maybe those are the people that one may know. From the area that I know, that is just not the case. In a way DCP is like the Enquire, most will not admit to reading the Enquire, yet I once read that they sell millions of copies. In some cases the truth is there you just have to dig through the BS sometimes. There is talk about the Enquire getting a Pulitzer for the John Edwards story they broke.

I may be the only one who thinks this. But DCP has saved this GREAT ACTIVITY OF OURS History and Traditions that would of been lost. Look at all the HOF's that are on here. What a great honor it is for me to message some of the Greats form this Activity. They are the Best of the Best. And we get to talk to them because of DCP. Look what Frank and Fleetwood records are doing for the DCP membership, for free I may add.

People talk about the OC Div. dying a slow death. To me Because of DCP I am thankful that it is only slow. I also feel that because of DCP there is indeed hope for the OC Div. and that one day there will be growth in the fan base and in the OC Div. The OC Corps are embracing the out-reach that DCP provides to our Community.

DCA get's it. They understand the voice that DCI has in our Community. DCP and DCA have put together a great Finals package for us to see for free. Their boards are very active. The DCA Corps use DCP to help them get the word out. I am sure there is one or two of us who do not have the time to go to every Corps website. So we come to DCP. DCP is a catch all for Drum Corps announcements, fundraiser, Corps Reunions, recruiting, ect. Don't get me started about the play by play that we get from Kevin and others at different Shows and Finals.

If DCP was no longer important then why would Mr. Jacobs who is head of marketing for DCI take his time to talk to us here on DCP? To me Mr. Jacobs understands that DCP is a tool that can and must be used for the betterment of our Activity.

As far as marketing goes I see it this way. DCI has two sets of Customers. The internal customer: They are the CMM's who spend their money paying dues and camp fees. We all know that runs into the thousands per person. The external customer: The fans who buy the suvies, Show tickets, donate their time and money. Over the years DCI has taken their eye of the external customer to a degree. Their focus has been the internal customer. I am not saying this is good or bad. I do not have the numbers to prove one way or the other. I am just saying that there needs to be a balance in their approach to both sets of customers. If they need help in finding the balance all one has to do is push away the extreme voices, the solution is here on these boards.

I happen to feel that DCP's influence and voice is becoming stronger in our Activity not weaker.

Thank You to everyone behind the scenes of DCP who make this forum possible to all of us.

Dean

[lindap]

Gee, now I'm really depressed.

BUT WE HAVE THE MOST EXPERIENCE! WE'VE SEEN MORE SHOWS! WE GREW THE ROOTS! WE GIVE MORE MONEY!

<sigh>

I feel better. Old, but better.

Feels good to vent, eh. You'll be OK. No worries.

I'm posting on DCP before I contact 2 drum corps organizations.

I ordered stuff during the holidays, it's been a month! Curious as to which order will be in my mailbox first.

I'm tapping fingers and toes <sigh>

[Jeff Ream]

You have no idea what you're talking about. George doesn't want woodwinds in DCI. He only proposes those radical changes so that the less-radical ones don't seem so crazy.

Heard it from his own mouth.

uh...it's more than just woodwinds. and yes we know he hides behind smoke screens...many of us have called him out on it for years

[JimF-LowBari]

You have no idea what you're talking about. George doesn't want woodwinds in DCI. He only proposes those radical changes so that the less-radical ones don't seem so crazy.

Heard it from his own mouth.

Two thoughts...

Is that why he proposes them again and again and.....

After DCI accepts the "less radical" proposals, the radical ones seem less radical so we'll go for those later.... Thinking using vocals using amps when amps were only going to be used for the pit so bell players could use proper technique.

[BariBrian]

Which, frankly, is almost worse. Instead of armchair QB's you have, as you said, people who participated. Sometimes those people won Championships, sometimes they marched pre-DCI, sometimes in previous decades. The majority of them, however, do NOT currently participate in the activity: there are very few directors, staff members, board members, and current members that participate in the discussions (especially in regards to rules and design). So what we have, are people who think that their own personal experience in the activity gives them the knowledge and experience to believe that they know best way to run DCI (rules changes, scoring, judging, design, etc). And most of the armchair sports fans on forums to claim to know what the TRUE way to play/coach sports it. For example, when the Chargers were upset in the Divisional round, leagues of Charger fans to not immediately hit the internet and state that when the Chargers went to the Super Bowl in 94, THAT was true NFL football and the current edition of the Chargers team isn't "real" NFL football. Sports fans seem to at least know their place in the world: they are generally knowledgeable when it comes to stats, history, etc. but generally don't believe that outdated equipment and strategy are the only "real" incarnations of football.

I think sometimes a little bit of experience is dangerous, as it gives people the perception that they know more than they really do. Until you've sat on the DCI Board, or have been the director of a drum and bugle corps, you don't really have a strong idea of what it takes to run and operate DCI and/or it's member corps. I have ZERO problems with people saying "I don't like amps, I love any key brass, I hate synths, etc." I love debating the merits of all of those things. But when so many people make gross generalizations and spout their own personal opinions as fact/truth, and say nonsense like "synths aren't real drum corps," then the discussion, in my opinion, degrades the legitimacy of this forum.

So, you think that a forum should be used only for praise of the activity, and never any negative opinions from anyone with say, 20 or 30 years of experience with the activity, unless they have sat on a board? If you can't take critics, you are in the wrong activity. Does this mean that only DCI judges have the right to judge music and visual?

When I was in drum and BUGLE corps thousands of years ago. We actually respected the folks that came before us. Revered them in fact. Because they were able to put quality out year after year, without outrageous budgets, without gimicks, without BIG MONEY instructors. My point here is, it seems to me, that those are the very people that DO know how to run a drum corps and the activity in general.

In Keeping with the topic, DCP becomes less important, when opinions of any group are not respected and valued by others. You do not need to agree or even be friends, but repect for others opinions is a must in a forum. The topics are brought up mostly in question form. To expect that only the elete and all knowing will answer the topic, is kinda like throwing a fishing line out expecting ONLY the BIG FISH will bite

Edited January 26, 2010 by BariBrian

[byline]

Gee, now I'm really depressed.

BUT WE HAVE THE MOST EXPERIENCE! WE'VE SEEN MORE SHOWS! WE GREW THE ROOTS! WE GIVE MORE MONEY!

<sigh>

I feel better. Old, but better.

LOL, same here!

[dbc03]

When I was in drum and BUGLE corps thousands of years ago. We actually respected the folks that came before us. Revered them in fact. Because they were able to put quality out year after year, without outrageous budgets, without gimicks, without BIG MONEY instructors. My point here is, it seems to me, that those are the very people that DO know how to run a drum corps and the activity in general.

This boils down to a "Kids today " rant. Which isn't very respectful either... So you want people to respect you when you are disrespectful to them.

Kids today still respect what came before them. They realize that what came before them is the reason they are able to do what they do today. Most of them march because they fell in love with something that came before them.

So stop with the "These disrespectful punks need to respect me!" attitude

[BariBrian]

This boils down to a "Kids today " rant. Which isn't very respectful either... So you want people to respect you when you are disrespectful to them.

Kids today still respect what came before them. They realize that what came before them is the reason they are able to do what they do today. Most of them march because they fell in love with something that came before them.

So stop with the "These disrespectful punks need to respect me!" attitude

Actually,,If you had taken the time to read what I was responding too. You'll see that I was not doing that at all. Far from it. I have said hundreds of times that this is your time not ours. I have NO problems with Kids today at all. Just the ONE person that I was resonding to. For that matter, I don't have a problem there either. Just what they were saying about all of people out here that think we have a right to an opinion

Drum corp people of today are exactly that. I respect them and what they are trying to accomplish, and I go to shows. I don't try to run things and my opinion is just that, my opinion.

Please read everything, if your going to make an assumption about where I'm going and what I'm about. Thank You and have a good day.

Just for the record, I need no respect from anyone out there, but for the most part, I have tremendous respect for those out there that share their opinions without the need to acttack anyone, which is a majority

Edited January 26, 2010 by BariBrian