Misdirected Hostility

[Room_101]

why are the BD fans so angry at everyone? You have a drum corps that just won by 2+ points over another very good drum corps. Your corps hasn't lost a show in a long time. You have the most championships. You have the most high brass trophies. Yet you still feel the need to take shots at other people.

Shouldn't you just sit back, smile, and enjoy?

Do random people's opinion on the internet really get you so worked up?

I think this is the real misdirected hostility.

So, I humbly ask... why so angry?

I have decided to stay out of this thread...until I read this point.

As someone with contacts in all of the "Top 6" and most of the "Top 12," I'm just completely lost at the fact that this entire thread was started by "former BD bari."

In regards to hostility:

Let's just forget about the words thrown by a certain blue team against the 2001 winning team...words I certainly wouldn't want my daughter to hear.

Let's just forget about the words thrown by a certain blue team against the score of the 2002 winning team

Let's just forget about the words thrown by a certain 2003 winning team against a certain green team (we can even ignore the blue team's actions the night they overtook the green team in Indy, if you like)

Let's just forget about the words thrown by a certain blue team against the 2004 winning team

In 2005, they behaved themselves...probably because they didn't have much on the field to back them up

Let's just forget about the COUNTLESS MEDALS thrown by a certain blue team towards the 2006 silver medalist (I also heard they gave a certain green team a good tongue-lashing at San Antonio encore in 2006...that is, until the scores were announced, and this certain blue team never spoke another word the rest of the night...talk about tail between your legs)

Let's just forget about certain blue team alumni TAUNTING MULTIPLE OTHER TOP FIVE CORPS IN 2007 AT THEIR WARM-UP two out of the three nights

Let's just forget about the COUNTLESS MORE MEDALS thrown by a certain blue team towards the 2008 champion...the same corps from 2006

I would agree, there IS some misdirected hostility in this activity.

Congratulations to all corps last night. This continues to be the most interesting season in a long time!

Edited July 11, 2010 by Room_101

[Plan9]

Just because the judges scored it the way they did doesn't mean it's right. And coming on here feeding the frenzy with your gloating isn't helping matters either.

Honestly, I expected BD to win this show, but I can't say I expected them to win by so much. Maybe they are THAT good. I can't really say though because I only saw the show from the video which doesn't really do it justice. I can't say I can be mad at BD for winning the show or ###### off at the judges for scoring it the way they did. What I can say is that the best corps won last night according to the judges and it's nothing really to get to bent out of shape about right now. There's still time left in the season. Now when the season is over, THEN I'll be ###### lol..

And to the BD fans, I accept your win right now. "Plan9", I am still gonna hold out so that YOU'LL be doing those pushups in Indianapolis.

You know 2000C, if u could point me to the gloating part I might understand. That was presumed by one of the usual suspect, but I can't find it. Besides...gloating is wholly uncool and not what BD would approve.

As far as cadets last night, my guess is they have individual performance work to do.(like everyone else), but that is very fixable. My guess is the cadets staff is listening to tapes, and working to clean. I may end up doing push ups before finals, but for now......

[ShortAndFast]

I would suggest changing GE so it more accurately reflects the audience. BD (and some others, to lesser extent) has become very good at 'playing to the sheets'. However, much like teachers that teach to a standardized test, just because students did well on a test, does not mean that the best possible education was provided, especially if the test was flawed. Need a more 'accurate' test.

Anyways, hell, if you made it all about technical stuff, BD probably wins just as much if not more. I dont always like what they do, but what they do, they do very, very well.

BD designs to win - their designs reflects what they believe will be rewarded by the judges. Especially in the visual captions, they've gotten it exactly right the last few years. If the judges start looking for something different, BD will change their shows to ones that max out the new criteria.

I definitely am interested to see what comes of Cesario's promised review of the adjudication criteria.

[2000Cadet]

BD designs to win - their designs reflects what they believe will be rewarded by the judges. Especially in the visual captions, they've gotten it exactly right the last few years. If the judges start looking for something different, BD will change their shows to ones that max out the new criteria.

I definitely am interested to see what comes of Cesario's promised review of the adjudication criteria.

Honestly I hope there are no changes just to appease the masses so our corps can win. Then it'll be useless in my opinion. Just make sure it's fair. And if it already is, then I'm cool with it.

[boxingfred]

I liked and sometimes loved Blue Devils from 1975-2006. Then they went all BOA/WGI on me. But, Give them credit. Their staff knows what the judges like. And that wins championships.

[drummer5485]

Let's just forget about the words thrown by a certain blue team against the 2004 winning team

Let's just forget about the COUNTLESS MEDALS thrown by a certain blue team towards the 2006 silver medalist (I also heard they gave a certain green team a good tongue-lashing at San Antonio encore in 2006...that is, until the scores were announced, and this certain blue team never spoke another word the rest of the night...talk about tail between your legs)

Both of these happened...San Antonio was hilarious btw.

[LoveKathyG]

It's like any other sport or competitive activity. The minute you become #1 you become the one to BEAT. There's a target on your chest and it can get pretty big and heavy sometimes, but in all honesty I've never seen a corps win that sucked.

Mmm... Not really. The animosity toward BD in the 2000's and Cadets in the 1980's is different. It's not just about people wanting to take down #1. If your hypothesis were the true, then the BD dynasty of the '70s and '80s would have been equally hated, and they weren't. If you were right, then people would have been rooting against the Cadets in the '90s and early 2000's, and they weren't (though it's not arguably that fans were rooting against Hopkins).

And the most glaring example that disproves your theory - SCV in the '70s and '80s. They have never been hated the way BD and Cadets have in different eras.

The answer is really very simple. Fans hate these corps because they perceive these corps are dismissive of their wants and preferences. (I'm not going to get into arguing whether BD and Cadets really ARE dismissive of their fans. I'm just saying that's the perception.) To go further, fans perceive BD's and Cadets' motivation for being dismissive to be different. With Cadets, especially in the '80s, the resentment was due to the feeling that Cadets were being artistically arrogant...forcing the average fan to experience something he/she didn't understand or like. The fans didn't want to take the medicine, even if the Cadets (or at least their leadership) said it was good for them.

With BD, the resentment is connected to the perception that BD's #1 goal is to win at all costs and that they will do whatever they must to whore themselves to the judges. This is a longstanding complaint about BD, but the hatred has never come to a head this way because they haven't had this kind of dominance since the '80s...and arguably they've NEVER had this kind of dominance since SCV and Cadets were always challenging them in the '80s. The issue now is that fans believe BD has so effectively ingraciated itself to judges and to the scoring system that the there's really no one being allowed to challenge them. And bottom line, the feeling from the fans is that this perceived approach by BD is tantamount to turning their backs on the average fan.

Putting it simply from my point of view, I'm just frustrated with BD. This could be a very enjoyable show, but it's not. Their chop shop, close-it-in approach to drum corps bores me. And what exacerbates the situation is that they have inserted snippets of very enjoyable past BD shows, which you want to engage with and immerse yourself in, but you can't because there's never more than a minute's worth of anything. But this approach is lauded in the scoring system. It's what works. So yes...I suppose you can blame the judges for awarding this approach. But you can also blame BD because they know they're alienating a lot of fans and they continue to do what they're doing.

And guess what? Judges don't have fans. The corps do. So my argument, in response to the OP, would be that BD does, indeed, have some responsibility here. Judges...not so much.

[ShortAndFast]

Honestly I hope there are no changes just to appease the masses so our corps can win. Then it'll be useless in my opinion. Just make sure it's fair. And if it already is, then I'm cool with it.

There are probably a lot of judging criteria - including the current one - that would be "fair". But I do think that the two effect captions have become somewhat esoteric - I find it much harder to understand GE scores and spreads than I do, say, brass scores - and could use some rework.

The bottom line of DCI show design seems to be that you get more of whatever gets rewarded. So if DCI wants to have more shows that are both technically excellent and audience-appealing, then they should tweak the system to reward that combination more.

[2000Cadet]

You know 2000C, if u could point me to the gloating part I might understand. That was presumed by one of the usual suspect, but I can't find it. Besides...gloating is wholly uncool and not what BD would approve.

As far as cadets last night, my guess is they have individual performance work to do.(like everyone else), but that is very fixable. My guess is the cadets staff is listening to tapes, and working to clean. I may end up doing push ups before finals, but for now......

At the risk of being suspended from this site, I'm not going to point to anything specific.

But anyway, I agree about what you said as far as Cadets having individual performance issues because I could definitely hear it on the webcast. I'm just hoping you will be the one doing those pushups.

[BRASSO]

I have decided to stay out of this thread...until I read this point.

As someone with contacts in all of the "Top 6" and most of the "Top 12," I'm just completely lost at the fact that this entire thread was started by "former BD bari."

In regards to hostility:

Let's just forget about the words thrown by a certain blue team against the 2001 winning team...words I certainly wouldn't want my daughter to hear.

Let's just forget about the words thrown by a certain blue team against the score of the 2002 winning team

Let's just forget about the words thrown by a certain 2003 winning team against a certain green team (we can even ignore the blue team's actions the night they overtook the green team in Indy, if you like)

Let's just forget about the words thrown by a certain blue team against the 2004 winning team

In 2005, they behaved themselves...probably because they didn't have much on the field to back them up

Let's just forget about the COUNTLESS MEDALS thrown by a certain blue team towards the 2006 silver medalist (I also heard they gave a certain green team a good tongue-lashing at San Antonio encore in 2006...that is, until the scores were announced, and this certain blue team never spoke another word the rest of the night...talk about tail between your legs)

Let's just forget about certain blue team alumni TAUNTING MULTIPLE OTHER TOP FIVE CORPS IN 2007 AT THEIR WARM-UP two out of the three nights

Let's just forget about the COUNTLESS MORE MEDALS thrown by a certain blue team towards the 2008 champion...the same corps from 2006

I would agree, there IS some misdirected hostility in this activity.

Congratulations to all corps last night. This continues to be the most interesting season in a long time!

Congratulations to the 2010 Blue Devils in their convincing win last night scoring an impressive 88.