Would you walk away if DCI shows were like in the 80s and 90s

[Jeff Ream]

IIRC, one of the "reasons" given for more toys (forget if if it was voice, electronics or sumthin' else) was that the designers are running out of ideas to keep things fresh/new/relevant/whatever. IOW - no limitations... we need new STUFF...

Yeah, one thing I was proud about corps was that we could make beautiful music with the limitations of horns and drums only, basically 2 valves and way the horns were made.

and i've said all along then, maybe it was time for new designers. remember, they said all these toys would bring new fans in too.

[davidp]

Wasn't one of the main objectives of drum corps, back in the day (I'm beginning to hate that phrase ), to give kids something to do, and keep them off the street ("a kid who blows a horn will never blow a safe"), and teach music and marching (I may not have phrased that exactly right, but hopefully you get my question)? They weren't going for college-quality musicianship (although many corps alums went on to successful collegiate and professional musical careers), it was to help the kids. Nowadays, and correct me if I'm wrong, the typical "kid" is a 19-20 year old college music major, an already accomplished musician, who may travel thousands of miles just to audition and practice with a corps. Gone are the days of a corps of some kind in nearly every town, and competitions at every level. "Kids" who don't make the Cadets/BD/Cavies/Phantom/SCV, etc., wouldn't stoop so low as to march with a local OC corps, or even a semi-local DCA corps. And a lot of "real" kids, age 14-18, wouldn't even consider marching corps, in light of the fact that their high school BOA fees are similar to those of DCI corps (and they can't afford to do both), and also the thought that since they're going up against those other "kids," they don't stand a chance.

The sad thing is that nobody has stepped up to form more corps, local corps that may or may not compete on a national scale, and that no one has stepped up to come up with an alternative to DCI (strictly junior, as opposed to DCI), that would be more sensible, foster more localization of corps (as well as drawing away those in DCI who don't like what's going on), and perhaps cater to the "purist" by offering more "tradtional" rules and such. There's no law anywhere that states that DCI has to be the only junior corps association, is there?

Sorry for the long post. I never marched, I'm just a fan, a frustrated fan.

[perc2100]

and i've said all along then, maybe it was time for new designers. remember, they said all these toys would bring new fans in too.

Funny thing, though: the new designers are the ones bringing in/championing the new toys.

[MikeD]

let me ask a serious question to then. What can you do? if people walk away because they hate the changes, isn't that a sign?

If a few people 'walk away' it's a sign of what? It's a sign that those few people can't adapt to changes, that's all. It's happened throughout drum corps history. Plenty of legacy fans remain...because they enjoy drum corps of 2010.

you can petition the BOD. been done, been laughed at. You can rant on here, but if you still go, they still get your money.

short of a massive boycott and affecting their wallets, .

well the fan base that remains

They laughed? I thought the petition was given a hearing at he DCI meeting.

As for a boycott...just maybe the majority of the fan base actually likes what they see and hear. Why boycott something you enjoy?

[MikeD]

Jeff, you bring not only a great question, but THE question. Mulling it over, however gives me a headache. I don't believe than ANY of the upper echelon corps will return to an older style because bucking the established norm in almost ANY activity will get you burned. Also, while a major boycott would hurt DCI where it counts, in the wallet, it would also hurt the current marching members. Do we call it "tough love" and stay away? Shrugging our shoulders and blindly following drum corps into even further obscurity and eventual disappearance is not acceptable either.

Maybe staying away is the answer. As a father, I look out for what I believe is my kids' best interests. I may have to intervene by either doing something or not doing something to teach them an important lesson. To guide them in the right direction. Is this the approach to take? Do we simply boycott one show (maybe Finals week?), one season or just not go back until changes are made? Doing so may hurt me more than the activity, but then again, isn't that what "tough love" is all about?

I don't possess the vision of how the activity should move forward. While I would definitely prefer to see many changes revoked, I also think that changes in the way we do things will move the activity forward.

I would like to propose a summit meeting of sorts. We would have to organize, come up with a specific agenda (more then "to save drum corps") and plan action from there. Would such a thing be possible? I would like to find out.

Considering the great experiences a marching member receives in drum corps, do you really think the addition of a mic or a guitar is something that diminishes that experience for your child? That somehow makes the experience dangerous enough that you should remove your child from marching? Something you should boycott?

[supersop]

Funny thing, though: the new designers are the ones bringing in/championing the new toys.

Where I firmly believe new talent is needed is in the chief judges positions for each caption. Afterall, those are the individuals who set the criteria for what is good and what is not good in their respective field of "expertise". So here is who I nominate for Judging caption heads within DCI.

Music Effect - ME! or J.D. Shaw

Music Execution - ME! or Wayne Downey

Music Ensemble - ME! or maybe Michael Boo

Visual Effect - ME! or Marc Sylvester

Visual Execution - ME! or Todd Ryan

Visual Ensemble - ME! .... or maybe Kevin Gamin

Percussion Field - NOT ME! or Tom Float

Color Guard -ANYONE BUT ME! or Scott Chandler

[supersop]

If a few people 'walk away' it's a sign of what? It's a sign that those few people can't adapt to changes, that's all. It's happened throughout drum corps history. Plenty of legacy fans remain...because they enjoy drum corps of 2010.

They laughed? I thought the petition was given a hearing at he DCI meeting.

As for a boycott...just maybe the majority of the fan base actually likes what they see and hear. Why boycott something you enjoy?

Please define Plenty and Majority!

Then please follow up your definitions with hard data that can quantify your assertions.

[MikeD]

Please define Plenty and Majority!

Then please follow up your definitions with hard data that can quantify your assertions.

Why? Just go to a show and look at the people...a mix of new and legacy fans. Is that 'hard data'? No. It's MHO from seeing in person and reading DCP.

Majority? Did more than half the audience stop attending in 2004 when amps were legalized? I believe DCI released attendance numbers through 2007 at least...and the numbers with amps at least remained strong.

[supersop]

Why? Just go to a show and look at the people...a mix of new and legacy fans. Is that 'hard data'? No. It's MHO from seeing in person and reading DCP.

Majority? Did more than half the audience stop attending in 2004 when amps were legalized? I believe DCI released attendance numbers through 2007 at least...and the numbers with amps at least remained strong.

Do you have data that more than half the audience prior to the changes of 2000 were Legacy fans? Do you have data that more than half of them stayed? MHO is that MHO should be in your posts without constantly throwing around words that imply truth based on facts. It's been going on for a few years now and nobody ever calls you on it except for me, Ream and 1 or 2 others. Yet that doesn't stop you from holding to your guns.

Your Opinion is your opinion and that's perfectly fine. When it's never stated as just your opinion and continuously rammed down our throats as the all knowing truth doesn't help your cause Mike. It just makes us who see the bigger picture shake our heads and pray that those reading your posts are doing the same rather than drinking your kool-aid.

Three things to consider in these types of subjects where there are differing opinions.

1) common sense

2) opinions

3) facts

1 out of 3 is bad

In my case ... 2 out of 3 ain't so bad.

[skewerz]

Why? Just go to a show and look at the people...a mix of new and legacy fans. Is that 'hard data'? No. It's MHO from seeing in person and reading DCP.

Majority? Did more than half the audience stop attending in 2004 when amps were legalized? I believe DCI released attendance numbers through 2007 at least...and the numbers with amps at least remained strong.

wait...EVERY TIME anyone else (dino) says majority and plenty we get scoffed at for having no "hard" data, even if it's a poll with "real" numbers. I can almost understand your viewpoint of drum corps, but don't tarnish it with hypocrisy...

I looked up at the crowd after several shows that I thought boring this year, and the crowd around me reflected the same response..can I use that as "majority"?