BOA Grand Nationals

[bawker]

It's like saying the Madison Scouts had some platforms, had a lot of Tubas and played loud.

That's pretty much what Madison did, though.

[Lance]

This is a very watered down and generic description of the show and leaves a ton of insight out. It's like saying the Madison Scouts had some platforms, had a lot of Tubas and played loud. You really have to see it to get it all.

sorry. i got it all. the things i mentioned were what stuck out to me. the field looked like a huge mess to me with all of the tarps. there was some playing and marching, rarely at the same time. it ended with a guy taking a flying leap off a platform.

obviously a lot of people love it. i'm just one who doesn't. dci isn't there yet...

[N.E. Brigand]

The point is that some people find something very appealing about specific kinds of instrumentation presented in specific ways. ...

It appears that you define evolution as being in support of doing whatever you want to do, without any criteria that identifies an ensemble as a particular kind of performance group. Some people don't want that at the expense of losing an already established, specific, unique kind of performance ensemble. ...

When people go to see/hear a barbershop quartet, they don't want to see eight or more people creating a heavy metal rock presentation, fully plugged in with maximum cranked volume levels, then justifying it as the evolution of a barbershop quartet. At some point, that group ceases to be what they purport themselves to be...

The problem comes when the barbershop quartet (four guys singing harmony without aid of any instruments) no longer exists, because the "evolved" version (the hard core, heavy metal ensemble of eight) has taken its place.

This is basically my position, as well.

[Lance]

That's pretty much what Madison did, though.

i didn't want to say it.

[jwscv87]

For me, the drum corps elitism I carried, we all carried, with respect to our superiority over marching band had very little to do with the quality of performance of the very best marching bands versus the very best drum corps. There were a LOT more drum corps back in the day and therefore many more marching members. The vast majority of us did not come from a great marching band, we came from your average mediocre to crappy local band program. Some came off the streets to learn an instrument. In my mind what separated my drum corps experience from my band experience was the commitment to the group that the average member of a corps displayed versus that of average band member. Band was about football games, parades, field shows were cool, but the commitment to trying to achieve greatness was not there. Drum corps was entirely different. Even in the tiny, very young drum corps I began with we had 12 adn 13 year olds that displayed a commitment and work ethic not seen in any marching band I had participated in. There were some great, great marching bands in the 80s too, but they were not the baseline most thought of in contrasting corps versus band. They were outliers.

The superior (in my opinion) instrumentation of corps versus band was certainly a factor as well. For those of us in small corps the excellence of the top corps gave us something to aspire to be that a marching band simply could not offer - not even the best bands. I never carried any inherent disdain for band. I marched every year in high school, but everyday at rehearsal I longed for it to be more like corps and I acted as a cheerleader to try to get everyone to take it as seriously, but never got there...

I also never felt like drum corps and band had to be different. I certainly did not like the idea of corps becoming bands (i.e. woodwinds, Big 10 and/or Grambling marching style, etc.). However, if a band wanted to become more like corps - go for it!

[Catan]

sorry. i got it all. the things i mentioned were what stuck out to me. the field looked like a huge mess to me with all of the tarps. there was some playing and marching, rarely at the same time. it ended with a guy taking a flying leap off a platform.

obviously a lot of people love it. i'm just one who doesn't. dci isn't there yet...

I am sorry, that comment is a gross exaggeration. Tarpon definitely did march and play simultaneously for a large part of the show (especially the woodwinds in the opener) at brisk tempos. Most of the time they weren't "marching and playing", the members were executing very complex body movement while playing difficult parts at the same time (woodwinds/trombones in closer). The only real time they stopped moving was for a brief period in the ballad in which the played their instruments while laying down, which was a beautiful effect.

I also agree with the people who have stated that they do not wish for DCI to go this route. I want the two activities distinct, as much as I enjoy Tarpon's style of programming. I just don't like it when people bash BOA bands with unsubstantiated comments...

[Jeff Ream]

That's pretty much what Madison did, though.

and got mid show standing O's at finals

[Lance]

I am sorry, that comment is a gross exaggeration. Tarpon definitely did march and play simultaneously for a large part of the show (especially the woodwinds in the opener) at brisk tempos. Most of the time they weren't "marching and playing", the members were executing very complex body movement while playing difficult parts at the same time (woodwinds/trombones in closer).

i think that's a gross exaggeration. I won't go your route and say that what you're saying isn't unbstantiated, it's your opinion. nothing more, and nothing less. so is what I said.

i'm sorry you don't like it.

good for groups like tarpon, though. they're great at what they're doing.

[audiodb]

I don't understand why there really has to be "clearly distinguishable differences". Does that mean high schools "MUST" use woodwinds? Does that mean drum corps "SHOULDN'T" use Synths and microphones? I mean, none of the characteristics we see can be completely distinguished from drum corps and marching band. It’s all just one thing: Marching Music.

No - drum corps and marching band are distinctly different activities, and always have been.

When we try to force the two apart by arbitrarily limiting what marching band and drum corps should do then you’re not helping the activity evolve! If we had done that from the beginning, and FORCED certain ideas on drum corps and marching band then DCI and BOA would never have existed! They would still only be small local bands in Parades! (nothing wrong with that just saying) No field shows at all.

Why must there be segregation? And why must it be forced?

Perhaps you're new to all this, and really have no concept of the history. Drum corps and marching band have not been "forced" apart....they developed separately.

Marching band is precisely what the name says....taking a "band", typically an indoor and stationary performing group, and having it "march". As most marching bands are scholastic groups, their instrumentation is based upon what the scholastic band programs use - traditionally, brass, woodwinds and percussion. As bands sometimes incorporate other devices like strings, electronics or voice, so do marching bands.

Drum corps was developed by veterans' organizations, and thus was designed in military fashion. This meant that the devices chosen (bugles, drums, flags) were military signaling devices, designed for optimum effect and practicality in outdoor/field usage. This also meant that the drum corps, typically sponsored by a local post of one of these veterans' organizations, had to be run on a limited budget.

As these activities evolved, most of their changes still reflect their founding and lasting philosophies. Drum corps are still independent organizations that must be mobile, yet cost-effective, and they still equip and design for performances in outdoor/field venues. Marching bands are still predominantly outgrowths of scholastic music programs, and thus still generally seek to employ the same kids and instrument types they have year-round.

Leave it to the marching music designers and instructors to decide what they want to put in their show.

So you didn't want ideas "forced" on us, then one sentence later, you do....as long as the designers get to do the forcing.

If they want to please the fans, let them. If they want to be experimental, let them. If they want to be traditional, let them. If they want to use woodwinds, no drumline, all guard, synths and micrphones galor let them. WHO CARES?!

The fans care. The show sponsors care. The corps directors care. Basically, the people responsible for making drum corps a financially viable activity, and their customer base....they care. And since drum corps doesn't have scholastic funding to support it, the input of corps directors and their customer base is necessary to en$ure that the activity continues in a viable direction.

[SynthLine09]

This really comes as no secret to me. I've found for the last decade that usually the top 3-6 (give or take, depending on the year) BOA bands are usually more entertaining or as entertaining as several DCI groups in the same year.

When I watch a group like Tarpon, Bell, or Avon, I don't think "oh man, they have woodwinds- I dont like this." (or something along those lines,its an exaggeration I know.) I think "man, this is entertaining/cool as hell."

Another thought of mine....Madison 2010 was easily one of my favorite shows of the year. I think a lot of what made it entertaining was the performance level of the group. Had an in your face typical fast and loud show such as this been programmed for a successful BOA band, I don't think it would be nearly as entertaining for obvious reasons. This is why High school bands rely on more intellectual elements to make their shows successful, I think. Just my 2 cents.