tesmusic Posted December 22, 2016 Share Posted December 22, 2016 I posted within other threads on DCP that Intellectual Property ownership is an Inalienable Right bestowed by our Creator and not something granted to us by any government; but I was also ridiculed and called a tin-hat wearing buffoon. Our creator? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeN Posted December 22, 2016 Share Posted December 22, 2016 The language within the clause dealing with how long the time limit of exclusivity should be was meant to be vague so that it could be adjusted as needed. For example: exclusivity remaining for a time period after death was, in part, implemented not only to allow bequeath-ownership to a family member but also to discourage people from knocking-off the original author/composer in order to get their work quicker into the public domain. I had not considered that, but now I cannot banish the image of composers stalking each other in dark alleys. Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stu Posted December 22, 2016 Share Posted December 22, 2016 Our creator? "We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed." - The Declaration of Independence. Thus our Rights are endowed to us by the Creator of all mankind; i.e. 'Our' Creator. Also, notice that the term 'among these' precedes the three Rights mentioned which indicates that there are other unalienable Rights from our Creator besides those mentioned; which includes Property as described by John Locke and most all of the Founding Fathers who also subscribed to the philosophy of Enlightenment. A person today can maintain that they were wrong.in their beliefs. but it would be an error to state that the Founders of the United States of America did not believe that our Rights are unalienable and originate from our Creator. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kamarag Posted December 22, 2016 Share Posted December 22, 2016 (edited) "We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed." - The Declaration of Independence. Thus our Rights are endowed to us by the Creator of all mankind; i.e. 'Our' Creator. Also, notice that the term 'among these' precedes the three Rights mentioned which indicates that there are other unalienable Rights from our Creator besides those mentioned; which includes Property as described by John Locke and most all of the Founding Fathers who also subscribed to the philosophy of Enlightenment. A person today can maintain that they were wrong.in their beliefs. but it would be an error to state that the Founders of the United States of America did not believe that our Rights are unalienable and originate from our Creator. Copyright isn't a right granted to you by any deity, magical sky fairy, or The Universe™. It's a right granted to you by society. That's why the law regarding copyright varies from country to country, It's not a matter of philosophy, it's a matter of man-made law. Fun fact: Your quote comes from the Declaration of Independence, which has absolutely no bearing or standing on current US law. An awesomely written break-up letter? Absolutely. But a legal document it isn't. Edited December 22, 2016 by Kamarag 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tesmusic Posted December 22, 2016 Share Posted December 22, 2016 Copyright isn't a right granted to you by any deity, magical sky fairy, or The Universe. It's a right granted to you by society. That's why the law regarding copyright varies from country to country, It's not a matter of philosophy, it's a matter of man-made law. Fun fact: Your quote comes from the Declaration of Independence, which has absolutely no bearing standing on current US law. An awesomely written break-up letter? Absolutely. But a legal document it isn't. Exactly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeD Posted December 22, 2016 Share Posted December 22, 2016 Copyright isn't a right granted to you by any deity, magical sky fairy, or The Universe™. I think it is granted by.... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tesmusic Posted December 22, 2016 Share Posted December 22, 2016 I think it is granted by.... I stand corrected. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eleran Posted December 22, 2016 Share Posted December 22, 2016 "We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed." - The Declaration of Independence. Thus our Rights are endowed to us by the Creator of all mankind; i.e. 'Our' Creator. Also, notice that the term 'among these' precedes the three Rights mentioned which indicates that there are other unalienable Rights from our Creator besides those mentioned; which includes Property as described by John Locke and most all of the Founding Fathers who also subscribed to the philosophy of Enlightenment. A person today can maintain that they were wrong.in their beliefs. but it would be an error to state that the Founders of the United States of America did not believe that our Rights are unalienable and originate from our Creator. If you really want to cite the Declaration and the Founding Fathers as evidence of your claim that intellectual property is divinely given, then I think a review of the actual thoughts on the subject held by the actual author of the Declaration s warranted: It has been pretended by some, (and in England especially,) that inventors have a natural and exclusive right to their inventions, and not merely for their own lives, but inheritable to their heirs. But while it is a moot question whether the origin of any kind of property is derived from nature at all, it would be singular to admit a natural and even an hereditary right to inventors. It is agreed by those who have seriously considered the subject, that no individual has, of natural right, a separate property in an acre of land, for instance. By an universal law, indeed, whatever, whether fixed or movable, belongs to all men equally and in common, is the property for the moment of him who occupies it, but when he relinquishes the occupation, the property goes with it. Stable ownership is the gift of social law, and is given late in the progress of society. It would be curious then, if an idea, the fugitive fermentation of an individual brain, could, of natural right, be claimed in exclusive and stable property. If nature has made any one thing less susceptible than all others of exclusive property, it is the action of the thinking power called an idea, which an individual may exclusively possess as long as he keeps it to himself; but the moment it is divulged, it forces itself into the possession of every one, and the receiver cannot dispossess himself of it. Its peculiar character, too, is that no one possesses the less, because every other possesses the whole of it. He who receives an idea from me, receives instruction himself without lessening mine; as he who lights his taper at mine, receives light without darkening me. That ideas should freely spread from one to another over the globe, for the moral and mutual instruction of man, and improvement of his condition, seems to have been peculiarly and benevolently designed by nature, when she made them, like fire, expansible over all space, without lessening their density in any point, and like the air in which we breathe, move, and have our physical being, incapable of confinement or exclusive appropriation. Inventions then cannot, in nature, be a subject of property. Society may give an exclusive right to the profits arising from them, as an encouragement to men to pursue ideas which may produce utility, but this may or may not be done, according to the will and convenience of the society, without claim or complaint from anybody. Accordingly, it is a fact, as far as I am informed, that England was, until we copied her, the only country on earth which ever, by a general law, gave a legal right to the exclusive use of an idea. In some other countries it is sometimes done, in a great case, and by a special and personal act, but, generally speaking, other nations have thought that these monopolies produce more embarrassment than advantage to society; and it may be observed that the nations which refuse monopolies of invention, are as fruitful as England in new and useful devices. - Thomas Jefferson, in a letter to Isaac McPherson, August 13, 1813 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xandandl Posted December 22, 2016 Share Posted December 22, 2016 Depending whether you consider yourself a Whig or Federalist, this might be getting a wee bit political. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xandandl Posted December 22, 2016 Share Posted December 22, 2016 (edited) I think it is granted by.... Figures. You teach in one of those secularist institutions, a public school. no? Edited December 22, 2016 by xandandl Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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