Will The G7 Split From DCI?

[Fred Windish]

Patronizing is not the kind of "sanity" I'm comfortable with, that's all. This whole thing has an enormous "ego satisfaction" component that needs to be challenged, curtailed. I hate bullies, and do fight back.

[garfield]

Patronizing is not the kind of "sanity" I'm comfortable with, that's all. This whole thing has an enormous "ego satisfaction" component that needs to be challenged, curtailed. I hate bullies, and do fight back.

Really, Fred, it's not about patronizing (even if DCI does take that track). For Brasso and me, it's about finding the horse.

It's possible that all this teeth-knashing will change the minds of the G7 and we'll all stay one, big, happy family. But, if not...

...there's a horse in there.

[Fred Windish]

Maybe I'm stupid, but the "patronizing" 'i'm concerned with does NOT come from DCI. DCI has been willing to work with whoever shows up for their championship and assist those who would like to show up. It's always been open to what happens on the field, not just on the phone. An elitist group is emerging here and that's NOT something that should be accommodated by the DCI I've known.

[Jeff Ream]

we have a precedent in this....Notre Dame.

Notre Dame elite football program stays independent because the dopes in the Big East allowed ND to keep their non revenue sports in the Big East. Hows that worked out for the Big East ? Then when the Big East looks to implode, Notre Dame then stays independent in football, but the Athletic Coast Conference ( ACC) allows Notre Dame to come into their league.. but partially... keeping their elite, revenue producing, football program independent and outside the ACC, and makes the same mistake the Big East does,by taking in Notre Dame's non revenue sports teams. Hows that working out for the ACC at the moment as well ?

Now... if DCI wants to make the same mistake that both the Big East and the ACC have done... allow BD to go independent with their elite corps, but park their organization's non revenue producing Corps in DCI,... then that'd be a huge mistake too imo. But my guess, the DCI Executive Board of Directors and the DCI membership itself will not permit this partial membership...but who really knows.

well...while under the BD umbrella, BDB, and SCVC under the SCV umbrella are seperate corps. I'd imagine any membership fees are paid for each of these corps as well as he parent.

My hunch...BD and SCV load up the cadet corps to make them as good as the WC versions we see now, while having their super corps which probably has fewer size and age restrictions given what some of the G7 have been clamoring for for years

[MotoSurfBass]

If the split happens, corps "traditionally below" the G7 have an instant increase in Competitive Inertia since 7 slots have been cleared ahead of them! Boston's chances of winning the DCI Championship that year will increase dramatically.

It also means that the G7 will create an entirely new class of champion.

Project that over the next 10 years: Madison will likely increase its DCI Champ count. There will be new DCI champs. Corps like Bluecoats and Crown will never be able to claim they've won a DCI Championship, but they might win one of the new titles. The other 5 G7 will have both kinds of titles.

How will corps move from DCI to MIM and vice versa? Will corps with large orgs produce both kinds? (BD, SCV, Yea!)

I dunno, sounds kind of exciting to me.

Funny you mention competitive inertia... Just for ##### and giggles, I went to corpsreps.com and figured out what every DCI Finals would look like without any of the G7 corps. I won't post the whole shebang here, but some fun little facts:

-Madison becomes the new BD, winning 17 of the 41 championships, finshing 2nd or 3rd in 15 other seasons, and being the only corps to make all 41 finals.

-Boston is second in both championships (6) and medals (13), despite doing neither until 2000.

-The Crossmen still don't have a championship, but have been to Finals more times than any other corps besides Madison, and have 5 silver medals and 7 bronze medals.

-Star of Indiana pulls off a 5-peat from 1989-1993, with 1993's 97.3 being the highest score in DCI history.

-Four other corps win multiple championships: Glassmen have 3, and Blue Knights, 27th Lancers, and Blue Stars all have 2.

-In addition to the Anaheim Kingsmen, Spirit of Atlanta, Troopers, and Suncoast Sound all have one trophy to their name.

-Corps that have won medals but not championships (besides Crossmen): Colts, Bridgemen, Velvet Knights, Magic of Orlando, and Muchachos.

-Most Finals appearances without a medal? The Freelancers, who would make finals 16 times.

-With the G7, Southwind has never made DCI Finals. Without the G7, Southwind is a 10-time Finalist.

-If they are still in DCI, both Vanguard Cadets (2000) and Blue Devils B (2011) make one Finals appearance each.

Edited November 28, 2012 by Dave
filter circumvention - ds

[BRASSO]

Funny you mention competitive inertia... Just for s**ts and giggles, I went to corpsreps.com and figured out what every DCI Finals would look like without any of the G7 corps. I won't post the whole shebang here, but some fun little facts:

-Madison becomes the new BD, winning 17 of the 41 championships, finshing 2nd or 3rd in 15 other seasons, and being the only corps to make all 41 finals.

-Boston is second in both championships (6) and medals (13), despite doing neither until 2000.

-The Crossmen still don't have a championship, but have been to Finals more times than any other corps besides Madison, and have 5 silver medals and 7 bronze medals.

-Star of Indiana pulls off a 5-peat from 1989-1993, with 1993's 97.3 being the highest score in DCI history.

-Four other corps win multiple championships: Glassmen have 3, and Blue Knights, 27th Lancers, and Blue Stars all have 2.

-In addition to the Anaheim Kingsmen, Spirit of Atlanta, Troopers, and Suncoast Sound all have one trophy to their name.

-Corps that have won medals but not championships (besides Crossmen): Colts, Bridgemen, Velvet Knights, Magic of Orlando, and Muchachos.

-Most Finals appearances without a medal? The Freelancers, who would make finals 16 times.

-With the G7, Southwind has never made DCI Finals. Without the G7, Southwind is a 10-time Finalist.

-If they are still in DCI, both Vanguard Cadets (2000) and Blue Devils B (2011) make one Finals appearance each.

haha... good stuff.. it was for sheets and giggles like you said, but fun to take a look at it.

[N.E. Brigand]

Personally, I'm a fan of Excellence. I'll spend my money on whatever product is most excellent, no matter what it is. Currently, those products are: Cleveland Orchestra concerts and Championship Drum Corps.

(Note that I didn't say Cleveland Browns or Indians, nor Cavs, lol. Soooo NON-excellent!)

Funny you should mention the Cavaliers, as this drawn-out, will-they-or-won't-they-leave business reminds me of LeBron James's departure. If Gibbs and Hopkins "take their talents" elsewhere, at least we won't have to watch an ESPN special about it!

[chaos001]

Funny you should mention the Cavaliers, as this drawn-out, will-they-or-won't-they-leave business reminds me of LeBron James's departure. If Gibbs and Hopkins "take their talents" elsewhere, at least we won't have to watch an ESPN special about it!

No, but you would have to read one of Hopkins's god awful rants on FB.

[Jeff Ream]

No, but you would have to read one of Hopkins's god awful rants on FB.

well it would be as entertaining as when he complains about judging

[perc2100]

I agree. If G7 wants to split, then let them split and both sides will have to deal with the consequences. It's possible that both will not only survive but be better off. It's also possible that both will fail.

But the status quo, where the G7 receives DCI marketing and funding as they set up a competing circuit smacks of bad faith. It's hard to understand why the non-G7 corps are willing to tolerate it.

I've wondered that as well, and then I remember that we actually don't have any confirmation that the G7 corps are in fact leaving DCI. Their Music in Motion thing can be a secondary revenue stream/performance opportunity while DCI is their primary performance/competitive venue. If that's the case, then IMO what's going on is fine. This could end up being nothing more than the "3C's" type thing done previously, or YEA sponsored/run shows, or whatever.

Again, until/if DCI or the MiM directors release detailed statements describing the situation, we are left with nothing but to read outdated power points and parts of email discussions, and sit back and just guess about what may or may not happen.

Interesting Off-Topic question:

If corps in specific regions decided to do something similar, would we have this much rage about it? What iff, say, SOME mid-west and eastern region corps decided to do something similar (lets say, for the sake of discussion, Cavaliers, Phantom Regiment, Bluecoats, Cadets, Crown, Boston Crusaders, Madison Scouts) and had their own G7 type circuit with different performance opportunities & sheets, revenue streams, and run the shows independently with all proceeds going just to those corps? If it was presented as a way to consolidate travel while also capitalizing on the fan bases and regional opportunities of the corps involved? If they still blatantly left out corps in the regions (in this case arguably Glassmen, Blue Stars, Spirit, whomever else) in order to keep expenses smaller & profits larger? Would we still care?

I'm not so sure...