ShutUpAndPlayYerGuitar Posted April 18, 2013 Share Posted April 18, 2013 Knew a lot of guys at (DCI elgible) age who would have loved to be in the womens locker room and had nothing to do with breaking social norms. And everything to do with taking a good look..... Take three normal looking guys (one is a pervert, one is a gay guy that has no interest, one is just some average dude) and put each of them in a womens' locker room. You will get the exact same reaction. Weird thought experiment, I know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShutUpAndPlayYerGuitar Posted April 18, 2013 Share Posted April 18, 2013 To answer OP, as an artistic activity, yes DCI is ahead of the curve. Showering is a non-issue, as is bus life etc. The reality is that gay males do not act in the locker room that way straight males would act in a co-ed locker room. And I suspect straight males in a co-ed locker room would only act childish when in a pack, throw one loud mouth guy in a girls locker room and he would shrink to the corner and hide under his towel. DCI isn't broke in this way, please do not attempt to fix it. Thank you. That's about as concise as you can get. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimF-LowBari Posted April 18, 2013 Share Posted April 18, 2013 (edited) What are the other reasons? Edit: I don't beleive gay guys want to jump other guys in the bathroom if some are misreadig the original post. Line I have an issue with is: "Just because you're a dude and there's a gay dude in the locker room with you doesn't mean that person wants to jump your bones!" which I do not believe. But that doesn't rule out getting looked over while in the shower. Or at least the fear of getting checked out. C'mon (hetro) guys.. we check out the women when we get the chance. And if we were all in a co-ed shower do you think some of the guys wouldn't have problems keeping their eyes off a nice looking female. Edit: I'm NOT saying this is right, I'm just saying it does happen. So what would be the difference between hetro in the co-ed shower and gay in the same sex shower? And how much more alike can ya get? Edited April 21, 2013 by JimF-LowBari Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iplaytimpani Posted April 18, 2013 Author Share Posted April 18, 2013 To answer OP, as an artistic activity, yes DCI is ahead of the curve. Showering is a non-issue, as is bus life etc. The reality is that gay males do not act in the locker room that way straight males would act in a co-ed locker room. And I suspect straight males in a co-ed locker room would only act childish when in a pack, throw one loud mouth guy in a girls locker room and he would shrink to the corner and hide under his towel. DCI isn't broke in this way, please do not attempt to fix it. I agree DCI isn't broke and I'm not trying to fix anything. For an activity that I often feel is archaic compared to the world especially of sports, I feel it's one area the activity is ahead of most sports. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fred Windish Posted April 18, 2013 Share Posted April 18, 2013 Guys, gals . . . Homosexuals are real people. If you are NOT homosexual, you have nothing to fear. What more should be said? 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimF-LowBari Posted April 18, 2013 Share Posted April 18, 2013 Take three normal looking guys (one is a pervert, one is a gay guy that has no interest, one is just some average dude) and put each of them in a womens' locker room. You will get the exact same reaction. Weird thought experiment, I know. Same reaction from who? Seriously at that age I doubt if I'd could keep my eyes from straying for too long. Only thing that would save my sorry butt is my bad eyesight without glasses. s/ average dude who is/was less than average looking Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charlie1223 Posted April 18, 2013 Share Posted April 18, 2013 (edited) The one way it was described to me was: picture yourself in this scenario,.......your a straight guy heading to the locker/shower room of your housing sight..........would you be allowed to head into the girls showers?,...........I think not,..........so in turn, should someone that is homosexual be allowed into the showers with members of the same sex? I think you're trying to paint it as some kind of double standard but in a way that I don't think should have garnered you so many negative points. You are essentially saying that a gay guy in the shower looking at another guy is at the core the same as a straight guy looking at a girl, and I would say that's correct in that it doesn't matter. It's, at its core, equal and that's a forward way of thinking. More of society should see it this way. However, I think much of the shame/insecurity that the human race has developed with the nude form is largely man-made by it's institutions like religion/government. There's no reason, logically, to expect that a man looking at nude females body to be inherently immoral and yet we feel that it is and that someone just looking at or just being around a nude human is some kind of selfish indulgence to be revolted. I don't think there is anything morally wrong with a man and woman sharing the same locker room or shower but there is much, much fear around the idea because of the said institutions. (And no, being naked and sharing the same space with a naked human does not imply unsolicited or illegal acts) So how does this relate to drum corps? It's gotten to a point where sexuality and the body can be completely marginalized when the goal is great enough. When you are in 100 degree whether and you and 149 other people need to be in perfect synchronization and achieving something so much greater than the sum of its parts... it simply doesn't matter. It doesn't matter if someone's breast pops out infront of the drum line, or if a girl has to shower next to a lesbian, or if a girl sees a guys junk when his shorts are up tight! It is simply insignificant, we are all naked under our clothes. Drum Corps is able to tap into this higher level thinking among *most* of its members and it doesn't mean anything other than their goals of perfection and self discipline are more important than seeing a nude body regardless of which sex you like. I'm sorry if I crossed any DCP guidelines in this post. Edited April 18, 2013 by charlie1223 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimF-LowBari Posted April 18, 2013 Share Posted April 18, 2013 (edited) You are essentially saying that a gay guy in the shower looking at another guy is at the core the same as a straight guy looking at a girl, and I would say that's correct.... Better way than what I was trying to say (up to where I quoted)... but snipped the last few words as I do feel it matters. However, I think much of the shame/insecurity that the human race has developed with the nude form is largely man-made by it's institutions like religion/government. There's no reason, logically, to expect that a man looking at nude females body to be inherently immoral and yet we feel that it is and that someone just looking at or just being around a nude human is some kind of selfish indulgence to be revolted. I don't think there is anything morally wrong with a man and woman sharing the same locker room or shower but there is much, much fear around the idea because of the said institutions. (And no, being naked and sharing the same space with a naked human does not imply unsolicited or illegal acts) Here's where my annual POSH (Prevention Of Sexual Harrassment) training comes into play. If a person feels uncomfortible with something (here naked bodies) of a sexual nature it is their right not tobe put in that position. Govt/religion be ######, it's a personal decision and this paragraph sounds like "I don't see anything wrong with it, what's your problem?". Kind of off topic, but if we've going to discuss this on a higher level then legal definitions should be understood. And corps BoD legally has to deal with any situation that someone feels might be harrassment. Even if it turns out that there was no harrassment or the person who reported it was mistaken. Edited April 18, 2013 by JimF-LowBari Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chaddyt Posted April 18, 2013 Share Posted April 18, 2013 Line I have an issue with is: "Just because you're a dude and there's a gay dude in the locker room with you doesn't mean that person wants to jump your bones!" which I do not believe. But that doesn't rule out getting looked over while in the shower. Or at least the fear of getting checked out. C'mon (hetro) guys.. we check out the women when we get the chance. And if we were all in a co-ed shower do you think some of the guys wouldn't have problems keeping their eyes off a nice looking female. So what would be the difference between hetro in the co-ed shower and gay in the same sex shower? And how much more alike can ya get? That's one reason that was given as to why heterosexual guys wouldn't want homosexual guys showering with them. You alluded that there are other reasons. I'm just asking what those other reasons are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charlie1223 Posted April 18, 2013 Share Posted April 18, 2013 (edited) To answer OP, as an artistic activity, yes DCI is ahead of the curve. Showering is a non-issue, as is bus life etc. The reality is that gay males do not act in the locker room that way straight males would act in a co-ed locker room. And I suspect straight males in a co-ed locker room would only act childish when in a pack, throw one loud mouth guy in a girls locker room and he would shrink to the corner and hide under his towel. DCI isn't broke in this way, please do not attempt to fix it. "Gay males do not act in the locker room the way straight males would act in a co-ed locker room" Well, of course... especially when you are straight male growing up in a straight society where being straight is 100% accepted and expected. I don't think you can completely insult straight men like that. When all sexuality itself was almost nearly Taboo in the days of the Puritans you wouldn't have a straight male acting childish in co-ed locker room. They would act exactly as you claim gay men to act. But Society has became more liberal and has become more open about being "straight" so it's more "acceptable" to act childish (even though really its just rude). Plus I think much of this illusion that straight men are simply too childish to be in the same room with a naked woman is perpetuated by media and movies where it is socially acceptable (and even cheered) to do those things. You don't see the opposite of that in the media much... But that unfortunately influences reality to make it a reality. The way we see genders and sexuality has been completely twisted (or should I say regulated?). Gay people are not morally superior just because they don't act childish in all male locker room. They are toned down by the centuries of suppression indoctrinated in society and fear that they will be rejected, embarrassed or worse. Social change comes SLOW... even in the most liberal nations. As society finally starts seeing human beings as equal-beings then I'm sure we'll start to find instances of a haughty, rude gay man who will act childish around some people in the locker room. And that will certainly be good day for the human race (in a very strange way... lol). Edited April 18, 2013 by charlie1223 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts