Sunrifle Posted August 17, 2013 Share Posted August 17, 2013 Could you name a corps that used woodwinds? And what circuit they competed in? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GUARDLING Posted August 17, 2013 Share Posted August 17, 2013 Could you name a corps that used woodwinds? And what circuit they competed in? I believe when cadets were formed I saw an old pic with some kind of flute or woodwind...same with some others.......if you want to go back in history and when things where formed ..thats cool BUT you cant decide when that starts. Drum corps or drum and Bugle was formed wayyyy before any DCI or DCA...there's the legacy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LegalEagle50 Posted August 17, 2013 Share Posted August 17, 2013 The post that came through only as a quote was in error. Stupid cell phone posting error. I will try to recreate the thought pattern I had going at the time. SunRifle, I get that you don't think it has been drum and bugle corps for a very long time. You told me earlier this summer that it wasn't drum and bugle corps by the time I picked up my 1st flag (which was actually 10 years before I began marching in a drum corps). I find that comments like that demean anyone who participated in this activity in the last 30ish years or so based on your timeline. Don't you see how presumptuous and insulting that is? Posts such as your's makes me wonder if we should apologize for when we were born? For when we marched? For still caring about the activity? It isn't any of our places to choose what the activity calls itself. It has a very long history, it had evolved (thankfully IMO) from where it started, and some of us continue to embrace it in its current form. It doesn't always offer everything to everyone and it never has, and never will. But I would rather see the activity evolve and see young people, young adults and adults want to be participants and spectators because it evolved, than to talk about it as something I vaguely remember from my youth because it died out long ago. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunrifle Posted August 17, 2013 Share Posted August 17, 2013 legalEagle, my comments are one persons opinion and I am aware that they are not popular with many who post on this forum. It is not my intention to put you or anyone else down. If I was 20 years old again, I could not begin to do what these kids do in these incredibly demanding show nowadays. If you are offended by my belief that it was no longer drum and bugle corps by the time you first picked up a flag (as you put it) then you must be very sensitive. If everyone on this forum felt the same way about everything, this would be a very boring forum. It appears to me that only a fraction of the people who view the posts on this forum actually posts themselves and who knows, I may have more supporters than I think. Having said that, I have no problem with anyone who comes down on me for my beliefs. There some very gracious people on this forum (of course many of them happen to be ex Sunrisers) and some people who get offended easily. And then there are most likely some people like me who are old and bitter. Just saying..... 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fastone Posted August 17, 2013 Share Posted August 17, 2013 To me all of this is under the heading of "Whatever" If you you like it anymore, don't watch it. Those of us who came through the 60's into the early 70's when to me the most drastic changes in DC history happened should be more open minded imo. We were allowed our innovations, let this generation have theirs. 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigW Posted August 17, 2013 Share Posted August 17, 2013 Okaaaaaayyyy... Let me see if I can shed some light on this one. I was apprehensive about this issue, until I came up with the right questions and went to the right people and asked them. Knowlegebale percussion instructors and performers. After talking to them Educator to Educator, musician to musician, I bought into it. Keep in mind this legislation is allowing the Front ensemble to be amplified. We're not talking the use of digital instruments or sampling here, which is another issue altogether. Also keep in mind the DCA member Corps themselves voted to do this. This wasn't something foisted upon them. From the questions I asked and the answers I got, this isn't innovation. It's more the application of some common sense to solve some real issues. What are the issues at hand? I've seen them up close. They're actual, and quite real. 1: Mallet percussionists in the outdoor arena have to use very hard mallets and in effect abuse the bejeezus out of their instruments. I've seen Kelon bars split and been abused a lot, and supposedly it's indestructible. Have you priced these instruments? A new Kelon bar marimba's at least 4500 bucks new. A Xylophone runs at least 2400 bucks. Repairs aren't cheap. If you go to rosewood, there's a lot more money in the pot. The instruments are being way overplayed on and overstressed. Amplifation significantly takes away the wear and tear on those instruments and the mallets used to beat the heck out of them. In the long run it would pay for itself in saving the instruments. And I don't think that would take that long, either. 2: Beating up instruments and fixing them is one thing. Let's talk the wear and tear on the people beating the crap out of the instruments. Carpal Tunnel, anyone? Ever had a tendon bulge with fluid on the back of your wrist? I did from playing keyboard too much when I was teaching. It's, let me put it this way, disturbing and somewhat painful. Especially when your Doctor tells you to rest it, and if that didn't work, they can stick a needle in the tendon and drain it. Personally, I'd rather see the Front Ensemble amplified than be cutting open people's wrists or sticking needles in tendons for the sake of some kind of "purity". 3: From the standpoint of a musician, the way these instruments are being played isn't necessarily what one would call subtle or Musical. It's like asking the brass to blast out of control the whole show so everyone can hear them. Doing this gives the Front ensemble performers the chance to exhibit subtlety and MUSICALITY, not the mere ability to whack the heck out of their marimba and crack the bars. People in the stands, not just judges- LIKE and APPRECIATE musicality. As a Music Educator, I also think that yeah, maybe that kind of thing might be important. Just maybe. Don't throw the tradition and insult to tradition argument at me, please. I have found it to be baseless. I played on a Piston rotor horn BITD for 4 of my 6 seasons at Westshore, and I'll play on one at I and E for fun and also out of respect for that tradition and legacy. I watch the DCA corps alumni at shows, I know a few, and I see very active and positive support and serious respect across generational lines. I've had the chance to interact with the folks out there now and again, and I see the same faces, the same smiles, and feel the same kind of toughness, intensity, and devotion from all of them like I felt from my corpsmates BITD and still feel from my fellow Alumni Corps members. It's more the same in the important ways it needs to be than it is "different". Get down into the trenches, watch, observe, listen. I have. I firmly believe doing this is a positive for the DCA corps for the three good reasons I stated. Come up with more logical and sensible reasons why not- if you can. My mind is not easy to change on many things, but when people who know the craft of percussion were willing to explain the deal here, I understood the problem and had an epiphany for which I think them. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted August 17, 2013 Share Posted August 17, 2013 And Legal Eagle, I guess you missed the irony in my post as well. The fact is that "drum corps" has moved further and further away from resembling drum corps. As you know, most modern "drum corps" utilize 3 to 4 valve brass instruments which are commonly used by marching and brass bands and they are certainly not bugles. I hope that someday soon "drum corps" will be referred to as marching brass bands so we can finally lay drum corps to rest as it died years ago. Can't wait to be attacked for this one!!! ya know, drum corps moved on from when you marched too....I mean they added those contra thingies, added things like timablies, marching tympani...i mean gasp, in the 70's drill started up in the corner and not on the line, inspection went away....the horrors. not exactly a fan of amping, or as i like to think of it the gateway rule to other electronics being added ( and used poorly), but #### changed. Unless you still drive and Edsel and watch the Honeymooners on a black and white tv Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunrifle Posted August 17, 2013 Share Posted August 17, 2013 Jeff. Thank you so much for listing a few of the many reasons why attendance at so called drum and bugle corps competitions is a mere fraction of what it was in the past. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scottmkeen Posted August 17, 2013 Share Posted August 17, 2013 FWIW (and I didn't read all of the posts), I have talked to many percussion instructors, and they agree with the pit amplification rule. It saves wear and tear on the instruments and the players. One said it best, "It allows the instruments to be played as they were intended." Food for thought? SMK 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pearlsnaredrummer77 Posted August 17, 2013 Share Posted August 17, 2013 The amps-when mixed well-dont bother me so much. I don't really think it's necessary as I've never had a problem hearing a pit even in the days before concert marimbas, etc., were used on the field. The ones folks used to march while playing were often loud enough and even frequently too loud. But I get it: we're an activity of 'artists' now so we need electrification. But the synths that I've heard are just plain distracting, hideously mixed, and introduce (an unnecessar) new instrument family. Really when you add the synths, you might as well throw the woodwinds in as well. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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