No Detailed Recaps

[ShortAndFast]

I think you're right about that as far as World Class goes: a 5.45 pt. drop by the Troopers, I believe, is the largest one-day change this year--but I think you'll find nothing to match that, or the number of 3 pt. and 4 pts. one-day shifts of the past week, if you look at the scores of the past few years.

But in Open Class, at the same shows this year, we've seen:

Legends = -5.5 from 7/1 to 7/2

Colt Cadets = -6.2 from 7/3 to 7/5 (OK, that's two days not one)

Genesis = -8.7 from 7/1 to 7/2

Colt Cadets = +9.2 from 7/2 to 7/3

All Age scores in DCI are always odd, so I omit the Kilties' even larger jumps.

Admittedly, this is still a small sample size, and could point to nothing more than a group of oddly confused Midwest judges.

Whatever it is, it's fun to watch!

I'm not sure that I'm convinced we're really seeing more volatility. It seems like usual early-season stuff: partial panels, new judges, judges who've only seen some of the corps, shows where corps have no close competitors. I could be convinced ... have you compared to the last couple of years?

In my mind, volatility means placement changes between San Antonio and Indy. I don't think more random scores for lower-placing groups is what anybody was aiming for with this change.

[luv4corps]

I think what Kamarag was implying was that even though judges aren't supposed to see full recaps, they could probably get them through surreptitious means.

I've seen that argument made quite a bit, even suggestions that judges could deconstruct the recaps that are provided. What I think everyone is overestimating is the desire for judges to see full recaps. It would take some serious effort to get full recaps, and I bet a lot of judges just don't care enough.

This is my feeling. What would be the point of all this supposed back-door recap hustling? It doesn't make sense.

Edited July 6, 2016 by luv4corps

[BRASSO]

In my mind, volatility means placement changes between San Antonio and Indy.

My preseason prediction ( on the placement prediction thread ) of " lots of volatility in the scores this season" was not self limited, nor restricted to a certain timeline in the 2016 season. It was all encompassing, and included both early season shows, and later season shows. Now we are witnessing this " score volatility " in its full glory. It is unprecedented in modern DCI history to see such score swings from nite to nite.... ie, corps dropping by 10 points from one show to the next, then getting 4-5 5 point bumps from that low score, the next nite, other Corps stuck at a certain level. Moving forward, we are about to see Corps that have been stuck at 1- 1.5 point scores, or flat lined, get huge double point jumps in scores ( 3-5 points ) starting soon. The multiple reasons for the score volatilty this season has already been explained in the preseason here on DCP, so if loyal DCP'es were on here in the preseason they know what these reasons are for these current across the board 2016 low scores, as well as for the unprecedented volatility we are now witnessing from nite to nite this season now. Theres no use in being redundant and repetitive to an explanation for this either, imo, as it would just bore the DCP'ers that take the time to visit here not just in season, but visit here in the off season as well.

Edited July 6, 2016 by BRASSO

[N.E. Brigand]

I'm not sure that I'm convinced we're really seeing more volatility. It seems like usual early-season stuff: partial panels, new judges, judges who've only seen some of the corps, shows where corps have no close competitors. I could be convinced ... have you compared to the last couple of years?

I haven't. I will. Certainly you could be right that a few very unusual outliers make the season merely seem more volatile.

[Phantom1701]

Not for nothing, the whole idea of not showing the recaps is a bit childish in my opinion. Especially for this activity where the vast number of performers in World Class corps are over 18, and therefore, adults. So why the need to play these coy games?

I teach a high school drumline and at every competition the full scores and recaps are available to each band director. Nothing is hidden to protect anyone or prevent bias from week to week. And the results are also put on the governing body's website for all to access and see. So if high school band judges, directors and kids can handle it, why can't DCI, it's fans, performers and judges?

And for those who might say "who cares, it's just high school". Placements at these regional competitions have an effect on state championship performance times, and in many cases, final placements. So it matters a great deal to those involved in those programs.

Point being, if they can handle it, then DCI and all its various components can handle it.

[Michael Boo]

Selfishly, I'm wondering what it's going to be like to go back to my room after San Antonio, Atlanta, Allentown, and Indy and not have the Recap Roundup to do. I think I might need to take up late night model building or something, because it will just seem too darned weird to get to bed before 4:00 a.m., or to leave Lucas Oil Stadium at 3:30 a.m. and walk to my car, the last one in the parking lot. I got so used to that, I kind of looked forward to the uniqueness of the situation. I don't know yet if there will be a Recap Roundup after Finals. Some of my most intense memories are writing it while watching the Zamboni-like machine erase our hash marks from the professional field and also view the goal posts being set up for what often was an exhibition game in just a few hours.

Seriously, did no one think of the effect on DCI's resident Boo?

[va9590jm]

Selfishly, I'm wondering what it's going to be like to go back to my room after San Antonio, Atlanta, Allentown, and Indy and not have the Recap Roundup to do. I think I might need to take up late night model building or something, because it will just seem too darned weird to get to bed before 4:00 a.m., or to leave Lucas Oil Stadium at 3:30 a.m. and walk to my car, the last one in the parking lot. I got so used to that, I kind of looked forward to the uniqueness of the situation. I don't know yet if there will be a Recap Roundup after Finals. Some of my most intense memories are writing it while watching the Zamboni-like machine erase our hash marks from the professional field and also view the goal posts being set up for what often was an exhibition game in just a few hours.

Seriously, did no one think of the effect on DCI's resident Boo?

Well you can still do all that if you have access to the recaps, and just hold on to the stories to publish when all recaps are made public at the end of the season, can't you?

[N.E. Brigand]

Not for nothing, the whole idea of not showing the recaps is a bit childish in my opinion. Especially for this activity where the vast number of performers in World Class corps are over 18, and therefore, adults. So why the need to play these coy games?

I teach a high school drumline and at every competition the full scores and recaps are available to each band director. Nothing is hidden to protect anyone or prevent bias from week to week. And the results are also put on the governing body's website for all to access and see. So if high school band judges, directors and kids can handle it, why can't DCI, it's fans, performers and judges?

And for those who might say "who cares, it's just high school". Placements at these regional competitions have an effect on state championship performance times, and in many cases, final placements. So it matters a great deal to those involved in those programs.

Point being, if they can handle it, then DCI and all its various components can handle it.

The corps are seeing the recaps at the end of every show. The judges are not (theoretically). And everyone is seeing the overall scores and those in each broad category. So anything that, in the analogy of your high school band experience, affects performance times and the like, is in fact being made known to all.

I do wonder: why does any particular group need to see the details of its competitors' captions to know what they themselves need to improve? Aren't the judges' comments and the group's own recaps enough?

[Michael Boo]

Well you can still do all that if you have access to the recaps, and just hold on to the stories to publish when all recaps are made public at the end of the season, can't you?

I don't know if I'll have access to them. And if I did, I wouldn't want to see them. Why? Because I'm still, more than anything, a fan of drum corps...and I like to experience as much of the drum corps experience as the fans experience it. I know that may sound silly, but trying to view drum corps as a fan (albeit with a different perspective than some due to my job duties and experiences) is one of the things I dearly hold on to because it makes the whole experience more enjoyable. Being a fan is more precious to me than being DCI's Staff Writer. I try to combine both into an experience that is meaningful to me, and hopefully to those who read what I write.

[Phantom1701]

The corps are seeing the recaps at the end of every show. The judges are not (theoretically). And everyone is seeing the overall scores and those in each broad category. So anything that, in the analogy of your high school band experience, affects performance times and the like, is in fact being made known to all.

I do wonder: why does any particular group need to see the details of its competitors' captions to know what they themselves need to improve? Aren't the judges' comments and the group's own recaps enough?

Well, not being known by "all" as you say, if judges and fans still do not have access to them. And I'm not convinced that the judges couldn't see the full recaps if they really wanted to. So it may just be that the fans are the only group involved in the activity not getting to see them. If true, then DCI made this move solely to prevent fans from complaining, bashing, or negatively commenting about Judge X or Judge Y or this forum and others of the like. Admittedly the attacks do go over the top at times and accusations of judges bias is certainly an issue, whether founded or unfounded.

Still, DCI should take note that (as with all sports and activities of a competitive or performance nature) the fans are the ones paying the bills. So if at the end of the day we are the only ones being left in the dark, then it could have a negative financial impact on the activity in years to come. I sincerely hope this is not the case.

To your point though (and well received) provided the corps and staff are getting to see the full recaps and ordinals, then this would allow them to make changes based upon how they are stacking up against their peers. So glad to hear that at least that much is happening. Still, I do hope they reverse their decision and allow "all" to see the full recaps.