Glenn426 Posted July 24, 2019 Author Share Posted July 24, 2019 4 minutes ago, Tony Flores said: i'm on your side...DCI got away with thievery for decades...after all that time they got away cheap. could've financially ruined the activity for ever. F-ing lawyers man,.... These are mainly Non-Profit Youth organizations that provide a service to the Youth of the world to give them an avenue to perform and have life-changing experiences. As I stated earlier I would find it hard for a musician or arranger to come directly at DCI and attack them for not paying minuscule licensing fees. They are artist and want their work to be spread far and wide. Especially in this medium where the great majority of the consumption of the medium is done by Students, future Music Educators and current music educators. To say it is a Theft would be an unfair characterization. I say there should be special Education Licenses that would allow for the full rights of use of the music under time limitations, so that People who look at DCI and the marching arts activity as a whole and think that its Thievery can find something else to do with their time. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Corps Guy Posted July 24, 2019 Share Posted July 24, 2019 (edited) 16 minutes ago, Glenn426 said: F-ing lawyers man,.... These are mainly Non-Profit Youth organizations that provide a service to the Youth of the world to give them an avenue to perform and have life-changing experiences. As I stated earlier I would find it hard for a musician or arranger to come directly at DCI and attack them for not paying minuscule licensing fees. They are artist and want their work to be spread far and wide. Especially in this medium where the great majority of the consumption of the medium is done by Students, future Music Educators and current music educators. To say it is a Theft would be an unfair characterization. I say there should be special Education Licenses that would allow for the full rights of use of the music under time limitations, so that People who look at DCI and the marching arts activity as a whole and think that its Thievery can find something else to do with their time. I am not a lawyer, nor do I paly one on TV. That being said, even schools have to purchase music. This cost sends a very small fee to the composer/arranger. When I was unable to find an arrangement of a specific piece our marching band used, I had to pay the publisher and composer for permission to arrange the piece. As a musician, we all know that there is very little revenue for the people in the background. Every corps goes through this same task each year when they choose music to perform. The revenue needs to make it back to the original composers or you won't have any original composers in the future. Edited July 24, 2019 by Old Corps Guy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cixelsyd Posted July 24, 2019 Share Posted July 24, 2019 1 hour ago, Old Corps Guy said: I hate to defend the licensing considering all of the challenges. However, I am about to do just that from a musicians perspective. I am guessing that better than 80% of us are musicians. Being musicians, we perform for an audience. The audience pays for viewing/hearing a performance. The $ paid by the audience pay for the musicians, producers, directors, writers, arrangers, etc. Original composers, followed by arrangers, receive a "very small fee" for each time a piece is played on a device, recorded, performed, etc. This is the only way these original composers make any revenue for all the work they do. Most composers are far from wealthy. In fact, many have another job just to pay the bills. Licensing is the only way to protect these composers. Great. Now explain to me why we must divorce "live" streams from "on-demand" streams, in a manner that relegates us to choosing one or the other. The only thing that protects the composers from is additional profit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Corps Guy Posted July 24, 2019 Share Posted July 24, 2019 Just now, cixelsyd said: Great. Now explain to me why we must divorce "live" streams from "on-demand" streams, in a manner that relegates us to choosing one or the other. The only thing that protects the composers from is additional profit. On-demand would be no different than a radio playing a song. Each time that song is played on a radio station, a small cost goes back to the distributor/producer and so on back to the original composer. This makes it cost prohibitive to the streaming provider (Flo in this case) and those costs would then need to flow down to the consumer (you and me). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimF-LowBari Posted July 24, 2019 Share Posted July 24, 2019 56 minutes ago, Tony Flores said: i'm on your side...DCI got away with thievery for decades...after all that time they got away cheap. could've financially ruined the activity for ever. Well then DCA, marching bands and countless other musical groups got away with “thievery”. As someone lot more in the know told me: the laws were already there, now the rights holders are collecting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Flores Posted July 24, 2019 Share Posted July 24, 2019 3 minutes ago, JimF-LowBari said: Well then DCA, marching bands and countless other musical groups got away with “thievery”. As someone lot more in the know told me: the laws were already there, now the rights holders are collecting. the rights holders formed a final boss, and the activity lost...and paid the piper 6 figures...could've been 7, which would have fatally ruined the activity Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cixelsyd Posted July 24, 2019 Share Posted July 24, 2019 4 minutes ago, Old Corps Guy said: On-demand would be no different than a radio playing a song. Each time that song is played on a radio station, a small cost goes back to the distributor/producer and so on back to the original composer. This makes it cost prohibitive to the streaming provider (Flo in this case) and those costs would then need to flow down to the consumer (you and me). This has nothing to do with costs flowing down to the consumer. There is a prohibitive upfront cost to establishing a streaming service. Divorcing "live" from "on-demand" is a relatively recent distinction that would require two such prohibitive upfront costs to be met to provide both, which no one is willing to do. The costs are characterized as "licensing", but how much of that benefits composers vs. lawyers? I suspect the nature of the live/on-demand distinction is for the benefit of the latter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimF-LowBari Posted July 24, 2019 Share Posted July 24, 2019 6 minutes ago, Tony Flores said: the rights holders formed a final boss, and the activity lost...and paid the piper 6 figures...could've been 7, which would have fatally ruined the activity My point was you make it sound like DCI was the only one not following thru. My understanding is it was pretty wide spread back in the day. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fran Haring Posted July 24, 2019 Share Posted July 24, 2019 2 hours ago, JimF-LowBari said: That #### coffee maker 😈 If I end up purchasing the DCA Finals feed this year, that #### thing better not get in the way. I don't even drink coffee. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Corps Guy Posted July 24, 2019 Share Posted July 24, 2019 6 minutes ago, JimF-LowBari said: My point was you make it sound like DCI was the only one not following thru. My understanding is it was pretty wide spread back in the day. As I stated earlier, "When I was unable to find an arrangement of a specific piece our marching band used, I had to pay the publisher and composer for permission to arrange the piece. As a musician, we all know that there is very little revenue for the people in the background." You are correct about BITD. Even the Commandant's Own dealt with it and you can't buy a single Truman Crawford arrangement anywhere today. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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