kdaddy Posted July 28, 2022 Share Posted July 28, 2022 2 minutes ago, Bneat said: There's a lot to be proud of here...I think the show is a great representation of what Phantom is, and how it can grow in the "modern" dci - I think this is a more modern Phantom, and it's a great production. Performers are performing the heck out of it, and the organization should be commended for taking the next logical step in re-climbing a very stacked ladder. Having said that...one wants to quibble over 7th versus 10th place - and those involved should advocate for their group as much as humanly possible. But, the reality is, that the lower middle pack is going to be separate by very little - and the placements, while they sound like huge swings are really going to be splitting hairs/captions by very fine margins. To that end, a couple of observations 1. Visually - we still dirty y'all. I get it - there is more "drill" here than others, and the vertical responsibilities are more demanding - but, we're getting to that point in the season where, even most kind-hearted, compassionate judge says - "I can't care - clean it up". 'member - you're not judged against the other corps...you're judged against the sheets, and essentially...yourself. If you said you're gonna do "x" drill and "y" drill - then, you better do it. End of story. It doesn't matter what the *insert corps name here* does or doesn't do...your 12 minutes on the field = your time to shine, or not. The scores are relative to other corps because the sheets align the standards...so, you can have the discussion of how scores relate, but don't conflate relation with causation or explanation. The answer lies within. And to THAT end, I shouldn't be able to visually pick out very obvious ticks at this point. No, it's not tick-based, but your overall ability to demonstrate your product is hampered by people missing forms, blowing past cover points, etc... 2. Related to "1", in that, I feel like we jacked some tempos tonight (ala closer last year in Indy), which will become necessary, but I think it's cart before the horse at this point. See #1 - clean first, fly after that. "Control" is becoming an issue...and setting the corps off on hyperspeed is NOT going to help that right now. 3. OK, for cereal - are we trying to make a straight line with the props up the 50? We are aware that they're curved, right? And, I get that in some place in my mind, the curvature can connect to create a soft zig-zag up the 50 which feels like a straight through line...but, for however many times I try to convince myself it's possible, I just haven't seen it happen. It always "feels" off...and the peel off to the arc with the props also never happens the way it does (probably) on the nice, neat drill file. Reality is such that, up the 50 feels wrong, and when the props move, treat them like humans...they have to achieve subsets and make sense geometrically with the other props. Clean prop drill just like human drill. 4. Are we still lifting the trombonist on the two shoulders...? I hope not. Idea = kinda cool. Maybe. Reality = weird. Close up cameras = WEIRDER. Design/benefit analysis here...I'd make an passionate (574) please for it to go. 5. When. Are. We. Wedging. The. Final. Set.? Serrriously....the form is there. You just need to draw it out, reverse course on the suspensions, bring it in high and tight, and voila - wedge salad is there. On the 64,000 count chord at the end, down on the knee up front...kick it out....and yee-haa. I mean, the form is literally there...tick tock. I'm aware that this fluff violates the principal set forth in number 2....but, for a wedge, it cancels some cleanliness issues. 🙂 No really...where's the wedge? Don't misinterpret any of this - love the show, and performers are doin the lawd's work - but, just some thoughts from this end of the earth to make this as amazing as it should be! I'm with you on all this (except the wedge, assuming you mean the final wedge set with leg kick in front - I've never been a fan). No lifting the trombonist tonight! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bneat Posted July 28, 2022 Share Posted July 28, 2022 6 minutes ago, kdaddy said: I'm with you on all this (except the wedge, assuming you mean the final wedge set with leg kick in front - I've never been a fan). No lifting the trombonist tonight! I should've watched the whole video before commenting - but, good! That's a good decision right there. Unfortunately, I fear you to be in the minority regarding the final wedge set - and, I'm somewhat against the ball and chain of "tradition" when it holds a corps back. But, I don't care when it comes to the wedge. HAHA...illogical, but real. 🙂 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SJugster Posted July 28, 2022 Share Posted July 28, 2022 The members also feel that there will be set changes coming in the closer. I personally like the wedge but I am not sure if they will add that or the Chevron at the end. The show is getting better and cleaner for sure. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmurrey74 Posted July 28, 2022 Share Posted July 28, 2022 LOVE the show but there’s so far to go to clean it up visually and time is going quick! I also agree about the props on the 50, just feels wrong every time. The purple fabric showing on the ends of the props also is distracting. The visual details matter! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phantombari1 Posted July 28, 2022 Share Posted July 28, 2022 9 hours ago, Bneat said: There's a lot to be proud of here...I think the show is a great representation of what Phantom is, and how it can grow in the "modern" dci - I think this is a more modern Phantom, and it's a great production. Performers are performing the heck out of it, and the organization should be commended for taking the next logical step in re-climbing a very stacked ladder. Having said that...one wants to quibble over 7th versus 10th place - and those involved should advocate for their group as much as humanly possible. But, the reality is, that the lower middle pack is going to be separate by very little - and the placements, while they sound like huge swings are really going to be splitting hairs/captions by very fine margins. To that end, a couple of observations 1. Visually - we still dirty y'all. I get it - there is more "drill" here than others, and the vertical responsibilities are more demanding - but, we're getting to that point in the season where, even most kind-hearted, compassionate judge says - "I can't care - clean it up". 'member - you're not judged against the other corps...you're judged against the sheets, and essentially...yourself. If you said you're gonna do "x" drill and "y" drill - then, you better do it. End of story. It doesn't matter what the *insert corps name here* does or doesn't do...your 12 minutes on the field = your time to shine, or not. The scores are relative to other corps because the sheets align the standards...so, you can have the discussion of how scores relate, but don't conflate relation with causation or explanation. The answer lies within. And to THAT end, I shouldn't be able to visually pick out very obvious ticks at this point. No, it's not tick-based, but your overall ability to demonstrate your product is hampered by people missing forms, blowing past cover points, etc... 2. Related to "1", in that, I feel like we jacked some tempos tonight (ala closer last year in Indy), which will become necessary, but I think it's cart before the horse at this point. See #1 - clean first, fly after that. "Control" is becoming an issue...and setting the corps off on hyperspeed is NOT going to help that right now. 3. OK, for cereal - are we trying to make a straight line with the props up the 50? We are aware that they're curved, right? And, I get that in some place in my mind, the curvature can connect to create a soft zig-zag up the 50 which feels like a straight through line...but, for however many times I try to convince myself it's possible, I just haven't seen it happen. It always "feels" off...and the peel off to the arc with the props also never happens the way it does (probably) on the nice, neat drill file. Reality is such that, up the 50 feels wrong, and when the props move, treat them like humans...they have to achieve subsets and make sense geometrically with the other props. Clean prop drill just like human drill. 4. Are we still lifting the trombonist on the two shoulders...? I hope not. Idea = kinda cool. Maybe. Reality = weird. Close up cameras = WEIRDER. Design/benefit analysis here...I'd make an passionate (574) please for it to go. 5. When. Are. We. Wedging. The. Final. Set.? Serrriously....the form is there. You just need to draw it out, reverse course on the suspensions, bring it in high and tight, and voila - wedge salad is there. On the 64,000 count chord at the end, down on the knee up front...kick it out....and yee-haa. I mean, the form is literally there...tick tock. I'm aware that this fluff violates the principal set forth in number 2....but, for a wedge, it cancels some cleanliness issues. 🙂 No really...where's the wedge? Don't misinterpret any of this - love the show, and performers are doin the lawd's work - but, just some thoughts from this end of the earth to make this as amazing as it should be! You're right on the money, you've echoed my sentiments from their first show review...I also don't feel this show fits in with current top corps design...still old fashioned compared to all the corps above them. I know I've been against the previous leadership and board for what they were doing and ultimately did for Regiment (Sadly some are still holding positions) but (IMO) its time for Phantom to start migrating to modern classical or dare say it out of classical all together in order to compete on a regular basis and not just on the rare occasion. They are getting the staff but need someone with a modern vision. J.D. is the right person for the job but he needs others around him to fulfill that vision. From the Kids perspective they have the talent, they just need to have the old fuddy duddy's get out of the way. Sorry for the ruffled feathers Fuddys. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billj Posted July 28, 2022 Share Posted July 28, 2022 14 hours ago, Bneat said: There's a lot to be proud of here...I think the show is a great representation of what Phantom is, and how it can grow in the "modern" dci - I think this is a more modern Phantom, and it's a great production. Performers are performing the heck out of it, and the organization should be commended for taking the next logical step in re-climbing a very stacked ladder. Having said that...one wants to quibble over 7th versus 10th place - and those involved should advocate for their group as much as humanly possible. But, the reality is, that the lower middle pack is going to be separate by very little - and the placements, while they sound like huge swings are really going to be splitting hairs/captions by very fine margins. To that end, a couple of observations 1. Visually - we still dirty y'all. I get it - there is more "drill" here than others, and the vertical responsibilities are more demanding - but, we're getting to that point in the season where, even most kind-hearted, compassionate judge says - "I can't care - clean it up". 'member - you're not judged against the other corps...you're judged against the sheets, and essentially...yourself. If you said you're gonna do "x" drill and "y" drill - then, you better do it. End of story. It doesn't matter what the *insert corps name here* does or doesn't do...your 12 minutes on the field = your time to shine, or not. The scores are relative to other corps because the sheets align the standards...so, you can have the discussion of how scores relate, but don't conflate relation with causation or explanation. The answer lies within. And to THAT end, I shouldn't be able to visually pick out very obvious ticks at this point. No, it's not tick-based, but your overall ability to demonstrate your product is hampered by people missing forms, blowing past cover points, etc... 2. Related to "1", in that, I feel like we jacked some tempos tonight (ala closer last year in Indy), which will become necessary, but I think it's cart before the horse at this point. See #1 - clean first, fly after that. "Control" is becoming an issue...and setting the corps off on hyperspeed is NOT going to help that right now. 3. OK, for cereal - are we trying to make a straight line with the props up the 50? We are aware that they're curved, right? And, I get that in some place in my mind, the curvature can connect to create a soft zig-zag up the 50 which feels like a straight through line...but, for however many times I try to convince myself it's possible, I just haven't seen it happen. It always "feels" off...and the peel off to the arc with the props also never happens the way it does (probably) on the nice, neat drill file. Reality is such that, up the 50 feels wrong, and when the props move, treat them like humans...they have to achieve subsets and make sense geometrically with the other props. Clean prop drill just like human drill. 4. Are we still lifting the trombonist on the two shoulders...? I hope not. Idea = kinda cool. Maybe. Reality = weird. Close up cameras = WEIRDER. Design/benefit analysis here...I'd make an passionate (574) please for it to go. 5. When. Are. We. Wedging. The. Final. Set.? Serrriously....the form is there. You just need to draw it out, reverse course on the suspensions, bring it in high and tight, and voila - wedge salad is there. On the 64,000 count chord at the end, down on the knee up front...kick it out....and yee-haa. I mean, the form is literally there...tick tock. I'm aware that this fluff violates the principal set forth in number 2....but, for a wedge, it cancels some cleanliness issues. 🙂 No really...where's the wedge? Don't misinterpret any of this - love the show, and performers are doin the lawd's work - but, just some thoughts from this end of the earth to make this as amazing as it should be! Regarding #3 while the "walk" ties to the theme, it's unfortunately not as impactful as one would hope, both because of the distractions with the props lining up, plus even with the DM walking the runway (in SA) AND having the quick costume change (I don't know if I've seen anyone mention it - did anyone even notice it?), her vertical movement isn't very noticable, because she's buried behind the corps, she's smaller in stature, and after the quick change, the white costume blends into the white surface of the props. Maybe there are more changes planned here? It would be nice to have a wedge and/or chevron in the closer, but I'm fine if not. As someone else pointed out, the brass block during the first hit could be turned into a chevron, but the following drill would probably be impacted. The changes made over the last week have been good to see, especially the ballad with staging of the brass on props and significant dynamic shaping added. Adding the snare feature in part 3 adds variety, but wondering if more variety could be added there (and include the tenors and basses) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bneat Posted July 28, 2022 Share Posted July 28, 2022 1 hour ago, billj said: Regarding #3 while the "walk" ties to the theme, it's unfortunately not as impactful as one would hope, both because of the distractions with the props lining up, plus even with the DM walking the runway (in SA) AND having the quick costume change (I don't know if I've seen anyone mention it - did anyone even notice it?), her vertical movement isn't very noticable, because she's buried behind the corps, she's smaller in stature, and after the quick change, the white costume blends into the white surface of the props. Maybe there are more changes planned here? It would be nice to have a wedge and/or chevron in the closer, but I'm fine if not. As someone else pointed out, the brass block during the first hit could be turned into a chevron, but the following drill would probably be impacted. The changes made over the last week have been good to see, especially the ballad with staging of the brass on props and significant dynamic shaping added. Adding the snare feature in part 3 adds variety, but wondering if more variety could be added there (and include the tenors and basses) Ah - I never really even caught "the walk" - I get real distracted by the curved straight line (I feel like I'm cleaning drill and yammering on about lining up the arc!). I dunno what the solution is here, but I would opt for a more "figurative" walk and not allow the props to become the distraction that they are, in the form, and in the exit. The closing drill is like pre-fabbed for the wedge - and to me, there's an analysis issue with building tension and spreading the corps apart over the final chords. It works in the beginning because the contrary motion mimics the building tension, but then as that dissipates, it's just a dash from side 1 to 2 and 2 to 1 in an expanded form, followed by what feels like a 64 count hold in that expanded form. Not that there is some magic formula to follow - but, when I hear that type of building tension, ala final moments of Harmonic Journey, I want the corps tighten up, bring the sound in, make me fear for the amount of motion circulating about, and then use part of the resolve to add some body detail, and voila - all done. Even if there isn't a wedge - i'd advocate for bringing it together in the final moments - having the corps in the boundaries of the props and the brass together in...something...would also help solidify the ultimate message in the theme, as well - I think. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
college-phan Posted July 28, 2022 Author Share Posted July 28, 2022 (edited) Nice little interview here! Edited July 28, 2022 by college-phan 3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kdaddy Posted July 28, 2022 Share Posted July 28, 2022 22 minutes ago, college-phan said: Nice little interview here! Poised and articulate - really impressed! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldSnareDrummer Posted July 28, 2022 Share Posted July 28, 2022 9 minutes ago, kdaddy said: Poised and articulate - really impressed! First class. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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