Paraphrased Thoughts on "Judging" from a newly minted 5-year Age Out

[greg_orangecounty]

18 hours ago, Jeff Ream said:

how did they get cleaner? 

 

By practicing.  In our case 12-hour days and having Bobby Hoffman screaming in your ear helped too.

[greg_orangecounty]

19 hours ago, Jeff Ream said:

no the tic system didn't. the same corps were often at the top just because.

I don't believe that to be true as 9 different corps finished in the top three during the first 10 years of DCI under the tic system vs. 7 different corps the last 10 years.

[GUARDLING]

3 hours ago, MikeD said:

The tick system worked when drum corps was a much simpler activity. Drumline elevator drills up and down the 50, for example. Squad moves and more linear drills. More vertical arrangements. No front ensembles. Etc....

The impetus to change it to eventually #### we have today came as drum corps expanded beyond the old model of shows and design. Mallets and timpani, even marching versions, were not able to be completely judged using the tick system, as one example. 

 

 

Amen!...and talk about park and blow...lol..  remember even the concert number?...lol

Sometimes I look back and wonder how we even broke a sweat...lol..but we did

[GUARDLING]

1 hour ago, Jeff Ream said:

no, but i grew up around it, and have talked to folks in all areas of the game during those days. judge bias was far more prevalent then, and sheets didnt match from circuit to circuit if they even had a sheet beyond something to mark tics on.

I did march, teach and judged under that and other systems and what you say is more than true,

[WilsonStaff]

3 hours ago, Jeff Ream said:

no, but i grew up around it, and have talked to folks in all areas of the game during those days. judge bias was far more prevalent then, and sheets didnt match from circuit to circuit if they even had a sheet beyond something to mark tics on.

Bias more or less prevalent is a matter of opinion. Even in the years following the tic system the sheets didn't match from circuit to circuit. East vs Midwest vs West vs South.  Today's scoring is just as biased in my opinion. 

Growing up around it and talking with folks in the game does not weight your opinion more than the others you are replying with, yet it does not stop matters of opinions stated as facts. 

[WilsonStaff]

2 hours ago, greg_orangecounty said:

I don't believe that to be true as 9 different corps finished in the top three during the first 10 years of DCI under the tic system vs. 7 different corps the last 10 years.

I agree with you. 

[MikeD]

11 hours ago, WilsonStaff said:

Did you march during the tic system? 

I did, my entire career, from 64-72. I also judged under the tic system, primarily in the Garden State Circuit, from 76-80'ish.  That is how I was trained in the beginning of my judging career. I judged band shows from 1978 to around 2005. The last drum corps I judged was a couple of DCA shows in 1990.

[Boss Anova]

5 hours ago, BigW said:

I took five semesters of Voice Classes/Private lessons, and had to sing in three different choirs for five total semesters to meet requirements for my B.S. Mus.Ed. I also had to take a course in Choral Conducting. I had to pass/fail a vocal competency test that might scare some people. (One part... here's the first note, Sight read this tune acapella and we'll find out how much you drifted off key) I have experience conducting Elementary, Middle School, and High School Choruses. I'd venture most judges have come through a similar curriculum or have more than that at the DCI level.

 

As for guitar, I had to pass/fail a minimum Guitar competency test. I'm no shredder but I have an appreciation and respect for the instrument.

 

I had to take at least four semesters of Piano classes/Piano lessons and pass/fail a pretty involved competency test for that as well.

 

And this... from a Euphonium Major. My corps experience was quite valuable, by the way. Trying to keep tonal centers on a G Bugle and singing a lot of passages together in rehearsals were a huge help.

 

The crux of this is, good musicianship is good musicianship. Musicality is still musicality whether or not it's on the Judge's Major instrument of specialty. When those things take place at a top end level, it slaps you in the face as to how good it is. The real issue is at the DCI level where splitting of sub-atomic particles is the norm. 

Well I’ll be darned . You convinced me . I had no idea that most music education degrees required courses in these . My degrees are not in music . So I’m ok now with judges judging voice and guitar as they have more training in this than I had originally thought . 

[WilsonStaff]

20 minutes ago, MikeD said:

I did, my entire career, from 64-72. I also judged under the tic system, primarily in the Garden State Circuit, from 76-80'ish.  That is how I was trained in the beginning of my judging career. I judged band shows from 1978 to around 2005. The last drum corps I judged was a couple of DCA shows in 1990.

Your opinions are the exact same as Jeff Ream? 

[Jeff Ream]

4 hours ago, greg_orangecounty said:

I don't believe that to be true as 9 different corps finished in the top three during the first 10 years of DCI under the tic system vs. 7 different corps the last 10 years.

it was never full tick. you had the GE blend.

 

but 72-82 you saw in time the power group form: BD, SCV, Phantom, Madison...to a smaller degree 27th and Bridgemen. 77-79 top 3 BD, SCV, Phantom. SCV fell out in 80, boom 81. BD wins 76, 77, 79, 80, 82. by 75, most of the major shuffling was done