Chief Guns Posted July 21, 2023 Share Posted July 21, 2023 (edited) 6 hours ago, Vuitton said: Yeah, and even that "scores don't matter" BS that has always been spouted from the Scouts wasn't true. In '88 when we got 4th at DeKalb everyone was upset. There are still brothers who think we should have been 4th in '89, which I give a HUGE LOL to. We deserved 7th. So scores have always mattered, at least to a degree. Regarding scores don't matter.......100% agree with you. The thing I always found funny was a corps would perform........fanbase says "We are so happy our corps doesn't do this for scores and placements, they do it for the fans." Three hours later, when scores and placements are announced, those same people are burning the corps show thread down over what................scores and placements LMAO. Edited July 22, 2023 by Chief Guns 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vuitton Posted July 21, 2023 Share Posted July 21, 2023 (edited) 4 minutes ago, Chief Guns said: Regarding scores don't matter.......100% agree with you. The thing I always found funny was a corps would perform........fanbase says "We are so happy our corps doesn't do this scores and placements, they do it for the fans." Three hours later, when scores and placements are announced, those same people are burning the corps show thread down over what................scores and placements LMAO. That's right. It's a competitive activity. When I was in the Jr. Scouts, I would go in the back yard with my flag and pretend I was the Spirit of Atlanta or Scouts and I'd do flag work and then a retreat and we'd win DCI. I think whether you think it's realistic or not anyone who marches would love to achieve that. And believe me, nothing put us in a collective foul mood than losing to Regiment, Star or Cavies. It didn't last long, but it still sucked. In '88 at Morgantown it was the only time we saw Garfield before Kansas City. We were in the stands for their performance and as the show went on the mood of the vets got worse and worse and I heard mumblings about how they were destroying us and we were going to be 5 points behind. We actually lost by a tenth. I didn't think we realized at that point how good we were, and if scores didn't matter would wouldn't have been crying like babies when we won and celebrating later that night. Edited July 21, 2023 by Vuitton 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keystone3ply Posted July 21, 2023 Share Posted July 21, 2023 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gantang Posted July 21, 2023 Share Posted July 21, 2023 1 hour ago, Mad Mello said: ... when 6th was the worst case scenario. Yep, and the members who placed lower than the year before felt they had let down their older brothers. Being a perenial top tier corps was expected. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hrothgar15 Posted July 21, 2023 Share Posted July 21, 2023 Man, I remember a topic on here almost 18 years ago to the day when it started to become clear they’d place no higher than 5th that was called something like “Madison Scouts — out of gas, down for the count” 😕 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scout9193 Posted July 21, 2023 Share Posted July 21, 2023 (edited) 2 hours ago, Vuitton said: Yeah, and even that "scores don't matter" BS that has always been spouted from the Scouts wasn't true. In '88 when we got 4th at DeKalb everyone was upset. There are still brothers who think we should have been 4th in '89, which I give a HUGE LOL to. We deserved 7th. So scores have always mattered, at least to a degree. Wasn't it around 1988 that Scott's opinion on the judging being fickle/corrupt/not worth paying close attention to really started to come into sharper focus? I know I heard some of that talk in '91 and even more in '93 but I believe this had been a few years in the making by that time. I do specifically remember hearing in 1995 that the staff sent several foreign members to critique one night instructing them to basically say nothing except "box 4 no, box 5". While humorous at the time, I would think things like this really left a bad taste in the judging community's "mouth" so when the talent did start to drop there was no benefit of the doubt offered. Even in 1991 we had members (power vets from the late 80's) who remembered beating corps like Phantom, Star, Cavies on at least a semi consistent basis. In fact, I remember the only time we beat Star in '91 on first tour. I had a 5 year power vet behind me in retreat who kept muttering under his breath "f**k yeah!" There was no hatred but a competitive desire and acknowledgement that competitive success lent itself to long term financial & organizational success. I can't tell you how many times in 93 someone would ask, "what time is it?" to which the answer was always "time to stop losing to Phantom in horns". All this to say that victors are the ones who write history. If the activity is crooked, you can only change it successfully engaging with the powers that be to the point of having the equity TO change it. I always felt the head in the sand approach/ laissez faire attitude during that time about the competitive aspect of the activity was a bad idea. This, to me, is a huge reason for what we have now. Edited July 21, 2023 by scout9193 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vuitton Posted July 21, 2023 Share Posted July 21, 2023 2 hours ago, scout9193 said: In fact, I remember the only time we beat Star in '91 on first tour. Yep. That was amazing, considering Star was the leader. I hated their show in '91 now it is one of my most favorites. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueStainGlass Posted July 21, 2023 Share Posted July 21, 2023 5 hours ago, Cappybara said: I am clearly in the minority on this forum, but I think this show and Madison's performance is better than what they're getting credit for. I personally think the gap between Madison and PC is absurd, but I guess that's why I'm not a judge. Get rid of the cat toy and I think more people are on board. It's an eyesore and does literally nothing for the show. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KVG_DC Posted July 22, 2023 Share Posted July 22, 2023 1 hour ago, BlueStainGlass said: Get rid of the cat toy and I think more people are on board. It's an eyesore and does literally nothing for the show. I'll take it! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swmstom1998 Posted July 22, 2023 Share Posted July 22, 2023 When I marched Scouts in the 90s, there was certainly the “scores don’t matter” talk, but my memory was it being from staff to the members as “control what you can control, and that’s your individual performance, let us worry about the other”. We were nip and tuck with Bluecoats and we didn’t enjoy it the night’s they topped us. We were elated we beat them in Finals. We were also happy when we topped SCV in a show. Scott also pushed the idea of enjoying the summer…having off days, relaxing after shows while others did basic block in the lot. But deep down, yea, we all understood the competitive side of it. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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