Lucas Oil Stadium Director Discusses 'Sound Ideas'

[comraderoger]

You people realize you're talking about a football stadium, right?

Allow me to repeat: FOOTBALL STADIUM

LOS isn't Carnegie Hall, never will be, so there is really nothing you can do about the sound that is produced inside.

No football stadium on the planet is going to be a suitable venue for a drum corps show, period. Sure, there may be better places than others but as long as DCI puts its activity on a football field, people are just going to have to deal with all the issues inherent in trying to use a space designed primarily for one activity, football, to view another activity, drum corps.

If you really want a high quality performance space for drum corps, build it. Fund raise the money and build a purpose built venue. That's the only way to get concert quality sound. Until that happens, accept the limitations that all FOOTBALL stadiums have for this activity.

[JimF-LowBari]

1) We can hang a LOT more curtains

Having problems linking to DCI site. Has LOS said what they will allow DCI to do? Really a moot point if DCI decides what needs to be done and LOS sez "NO!!!".

2) LOS does not believe the acoustics can be satisfactorily improved without changes to the sounds corps themselves produce. Interestingly enough this is stressed as the most important factor by Fox.

Yeah, just crank any amps to 11+ and the deafness of the audience will compensate for any echo. Have heard it a few times at a hockey size indoor arena.

[boxingfred]

Maybe, If all the brass player hang a little curtain over the bells of their horns...

[Bob984]

You people realize you're talking about a football stadium, right?

Allow me to repeat: FOOTBALL STADIUM

LOS isn't Carnegie Hall, never will be, so there is really nothing you can do about the sound that is produced inside.

No football stadium on the planet is going to be a suitable venue for a drum corps show, period. Sure, there may be better places than others but as long as DCI puts its activity on a football field, people are just going to have to deal with all the issues inherent in trying to use a space designed primarily for one activity, football, to view another activity, drum corps.

If you really want a high quality performance space for drum corps, build it. Fund raise the money and build a purpose built venue. That's the only way to get concert quality sound. Until that happens, accept the limitations that all FOOTBALL stadiums have for this activity.

You must be joking......."no football stadium on the planet is going to be a suitable venue for a drum corps show, period" ???????? The last that I checked, drum corps have been performing in football stadiums for about a billion years now, and that is what their sound is geared for. For me, many of those stadiums sounded good or great in terms of the quality of sound for major corps. Yes, it may be fun to put 70 horns and a full drumline inside Carnegie Hall, but I don't think that the sound is intended for there. Just 50 miles down the road, IU stadium sounded just fine for drum corps.

You are implying that all football stadiums sound bad for drum corps....wow, if you have followed this activity, you must be really disappointed......

the only key word that you have correct, but don't emphasize, is "INSIDE". That is the problem....the stadium is completely enclosed, and also the shape, structure, and amount of reflective surface cause extreme problems.

Drum corps is NOT designed as an indoor performing venue, but for OUTDOOR FOOTBALL FIELDS/STADIUMS.

GB

[Rusty]

You people realize you're talking about a football stadium, right?

Allow me to repeat: FOOTBALL STADIUM

LOS isn't Carnegie Hall, never will be, so there is really nothing you can do about the sound that is produced inside.

No football stadium on the planet is going to be a suitable venue for a drum corps show, period.

Three words: Camp Randall Stadium.

I agree that no stadium on the planet will produce "concert-quality" acoustics. But unless I'm very much mistaken, nobody has seriously made that request. All they want is to be able to listen to the show without three or four waves of reverb, which seems to be the problem here but hasn't been the problem at other venues, even domed stadiums (Alamodome).

[Rusty]

I read both the article on the LOS stadium director and the snips from the article quoting the judges (does anybody have a link?). A few thoughts:

• First, as a PR/web communications guy, I gotta say DCI may have flubbed it with the article from the judges. The way it seems to be interpreted is that they're trotting the judges out to set things straight with the unwashed masses - see? this venue really is outstanding!
  
• But! It does sound like DCI really is aware that the acoustics issue at LOS is a problem and that they're trying to address it. Quoth Lord Acheson:
  

“We know that the corps and everyone who supports them are very passionate about the quality of every aspect of the World Championships experience, and so are we,” said Acheson. “Improving the quality of the sound within the stadium is a critical issue and an urgent priority for us. We will continue to work together with Mike Fox and his team to address concerns and to ensure that we are creating an unparalleled performance venue for corps members, and an exceptional environment for those purchasing tickets to these events.

To that end, a couple of humble recommendations:

• As described in the stadium director article, LOS had a dry run of sorts with Kenny Chesney - he played a concert in 2008, they learned some lessons, made some adjustments, and he (or rather, the audience) had a much better experience in 2009. So do the same for drum corps. Hold a sort of exhibition Preview of Champions at LOS in late June 2010. Bring everybody - and I mean everybody (World Class and Open Class) - out. Sell heavily discounted tickets to get people in the seats and keep the costs low. (Like I said, it's an exhibition - no adjudication to be present = no judges to compensate.) Several hours' worth of shows should give the acoustic engineers plenty of opportunity to take whatever measurements they need ahead of the big show in August.
  
• DCI needs to mend fences. Acheson, sit down and write a first-person column for DCI to apologize to the fans whose drum corps experience was adversely affected by the acoustic issues with the stadium, and go on to describe in some detail what steps DCI is taking to address the problem.
  

Side note: I didn't go to finals this summer. Might go next summer, depending on how all this plays out.

[comraderoger]

Camp Randall is a great stadium. I've been to finals there several times and enjoyed it. I also had no major issues with LOS either. I found both the Alamodome and Georgia Dome to be quite bad in comparison. And, some of the podunk HS stadiums this summer weren't so great either.

Compared to the RCA Dome, LOS is much, much better, that's for sure. Is it perfect, hardly. Is it the worst stadium I've been in, hardly. That 'honor' goes to the Patriots stadium back in the day.

Corps are going to have to do what BOA HS bands have been doing for years and that is design for the space where finals will be held. It will require a shift in thinking, sure, but nothing that can't be overcome.

And for those of you so displeased with the sound of LOS, don't go. It's that simple. There are plenty of other venues that are quite nice for drum corps like J. Birney Crum in Allentown, Mile High in Denver, Stanford in Palto Alto, CA to name three. No one is forcing you to attend finals, especially since it seems to have been so unpleasant.

The mere fact that LOS is working with DCI, and I presume ISSMA and BOA, to try to fix some of the issues is a good thing, no a great thing. Indianapolis is bending over backwards to help the situation and to market the event and to make DCI finals an enjoyable experience all around. When was the last time a venue and city worked so hard to get and to keep DCI finals?

As for the roof not being open, blame the corps, not DCI. They were the ones that didn't want to the roof open in the event that the roof would have to be closed due to rain. The corps were the ones that wanted the sound to be the same for all performances because, yes, obviously, the sound would change between open and closed roof.

[fecontra]

Camp Randall is a great stadium. I've been to finals there several times and enjoyed it. I also had no major issues with LOS either. I found both the Alamodome and Georgia Dome to be quite bad in comparison. And, some of the podunk HS stadiums this summer weren't so great either.

Compared to the RCA Dome, LOS is much, much better, that's for sure. Is it perfect, hardly. Is it the worst stadium I've been in, hardly. That 'honor' goes to the Patriots stadium back in the day.

Corps are going to have to do what BOA HS bands have been doing for years and that is design for the space where finals will be held. It will require a shift in thinking, sure, but nothing that can't be overcome.

And for those of you so displeased with the sound of LOS, don't go. It's that simple. There are plenty of other venues that are quite nice for drum corps like J. Birney Crum in Allentown, Mile High in Denver, Stanford in Palto Alto, CA to name three. No one is forcing you to attend finals, especially since it seems to have been so unpleasant.

The mere fact that LOS is working with DCI, and I presume ISSMA and BOA, to try to fix some of the issues is a good thing, no a great thing. Indianapolis is bending over backwards to help the situation and to market the event and to make DCI finals an enjoyable experience all around. When was the last time a venue and city worked so hard to get and to keep DCI finals?

As for the roof not being open, blame the corps, not DCI. They were the ones that didn't want to the roof open in the event that the roof would have to be closed due to rain. The corps were the ones that wanted the sound to be the same for all performances because, yes, obviously, the sound would change between open and closed roof.

IMHO you opened this ID to further hype and promote the PR DCI is spewing about.

Never once is " Opening the Roof " being discussed as a solution - IMHO this is what DCI wants.

and by the way - Carnegie Hall was IMHO the worst venue ever for Drum Corps - buy an old Fleetwood album and hear for yourself.

AUDIO DB - thanks for allowing me to cut my rant short!

[cowtown]

More spin from DCI in order to pump up tickets sales – looks like the market has spoken about the product they delivered last year (and failed to deliver in 2008)

Why do they expect us to believe any of their ‘promises’ about LOS? They are 0/2 in that place and have blown some much false smoke up our backside already

More fabric = the pageantry worlds answer to everything

Not really sure how much more fabric they can put in that place – they do have to allow space for the corps to perform and keep enough space open that we can see them

I predict that the sound will still suck next year. Oh, it might not suck as hard as last year, that'd almost be impossible but it will still suck and make a mockery of this being a ‘musical event.' Soon, the shows will start to suck as they are tailored to the suckfest that is LOS. Think about that – to save an awful, embarrassing, finically stupid deal DCI will instead alter the nature of their shows

I’d still like to see a few people fired. I’d also like to see who they let go as they don’t need that extra staff searching for new venues - maybe we'll get another tour of their office to see what we sold Drum Crops out for

Still they have done nothing for the fans, the ones that had to drive through construction and state fair traffic for Bloomington or for the fans they lied to and ripped off in 2009 with their boasts of superior sound open roofs

Still waiting for the no rain-day defense

Here’s an idea, maybe they could offer those of us that have already been burnt by the place free, good tickets to try it out again.

I still feel they owe me something after the way they stole from me last year and so far all they’ve offered is that I don’t know how to listen through the echo and the judges think its fine, even if DCI does see it as an issue

And so continues the Great Drum and Bugle Corps Swindle

Edited December 22, 2009 by cowtown

[bawker]

You people realize you're talking about a football stadium, right?

Allow me to repeat: FOOTBALL STADIUM

LOS isn't Carnegie Hall, never will be, so there is really nothing you can do about the sound that is produced inside.

If you really want a high quality performance space for drum corps, build it. Fund raise the money and build a purpose built venue. That's the only way to get concert quality sound. Until that happens, accept the limitations that all FOOTBALL stadiums have for this activity.

LOL.

Yes, it is a football stadium . . .and there have been some pretty ####### awesome acoustical environments at football stadiums along the way. I have the memories and the CDs to prove it.

. . .furthermore, you think people should spend money to build a stadium? Really?

Bloomington sounded good.

Denver sounded good.

Madison sounded good.

Hey, looks like we can save our pennies! Hooray!